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Brian_e Premium Member
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2025 1:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Heads Reply with quote

KitS wrote:
OK, how about the "Mini D" head from Brothers? Remember ing here that I am not looking for high RPM, low end torque is more important to me.


Too big. The round port 40x35, or the AA Stage 1 heads would be better. The stage 1 from AA are done by Brothers. I have had them on the flow bench, and they are far better than an unported head, but not as good as a Tims S1.

Like Dusty said......It would be handy if you told us more about what this thing is going in.

Brian
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KitS
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2025 4:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Heads Reply with quote

Off road, sand rail. Stock sedan swing axle. 29" X 10" rears or 30 X 15 paddles. Rarely hitting 4K RPM.

I have a set of heads that Brothers did for me. They are standard German 35.5 X 32, have had their combustion cambers blended and opened up to 58CC. The ports and passages were cleaned of all casting artifacts and smoothed out. The guides, springs, keepers and locks have all been replaced. A three angle valve job was done. They have the stock rockers but have had a solid rocker shaft kit from Empi installed. They were bored for 92mm thick wall cylinders.

All in all, a good chunk of change. I will buy another set of heads if needed but really want to get it right the second time if I do.

Help!

KitS
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Dusty1
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 29, 2025 7:45 am    Post subject: Re: Heads Reply with quote

KitS wrote:
I have a set of heads that Brothers did for me. They are standard German 35.5 X 32, have had their combustion cambers blended and opened up to 58CC.


I've been buying NOS heads, some Old School and some relatively new.

Starting with the peashooters, I haver a couple sets of 113 101 373Bs. Those are NOS German 1300 single ports. They're very closely related to the heads we run in Formula Vee. Compared to 77mm x 64mm in a Vee a 1300 is a stroker. Woo- Hoo!

Gathered up a couple pairs of 040 casting single ports. We might find the 040 prefix on single ports or dual ports. Compared to a "by the book" Formula Vee a 1600 single port is a heck of a "cheater" motor.

At least one set of 040 single ports is going on an old school "race gas" Class 5 1600 desert motor.


Then we get into the fun stuff. I like old school 041s. The state of the art has moved on. I remember when 041s were all the rage.

I believe the 042 prefix is an aftermarket part number.

Which brings us to 043s. Those are VW's attempt at a head that will take the heat. The good ones as far as I'm concerned came with TRW stainless steel valves with 9mm stems on the exhaust valves. Real 043 castings came with 3/4" reach spark plugs.

I'm pretty sure Autolinea ended up with the 043 molds right around the time they totally forgot how to make clean die cast aluminum parts. To my experience the Autolinea GO1, GO2 and GO3 castings are sloppier than similar parts that bore the VW logo.

Got a nice set of round port CB 044s. Near as I can tell CB holds Autolinea to a higher standard on their castings. CB Performance puts quite a bit of work into making good lookin' heads.

CB Performance owns CNC machinery and more to the point they own the CNC program that yields consistent mass production heads. My personal preference is CB's CNC machined Autolinea castings otherwise known as 044s or Panchitos.


My new nickname is gonna be "Smurfy". I'm holding my breath and turning
blue waiting for Brian e to get enough Revmasters to go around.


KitS:

If you have a set of Brothers massaged German heads, run 'em. Near as I can tell your formula is a tube framed buggy (likely lightweight), 78mm x 90.5mm 2 liter, 29" tall tires and a 4.37 diff. Practical redline is 4000rpm. There may be more in it but you probably won't go there.

Your Brothers heads will likely make your buggy an off road rocket sled. You be Wile E. Coyote about to light an Acme rocket. Cool

Improving over your Brothers heads will cost close to another $1000 when the dust settles for "premium" heads. Obvious choices would be Panchitos or Greg Tims'. You would get the bragging rights of a motor that makes more high rpm power.

Inexpensive big valve heads come with cheapo valves and cheapo springs. It's perpetual motion attempting to make the cheap stuff good.

Spending other people's money is way more fun than spending our own.


