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paleale
Samba Member
Joined: October 04, 2004
Posts: 54
Location: Middletown, MD
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 Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 5:38 am Post subject: RIP my BUG :0( !!fire!! |
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I just got back into town Saturday night. Got up Sunday morning made some coffee and went out to do a tune up on him. Every thing went well and got a few things done that I have not had a chance to do so I was feeling good.
Me and the family went and did some running around in the Bug filled up the gas tank. We stop at the store and loaded every thing into the front. We got going down the street and (this all toke place in a matter of 30 sec.'s) smelled gas then a thump (thought the kids did something) next the car started to get filled up with smoke pulled over to the side of the street and hoped out and flames where coming out of the back!!
We got the kids out and the fire started to go through the car. I LOVED that car!!
I got it out back right now and will start to pull some good parts off of it for my next 1970 Bug or my sell or trade some to get parts for my Bus.
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I have a 1969 Bus. |
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Glenn 
Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001
Posts: 79494
Location: Sneaking up behind you
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| Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 5:44 am Post subject: |
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Same old story.
Sorry about the car, but the kids are the most important.
How old were the fuel hoses?
How old was the fuel filter?
Were there clamps on the hoses?
Did you have a fire extingushier?
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Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
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עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי |
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paleale
Samba Member
Joined: October 04, 2004
Posts: 54
Location: Middletown, MD
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| Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 6:14 am Post subject: |
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I just went over the fuel lines and every thing was good it I thought. I even checked the clamps on the lines.
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I have a 1969 Bus. |
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Cobey
Samba Member
Joined: March 31, 2004
Posts: 2022
Location: Lost in NorCal Space
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| Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 6:23 am Post subject: |
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Wow, sorry to hear about the loss of your bug. Better it than your family though.
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(0)(=|=)(0) 68 Ghia Vert - Gina
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Delaware Dave
Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2003
Posts: 359
Location: Delaware, USA
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| Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 6:29 am Post subject: |
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| paleale wrote: |
| I just went over the fuel lines and every thing was good it I thought. I even checked the clamps on the lines. |
Can you tell if the fuel line slipped off from the carb or the pump? Did you have the fuel filter located in the engine compartment?
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\X/ Delaware Dave
'71 Standard Beetle Project
'69 Type 3 fastback (sold), '65 Standard Beetle (sold),
'05 Passat 1.8 Turbo, '97 Jetta Tdi (sold) |
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FrankieD
Samba Member
Joined: April 19, 2003
Posts: 125
Location: Belleville, IL
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| Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 6:51 am Post subject: |
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I hate to hear stories like this. Seems many are avoidable with regular maintenance and up keep but as with your case having just inspected the fuel lines and clamps is no guarantee.
I’m restoring my wife’s 72 SB and the though of having the kids strapped in the backseat with a rapid fire like yours scares the heck out of me. I’m thinking I might install a fire suppression system in the engine compartment. I’ll have to do some research but I’m thinking about putting a fair sized fire extinguisher upfront and run some tubing to the engine compartment so I can squeeze off the fire retardant from the front seat and hopefully put the fire out or suppress it enough to get everyone out safe.
Has anyone done or seen something like this?
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Delaware Dave
Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2003
Posts: 359
Location: Delaware, USA
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| Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 8:42 am Post subject: |
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| FrankieD wrote: |
I hate to hear stories like this. Seems many are avoidable with regular maintenance and up keep but as with your case having just inspected the fuel lines and clamps is no guarantee.
I’m restoring my wife’s 72 SB and the though of having the kids strapped in the backseat with a rapid fire like yours scares the heck out of me. I’m thinking I might install a fire suppression system in the engine compartment. I’ll have to do some research but I’m thinking about putting a fair sized fire extinguisher upfront and run some tubing to the engine compartment so I can squeeze off the fire retardant from the front seat and hopefully put the fire out or suppress it enough to get everyone out safe.
Has anyone done or seen something like this? |
A tube like that could just route smoke and fumes to the cabin in an emergency.
Better to have the extinguisher back in the engine compartment, with a pull cable or an electric, switched, connection to the bottle. Either way, it could also be rigged so that it breaks the connection to the electric cutoff solenoid on the carb, stopping the engine immediately, lessening the amount of fuel involved in the fire.
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\X/ Delaware Dave
'71 Standard Beetle Project
'69 Type 3 fastback (sold), '65 Standard Beetle (sold),
'05 Passat 1.8 Turbo, '97 Jetta Tdi (sold) |
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MedicTed
Samba Member
Joined: August 12, 2005
Posts: 2110
Location: King of Prussia, PA
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| Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 8:59 am Post subject: |
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'm thinking of a system similar to the under exhaust hood systems used by resturants. If you had the extinguisher bottle in the trunk or other location and routed the flow line to the engine compartment, I would think that it would work. Here is a MSDS for magnesium. It will give you the facts and best extinguishing agents. Also a fuel/electric cut off would be a great idea. If you design such a system and it could be produced economically, you could probably sell it for installation.
