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Why Wont She Start? Oil Idiot Light? -Updated-
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mikiehill
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 7:02 pm    Post subject: Why Wont She Start? Oil Idiot Light? -Updated- Reply with quote

Confused My 1990 Carat Vanagon 2.1L 4-speed manual won't start and I am not sure why. The story begins with the fact that the fuel gauge doesn't work, and the tank spills over when full. So I was on my way back from a LONG trip guessing how much I had in the tank, and it wasn't enough. Now I have run it out a couple of times and resolved to carry a 2 gallon can of gas with me. I pore it in and try to start it and nothing, just cranks. This has happened a couple time before and if I am patient she will start, but this time nothing. I have done the usual, fuel filter, fuel pump, rotor and distributor, battery, and even the idle control valve. Then I noticed the most recent time trying to start it that the oil light doesn't light when started and I know it worked before, could that be the reason. If so what would cause it, beside it being burnt out. Pressure sensor, oil pump, broken wire, just want a direction and possible course of action and to know if it could be why she won't start. Thanks for any help given!

Last edited by mikiehill on Mon Jul 06, 2009 5:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
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ftp2leta
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 7:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Many can speculate here but no one will have an answer for sure.
It's sound like it's fuel related but it may be anything else.

The fact that you empty the tank dry a few time is a sign that MAYBE some dirt went into the filter and clogged this one good, the fuel pump should be pretty loud.

The oil thing as nothing to do with your problem (well, you never know with those vans...) unless you don't have oil????

Nest time you post just tell if you have automatic or 4 speed. Big difference.

Ben
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mikiehill
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ben, I am a newbie on at this Samba thing so excuse my ignorance in not including the fact that it is a Four Speed Manual Transmission. As I stated before I thought that it might be the pump and filter and already replaced them. Could it be that the line is clogged before or after the filter and pump? I was thinking to remove the injectors to see if they are spraying but that will be my last resort.
Really why I posted, was to get more ideas of what I might look at for solving the problem. There has to be some common problem that I have over looked or don't know about. It has been running like a dream since I bought it a little over a year ago, until now.
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crazyvwvanman
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Remove the tiny bolt from the fuel pressure test port and see if fuel squirts out when you turn on the key. Sometimes this helps let the fuel pump prime, by letting air out without the pump having to struggle as much to get going after the system has been run dry.

Mark


mikiehill wrote:
Ben, I am a newbie on at this Samba thing so excuse my ignorance in not including the fact that it is a Four Speed Manual Transmission. As I stated before I thought that it might be the pump and filter and already replaced them. Could it be that the line is clogged before or after the filter and pump? I was thinking to remove the injectors to see if they are spraying but that will be my last resort.
Really why I posted, was to get more ideas of what I might look at for solving the problem. There has to be some common problem that I have over looked or don't know about. It has been running like a dream since I bought it a little over a year ago, until now.
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ftp2leta
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 9:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mikiehill wrote:
Ben, I am a newbie on at this Samba thing so excuse my ignorance in not including the fact that it is a Four Speed Manual Transmission. As I stated before I thought that it might be the pump and filter and already replaced them. Could it be that the line is clogged before or after the filter and pump? I was thinking to remove the injectors to see if they are spraying but that will be my last resort.
Really why I posted, was to get more ideas of what I might look at for solving the problem. There has to be some common problem that I have over looked or don't know about. It has been running like a dream since I bought it a little over a year ago, until now.


I understand, fully! Just saying that hose beast can be a pain in the you know what. Everything may look good for a wile and at the end they piss you off big time, it's a vanagon fact!

I'm tired and it's late, i will think about your problem in my sleep.

Ben
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mikiehill
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 3:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

1990 VW Vanagon 2.1L 4-Speed Manual - Won't Start!?!?

Ok after searching some of the archives and checking a few things out I came across this. It is on the Air Cleaner Intake and looks a little worn in the area shown. Is it OK or should I replace it? please see image....

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


And...

