van will sputter but won't start

[ghar21]

ok i have had my van nonoperational for over a month now. i want to drive it so badly.

first - the injectors weren't shooting fuel, replaced the bad wiring in the wiring harness(cracked and stiff wire) and got fuel to spray.

second - changed the spark plugs(gapped) and now it sputters when i try and turn it over but will not start.

so i have spark and fuel in the combustion chamber but it won't start.


do i have the spark plug wires on wrong, is it not timed correctly?

help appreciated

-george

[msinabottle]

Bentley and Haynes.

Get the Bentley manual as quickly as you can--you can find them on E-Bay, retailers who support them sell them, make sure if you get a used one that it covers your particular variant.

The Haynes is more basic but quite accessible, and has a lovely troubleshooting guide. They have two versions, for air cooled and water cooled, make sure you get the right one, you'll have to go to a retailer who supports us for the water cooled version.

Good luck! And always mention what van and what motor in a post. Welcome to the Funny Farm!

Best!
_________________
'Winston,' '84 1.9 WBX Westy
Vanagon Poet Laureate: "I have suffered in
many ways, but never, never, never in silence."

[ghar21]

for as far as the van goes it's a 1981 vanagonL transporter. stock everything.
engine not sure. but what ever is stock. thats it.

i have a Bentley, and i am quite perplexed.

[tencentlife]

Wiring order doesn't matter with the injectors (they all spray simultaneously, so you can't connect them wrong), but it sure matters with the plugs.

I have an easy rule. If North is the front of the vehicle, the #1 diz rotor position is usually SE. As compass points the cylinder positions are #1 =NE, #2 = SE, #3 = NW, #4 = SW.

On the West side of the motor, the wires go straight from the diz to their cylinders, i.e. NW to NW, SW to SW.

On the East side, they cross, i.e. SE to NE, NE to SE.

In other words, on the left, the wires don't cross. On the right, they cross.

Check the order. This has to be the most common problem people have after tuning up a motor.

[Randy in Maine]

Make sure your battery is all charged up. You need about 10 volts minimum to get into the game.

Also you need 26 psi of fuel pressure to make it all happen. Got gauge?

[ghar21]

[ghar21]

[wbx]

Did you hook the AFM back up?
_________________
'84 Westy (first owner).......but my daily driver has pedals
My "perspective" mantra:
A Volkswagen Vanagon is just a material thing,
As such, it is of the earth,
And if i need to, I can let my Van go.

[tencentlife]

[ghar21]

k i tried the plugs but no luck. any idea which direction i should go in now? anyone know where i cant get or make a gauge for cheap?


-George

[bucko]

"Check the order. This has to be the most common problem people have after tuning up a motor."

I never did understand why folks don't replace the spark plug wires ONE AT A TIME to prevent putting the wires on wrong.....

As to fuel pressure, I doubt this is your problem, as you said the injectors are spraying. That should provide enough fuel to start the engine. I might only suggest that you check the other three cylinders injectors out to verify each cylinders injector. Perhaps one or more of the other 3 are not spraying. This rules them out as being a culprit. Any time you have a problem like this, it's easier to test each component that could be the problem, write down the result, and save it. Too many folks dive into a situation, only to find that they have half the engine apart to locate a problem. Go one step at a time.

If all 4 injectors are spraying fuel, I would then check the "static" timing. Do this by getting the crankshaft pulley timing mark at it's top dead center (TDC) position. Remove the distributor cap; the distributor rotor should be pointing at the number 1 cylinders spark plug terminal. If it is slightly off (by say a 1/4 inch), that would indicate some "advance/retard", which might be the case for your engine, as I believe your air cooled engine is a 2.0 liter, and would require a certain amount of advance or retard. The Bentley would provide how much advance is required for your engine.
If the rotor is way off from pointing to the number 1 spark plug tower, double check that the pulley is at TDC (if the rotor is pointing to the opposite side of cylinder 1, go around one more turn of the crankshaft pulley; this should get you at cylinder number 1). Now check for this alignment. If it is off, you need to loosen the distributor's clamp bolt (at it's base), and rotate the distributor housing to the left or right and get the rotor to line up to cylinder 1's spark plug tower. The distributor (with the cap off of course) usually has a "slash" cut into in the mounting area that the distributor cap rests on that indicates cylinder 1 position, and this helps you make this rotor "alignment" for static timing. This is good enough to get the engine started. Then you can use a timing light to set the timing once the engine running.

While the distributor cap is off, check the copper contacts that the rotor aligns with for pitting, and crud, as this can weaken the spark to the plugs.

Try this and report back. Basically ther are only 3 elements to getting a internal combustion engine to run; spark, fuel, and compression. If you have fuel, and spark (and it's not too advanced or retarded), then you check for weak cylinder compression. This could be valves not adjusted properly (valves are not closed when the cylinder reaches it's top dead position on it's compression stroke), bad rings (allowing compression to escape into the crankcase, or holes in the cylinder).

Did this engine run before all this started? If it was running, what was done mechanically on it right before it stopped?

Or perhaps you just bought it, and it was in this current state?
_________________
Current VW drives: 1984 Westfalia

Past VW drives: 1967 Beetle, 1973 Beetle, 1977 Bus, 1971 Military Type 181

[ghar21]

to answer your questions bucko.

The engine did run before. i bought from the PO and he said the clutch was bad. so we dropped the tranny. and i figured while we are at lets fix the slow oil leak. so we dropped the engine. replaced the valve cover gaskets(fixed leak!). changed the clutch(when we opened the pressure plate the clutch fell out in peaces, good sign) changed the clutch, oil, gear oil, oil filter, and fuel filter, fuel lines in engine compartment, and vacuum lines in engine compartment, spark plugs, coil, and diz cap(old one pitted on the center contact from the coil) attached the tranny back to the engine, hooked up the tranny to the pivot join, and swung the engine back in to position with a floor jack. went great. when we were putting the wiring harness back on it wouldn't spray fuel. looked at the wires from the injectors. they were all cracked and fried. so we replaced the lines one at a time(not the whole harness just the bad wire sections.) hooked it back up to the ecu and it was spraying fuel.(horray) so then we tried starting and this is where we are now.

So tonight i will check the 3 other injectors, and the static timing. i will post the results and hopefully i get it going.

Thanks Bucko

-George

[bucko]

Since the distributor wasn't removed in the previous work you did, it should be alright. Good to check anyway, as it may have gotten "bumped" to one side or the other when the engine was removed/installed.

You may still have some bad wiring. Since you disconnected the wiring connector to the ECU and various other sensors, I'd go back and check each and every one of them, looking for frayed, broken, and loose connections. Clean up all of the ground connections.

When you removed the valve covers to replace gaskets, did you do any valve adjustments? If you did, you may have one or more valves too tight, causing them to not close fully, and therefore you have low compression in one or more cylinders that you did valve adjustments on.
_________________
Current VW drives: 1984 Westfalia

Past VW drives: 1967 Beetle, 1973 Beetle, 1977 Bus, 1971 Military Type 181

[ghar21]

ok i think i have found the problem(s)

missing bushing on #3 fuel injector. it is back firing(only cylinder 3) when it sputters. (could this be why or is this cause by something else?)

the afm needle isn't moving when the key is being turned. or the when depressing the gas pedal. (troubleshoot some how?)