I'm gathering parts for a motor similar to yours. I'm going 74mm x 90.5mm built on a new Motorav case. That's 1905cc. I'm going to keep the cam conservative, the idea being to be able to turn it up with ratio rockers. It's going to be an adventure indexing the rockers (various brands) so I know what I have for actual lift. I'm going to slap an NOS set of German heads on it for a baseline. Like I said, I have a few heads. They're not difficult to change.


The part the "big valve" head guys don't mention:

Like I said, Volkswagen designed the 043s to take the heat. I hear the big valve head guys touting their horsepower numbers. Will those motors still be makin' power at 50,000 miles?

First place stock VW heads crack is valve seat to valve seat. That area gets thin to non- existent when we machine for oversized seats.

I've never seen a stock VW head drop a seat. It may happen. I've never seen it.

.
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KitS
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 29, 2025 8:20 am    Post subject: Re: Heads Reply with quote

Thanks for that Smurfy, I've been leaning that way. I guess it's always easy to pull the motor and swap the heads later. You were quite close in your estimate: it's a 76 X 92 engine with a W110 cam. The car is a tubular framed sand rail, never weighed it, but I'd guess less than 1200 pounds.

The engine in it now is a 1600 (or so I was told when I bought it) that is getting tired, oil pressure light comes on at idle when warm and pressure drops to under 10psi. It has a lot of leaks. But it still runs and pushes the car quite well.

This 2 litre build I am doing is a ground up. All new parts except the case, head castings, rockers and some of the valves. It's at short block stage now. I'll probably take it to long block today.

The case came to me thru Brothers, I had taken a case to them to work and it turned out to have cracks. So they sourced another for me and worked it to my specs. I can't say enough good about them, they do superior work and go the distance to help their customers.

KitS
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Teeroy Premium Member
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 30, 2025 10:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Heads Reply with quote

For a smaller engine you will make more torque with small valve heads over big valve heads. I just proved this on my 1776 Friday. Same engine, same car, same dyno different heads. Went from Berg P&P big valve heads 81whp 93 ft lbs torque, to Tims Super Stock P&P small valve heads 89 whp (did not expect this increase) and 100 ft lbs torque (expected this increase).
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modok
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2025 12:55 am    Post subject: Re: Heads Reply with quote

NICE result!

DUSTY....
The mexican 043H heads had smaller ports which almost look like somebody used a flow bench finally, (no spring bump in intake port)
They were......I assume replacement heads for mexican taxis Wink
Some had 3/4 reach plugs, others had 1/2 reach, some had small valves some had regular valves, some had big valves.
The spark plugs and valve sizes were whatever they put in the raw casting when ordered for sale to OUR market.
popular 10-20 years ago, when people speak of 043 heads they mean the mexican 043H

but not all heads with 043 casting number are the same, there are many, probably 10 different kinds. Different plants in different countries. There are even things like mexican 311 heads, i have a pair now.

Autolinea is in brazil, vw of mexico was in mexico, I doubt they are the same molds shared between countries, the molds are probably all worn out anyway, but these days it's not hard to copy things. I could be wrong. who knows what happens down there.
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Brian_e Premium Member
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2025 8:52 am    Post subject: Re: Heads Reply with quote

Another thing to add is the last few castings usually go the small chamber, and the .055" step. This really causes all kinds of problems when trying to re-use old heads on larger engines. Once you get rid of the step, you end up with a 48cc chamber. This really sucks when you are trying to use the heads on a 1904cc bus engine.

You can hog the chambers to add volume till you are blue in the face, and all you will end up with is sore hands and a really crappy semi-hemi chamber.

This is why the newer casting heads like aa500 are great. They used to come with a 61cc, no-step chamber so you had all kinds of options. They recently switched to the stock valve aa500 only come with a 54cc chamber, which is still lots of room to work on bigger engines, while still keeping a nice tight deck height.

Brian
_________________
So more or less the lazier and stupider you want to be, the nicer quality parts you need to buy.
-Modok

Narrowed beams, Drop adjustable spring plates, Bus disk brake and IRS kits.
www.type-emotorsports.com

Type E Engine Parts and Supplies
https://type-emotorsports.com/collections/engine-parts
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