Hello! Log in or Register   |  Help  |  Donate  |  Buy Shirts  See all banner ads | Advertise on TheSamba.com  
TheSamba.com
 
Squealing, screeching, screaming brake help needed.
Page: 1, 2  Next
Forum Index -> Ghia Share: Facebook Twitter
Reply to topic
Print View
Quick sort: Show newest posts on top | Show oldest posts on top View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
///Mink
Samba Member


Joined: May 03, 2000
Posts: 5032
Location: Fair Oaks, CA
///Mink is offline 

PostPosted: Sun Mar 16, 2008 3:35 pm    Post subject: Squealing, screeching, screaming brake help needed. Reply with quote

I can't take this any more. I have done about a zillion brake jobs in my life and I have never had more difficulty than my '74 coupe is giving me. The brakes on this Ghia don't squeal, they scream. It's practically deafening. In my attempts to fix it, I've done the following:

1. Bought new organic pads from Napa.
2. Used blue Permatex disc brake quiet on the backs of the pads (and allowed it to dry overnight)
3. Removed the rotors and sanded the faces down to perfection with 40 grit discs on my DA.
4. Beveled the edges of the new pads with a file.
5. Bent the anti-rattle clips to have more tension.
6. Used caliper grease on the edges of the pads where they touch the caliper and on the clips, pins, etc.
7. Bedded the new pads in with a few high-speed stops with cool-downs in between.

After doing all of these things, I've actually made it worse! I feel sorry for people in other cars or on the sidewalk - it's that bad. Has anyone else had this much difficulty with them??
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
crocteau
Samba Member


Joined: March 31, 2005
Posts: 837
Location: Philaburbia
crocteau is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 4:17 am    Post subject: Re: Squealing, screeching, screaming brake help needed. Reply with quote

Tom, that's an impressive list of things you've tried. You know more about brakes than I do, but if your calipers/pistons are in good shape and aren't dragging then you might look into pads with a different composition. I suspect various compositions are available, since I read about the owner of a racing Ghia trying various pads to find the best composition for his application. Just some thoughts. Good luck.
Charley
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
poorpaul
Samba Member


Joined: March 17, 2008
Posts: 62
Location: Prairie Grove, Arkansas
poorpaul is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 6:13 am    Post subject: notching pads Reply with quote

Pretty frustrating for sure. One thing we used to do with Jag pads was to cut a groove across the pad material. Some folk put it across the length, some the width, and some made two diagonals about 20 degrees beginning from a point at the inner center. I've also seen some pads that had a piece of brass embedded into a similar groove.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Classifieds Feedback
70 140
Samba Member


Joined: September 22, 2002
Posts: 8468
Location: Ontario Canada
70 140 is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 6:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would guess it is the pad compound, try another pad that isn't made by the same manufacturer. I have had this problem with my Volvo, it is enough to make you insane - pulling the calipers and pads apart 25 times....
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
///Mink
Samba Member


Joined: May 03, 2000
Posts: 5032
Location: Fair Oaks, CA
///Mink is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 7:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, I'm currently on the second set of pads - the first were semi-metallic, the newest ones are organic. They both screeched like crazy. But if anyone has a particular brand of pad they've had luck with, I'm all ears.

Interesting idea about the groove. The new pads have a vertical groove pre-cut in them. Maybe I will try a diagonal one, too. What have I go to lose?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
'73spr-DUNG-btl
Samba Member


Joined: September 13, 2006
Posts: 249

'73spr-DUNG-btl is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 7:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm having the same troubles with my '74
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
brent bousman
Samba Member


Joined: January 28, 2005
Posts: 258
Location: Annandale VA
brent bousman is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 8:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I never had any luck with different types of aftermarket disc brake quiet.

Which calipers are you using? I have seen 2 different metal backs for ATE and Varga that fit between the pad and the piston. Are you using these?
_________________
Understeer is when you hit the wall with the front of the car. Oversteer is when you hit the wall with the rear of the car. Horsepower is how fast you hit the wall. Torque is how far you take the wall with you.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
///Mink
Samba Member


Joined: May 03, 2000
Posts: 5032
Location: Fair Oaks, CA
///Mink is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 8:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

brent bousman wrote:
I never had any luck with different types of aftermarket disc brake quiet.

Which calipers are you using? I have seen 2 different metal backs for ATE and Varga that fit between the pad and the piston. Are you using these?


I have the original '73.5 - '74 Girling calipers. No shims (and I don't think you could shim them - the pin doesn't pass through the pad).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
brent bousman
Samba Member


Joined: January 28, 2005
Posts: 258
Location: Annandale VA
brent bousman is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 8:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not familiar with the Girling calipers. The ATE has a metal plate that fits over part of the piston (held by the piston)and the Varga has a square metal piece that fits over the whole piston (held by a wire on the top of the pad). Do you know if the Girling had a stock plate behind the pad?