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Ted Wojton
70 VW Bus Westfalia camper
2003 GMC Sierra |
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pandanom
Samba Member
Joined: March 16, 2005
Posts: 1166
Location: Lexington, S.C.
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| Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 5:42 pm Post subject: |
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Ted, you would need a fire detection system to alert you of a fire and a fire extinguishing system armed and activated from the drivers seat to put out the fire. The cost would be prohibitive.
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It is never too late to have a happy childhood! |
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pandanom
Samba Member
Joined: March 16, 2005
Posts: 1166
Location: Lexington, S.C.
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| Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 5:42 pm Post subject: |
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Ted, you would need a fire detection system to alert you of a fire and a fire extinguishing system armed and activated from the drivers seat to put out the fire. The cost would be prohibitive.
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ottobahn
Samba Member
Joined: September 22, 2003
Posts: 430
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| Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 7:56 pm Post subject: |
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| paleale,did you have a fuel filter in the engine compartment? |
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Pinky
Samba Ass Bandit
Joined: December 31, 2003
Posts: 554
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| Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 10:31 pm Post subject: |
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| class D extinguisher for combustible metals- pretty pricey but worth it (most fire & rescue vehicles don't carry one) |
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paleale
Samba Member
Joined: October 04, 2004
Posts: 54
Location: Middletown, MD
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| Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 6:13 am Post subject: |
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Yes there was a fuel filter in the engine compartment. It was a plactic type with about 300 miles on it.
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I have a 1969 Bus. |
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psnider
Samba Member
Joined: June 21, 2005
Posts: 112
Location: Alabama
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| Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:41 am Post subject: bug fire |
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All this talk about fires have me concerned. MY fuel filter is in the engine compartment also. Where else can you put it safely?
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quattlebum
Samba Member
Joined: February 06, 2005
Posts: 585
Location: Sacramento,CA
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| Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:54 am Post subject: |
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| Put it under your gas tank.... Never put the fuel filter in the engine compartment... |
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pandanom
Samba Member
Joined: March 16, 2005
Posts: 1166
Location: Lexington, S.C.
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| Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:54 am Post subject: |
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I removed mine immediately after the last fire that vw girl had and lost her car. Have not reinstalled yet. Will get a metal filter.
Today I will check closely where the metal line passes thru the firewall, may be chaffed. I plan to install a bulkhead fitting there before the fire.
A couple of posts back there is a link for an artivle worth printing and using as a checklist.
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Delaware Dave
Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2003
Posts: 359
Location: Delaware, USA
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| Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 8:15 am Post subject: Re: bug fire |
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| psnider wrote: |
| All this talk about fires have me concerned. MY fuel filter is in the engine compartment also. Where else can you put it safely? |
The quick answer is under the fuel tank, in the line between the tank and the metal line that enters the pan. It's accessable by unbolting and lifting the tank. When you replace the line and add the filter, make sure you're about empty on the tank when you do this, unless you like using gas as aftershave.
You can still get the real, fabric braided fuel line, that's the best. For a carb engine, the stock size was 5mm internal diameter. 7mm for fuelies. I always opt for the metric because it's a better fit. Use good quality hose clamps on the fuel lines at all connection points.
There are three more sections of rubber fuel line that should be checked. One is between the metal line in the pan and the engine firewall (in the left rear axle area). Check the grommet going into the firewall too, a bad one can be a cause of wear on the metal line. The next are inside the engine compartment. One is from the metal supply line to the fuel pump, and the last is from the pump to the carb (where many fuel filters are currently located).
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\X/ Delaware Dave
'71 Standard Beetle Project
'69 Type 3 fastback (sold), '65 Standard Beetle (sold),
'05 Passat 1.8 Turbo, '97 Jetta Tdi (sold) |
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MedicTed
Samba Member
Joined: August 12, 2005
Posts: 2110
Location: King of Prussia, PA
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| Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 9:03 am Post subject: |
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| pandanom wrote: |
| Ted, you would need a fire detection system to alert you of a fire and a fire extinguishing system armed and activated from the drivers seat to put out the fire. The cost would be prohibitive. |
You would not necessarily need a detection system. You could just fire it, if and when you realized a fire. As far as armed and firing from the driver's seat, I agree that would be the way to go. It could be done with a solonoid and a protected switch. I think I'll start working on a design, just to see what it might actually cost.
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Ted Wojton
70 VW Bus Westfalia camper
2003 GMC Sierra |
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ottobahn
Samba Member
Joined: September 22, 2003
Posts: 430
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| Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2005 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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| I moved my filter to the line under the trannie before it goes up to the engine compartment,anyone else doing this? It seems safer under there than in the engine compartment if it were to leak. |
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68Bug-lite
Samba Member
Joined: July 31, 2005
Posts: 1087
Location: Tustin, CA
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| Posted: Wed Aug 31, 2005 3:35 am Post subject: |
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| My fuel filter is by the tranie as well. I figured it was alot safer than in the engine compartment, but easier to get to and change than under the fuel tank. I'm thinking of replacing the cheesy plastic filter for a more durable metal one in case of road debris. |
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