Mark, what did you mean tiny bolt... where?!?!?

crazyvwvanman wrote:
Remove the tiny bolt from the fuel pressure test port and see if fuel squirts out when you turn on the key. Sometimes this helps let the fuel pump prime, by letting air out without the pump having to struggle as much to get going after the system has been run dry.

Mark


Thanks All for the Help..!!!
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240Gordy
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


that tiny bolt. fuel should squirt out. you can also attach a fuel pressure gauge there.
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240Gordy
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

after you replace the fuel lines it will look like this

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.



if you don't , it might end up like this . . .


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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Tencentlife said,
"So, now that you know what you're doing, go to town."
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H&R SPORT(RED) Springs FRONT , SLAM SPECIALTIES RE6 AIRBAGS REAR
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 10:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What happens if you remove the inlet line from the fuel pump? Do you get fuel running out? If not try blowing into the tank with an air hose, sealing the filler neck with a rag. Don't over do the pressurizing thing, just a few squirts with an air gun. You don't want to balloon the tank or burp fuel back all over yourself.
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mikiehill
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2009 5:49 pm    Post subject: Some more tinkering... Reply with quote

So as suggested before, I checked the pressure test port. Now it was stated that I should undo the nut and see if the fuel squirted out while turning the key... Well I loosened the bolt and it bubbled for a few seconds and then gas started POURING out. In my mind flashed the picture posted earlier and tightened it quickly. Should it be shooting out of the test port, because I expected a little leakage but not the amount that came out.

Also I still don't know if the oil light (pressure switches) would make it not start.

The picture of the part is it worn should I replace it?

Please I miss Driving Her?!?!?
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BigNick0
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 7:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The idea of undoing the little bolt at the test port for your fuel lines is to see if you have fuel pressure back there, which you do. I think it may be coincidence that you ran low (out?) of fuel recently.

I would focus on the oil light not coming on. I think this points to an electrical issue, possibly fuse or ignition switch related. I'm only speculating wildly here (which is what about 90% of the posts on this forum are). I wonder if you are not actually turning ON the van's electrical system enough to have it run. You are going to the START position, but it may be possible that the "ON" position of your ignition switch is bad, or that a fuse is blown.

Check the fuses, and try to perform a test to confirm whether your van is actually ON when the key is in the ON position.

Good luck.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 7:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Typically when you remove the bolt from the test port you only get a very small amount of fuel (engine cold and not running). If you get a gusher then something has to be forcing the fuel out and that something has to be air compressed in the lines. It sounds to me like your system isn't purging itself and your fuel pump is vapor locked.

Hook a hose to the test port and run the pump long enough to purge the air and then do a pressure reading. What pressure are you getting, is it within spec? Maybe manually purging the line is all you have to do.
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Alan Brase
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 08, 2009 2:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wildthings wrote:
It sounds to me like your system isn't purging itself and your fuel pump is vapor locked.

Hook a hose to the test port and run the pump long enough to purge the air and then do a pressure reading. What pressure are you getting, is it within spec? Maybe manually purging the line is all you have to do.

They self purge. Fuel pump pumps plenty of volume, the regulator lets air and fuel through to regulate the line pressure.
He said lots of fuel came out.
I'd go with the ignition. Check for spark. BTW, you are getting power back to the relays if the fuel pump starts.
Al
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mikiehill
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 08, 2009 6:03 pm    Post subject: She is ALIVE... She is ALIVE! Reply with quote

I just want to thank you all for your help. I had replaced the fuel pump and filter first thing and was stumped when it didn't work. That is why I turned to you all for advice. After going through all your suggestions and still nothing I decided to finally checked the injectors which I was afraid of doing for fear of messing it up. Well they didn't spray, so I started to go through the lines from the injectors back to the tank. Low and behold the fuel pump I got was an out of the box failure, that is what I get for getting an aftermarket non OEM pump. So I got my money back and got the OEM one and all is well!!!

Thanks Again All!

Miki
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