My guess is your squealing is your pad rubbing (vibrating) against the piston or the brake caliper somewhere.
_________________
Understeer is when you hit the wall with the front of the car. Oversteer is when you hit the wall with the rear of the car. Horsepower is how fast you hit the wall. Torque is how far you take the wall with you.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
70 140
Samba Member


Joined: September 22, 2002
Posts: 8468
Location: Ontario Canada
70 140 is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 8:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The new Varga calipers come with pads and are $70-ish a side....

I don't know what else you would try Tom; switched pads, resurfaced rotors, adhesives, etc, etc... sounds like you have tried all the tricks.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
///Mink
Samba Member


Joined: May 03, 2000
Posts: 5032
Location: Fair Oaks, CA
///Mink is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 8:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

70 140 wrote:
The new Varga calipers come with pads and are $70-ish a side.....


Yep, that's next, unless I come up with a miracle cure.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
70 140
Samba Member


Joined: September 22, 2002
Posts: 8468
Location: Ontario Canada
70 140 is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 8:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

///Mink wrote:


Yep, that's next, unless I come up with a miracle cure.


grease the rotors and pad surface? Laughing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
///Mink
Samba Member


Joined: May 03, 2000
Posts: 5032
Location: Fair Oaks, CA
///Mink is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Mar 17, 2008 9:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

70 140 wrote:
///Mink wrote:


Yep, that's next, unless I come up with a miracle cure.


grease the rotors and pad surface? Laughing


I was thinking I could just disconnect the front brake hoses. That should quiet it down.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
///Mink
Samba Member


Joined: May 03, 2000
Posts: 5032
Location: Fair Oaks, CA
///Mink is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2008 8:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, you can add #8 to the list: Fabricated some half-shims to force the trailing edge of the pad to contact the rotor first. No change.

#2gunfire Red Ghia


Last edited by ///Mink on Tue Mar 18, 2008 8:26 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
thom
Samba Member


Joined: October 12, 2000
Posts: 5883
Location: Sacramento
thom is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2008 8:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, I have a set of 993TT fronts you could swap in...
_________________
-Thom
1956 Single Cab
1957 BMW Isetta
1957 Porsche 356A Sunroof
1957 23-Window Deluxe
1957 Westfalia single cab
1963 Type 3 Karmann Ghia
1963 Unimog 404
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Gallery Classifieds Feedback
///Mink
Samba Member


Joined: May 03, 2000
Posts: 5032
Location: Fair Oaks, CA
///Mink is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2008 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thom wrote:
Well, I have a set of 993TT fronts you could swap in...


Cool. Those should fit right under stock 15" wheels, right? Laughing Laughing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
thom
Samba Member


Joined: October 12, 2000
Posts: 5883
Location: Sacramento
thom is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Mar 18, 2008 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

///Mink wrote:
thom wrote:
Well, I have a set of 993TT fronts you could swap in...


Cool. Those should fit right under stock 15" wheels, right? Laughing Laughing


Well, I have some extra 930 spacers; you could stack a 2" and a 3" on each side....
_________________
-Thom
1956 Single Cab
1957 BMW Isetta
1957 Porsche 356A Sunroof
1957 23-Window Deluxe
1957 Westfalia single cab
1963 Type 3 Karmann Ghia
1963 Unimog 404
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Gallery Classifieds Feedback
///Mink
Samba Member


Joined: May 03, 2000
Posts: 5032
Location: Fair Oaks, CA
///Mink is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2008 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just wanted to resurrect this thread with a little more information. Since I originally posted, I've put about 400 miles on the car and the squeal is about 95% gone. I guess the new pads and "resurfaced" rotors finally mated up and quieted down. Kinda like a lot of new marriages. Very Happy

I think my hearing damage was permanent, however.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
mr matt
Samba Member


Joined: May 26, 2005
Posts: 616
Location: southeast Pa
mr matt is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2008 11:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm kinda going through what you did on my super beetle w disc brakes.
I just replaced the disc pads & now
I also feel sorry for the people around me, even the people in other cars - hah, the worst of it is going through a tunnel an applying the brakes, the tunnel acts like a megaphone - it is unbelivable! I;m surprised people are not dropping down, passing out from the sound........

I will try some of the things you attempted above,
someone mentioned to me, that this will happen unless you cut the rotors a bit - I dont want to do that, so I will sand the heck out of them to remove the glaze and put in a new pattern.

Funny how the first time I put the disc brake system on my superbeetle, they never squealed.......which makes me tend to think cutting would solve the prob -

either that, or a lot of time for the brakes to mate to the rotor.......


Matt
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
74Pepper
Samba Member


Joined: March 26, 2007
Posts: 719
Location: Dallas, TX
74Pepper is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2008 11:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

He-he...he said "mate"..... Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Forum Index -> Ghia All times are Mountain Standard Time/Pacific Daylight Savings Time
Page: 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

About | Help! | Advertise | Donate | Premium Membership | Privacy/Terms of Use | Contact Us | Site Map
Copyright © 1996-2020, Everett Barnes. All Rights Reserved.
Not affiliated with or sponsored by Volkswagen of America | Forum powered by phpBB