| Author |
Message |
Atlantic
Samba Member
Joined: July 24, 2008
Posts: 704
Location: Kalifornien
|
 Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 5:55 pm Post subject: What should we do with the request: pls state gift... |
 |
|
Okay, I am sure lot's of you have come across this issue. It arises frequently when you sell parts overseas:
The buyer sends you an email and asks you to state "gift" instead of the value of the sale on the package - often after you have received the money. A lot of times I get the impression that the buyer demands it. The purpose, often openly stated, is for them to avoid their taxes.
I hate that, 'cause I have nothing to do with their taxes and tax regulations and I simply don't want to do it. I actually think it is not nice of the buyer to ask you to do that.
What is the best response to buyers like that?
What is your experience?
Should I put a statement to that respect in my ads?
If there are some good answers here, we could just refer them to this thread! |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
zozo
Samba Member
Joined: October 15, 2005
Posts: 5217
Location: South of Ol' San Antonio
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 6:03 pm Post subject: Re: What should we do with the request: "pls state gift |
|
|
| Atlantic wrote: |
Okay, I am sure lot's of you have come across this issue. It arises frequently when you sell parts overseas:
The buyer sends you an email and asks you to state "gift" instead of the value of the sale on the package - often after you have received the money. A lot of times I get the impression that the buyer demands it. The purpose, often openly stated, is for them to avoid their taxes.
I hate that, 'cause I have nothing to do with their taxes and tax regulations and I simply don't want to do it. I actually think it is not nice of the buyer to ask you to do that.
What is the best response to buyers like that?
What is your experience?
Should I put a statement to that respect in my ads?
If there are some good answers here, we could just refer them to this thread! |
As has been said since the dawn of time: Honesty is the best policy. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
HerrrKafer
Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2004
Posts: 1465
Location: East Fishkill, NY
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 6:27 pm Post subject: |
|
|
"Hi,
I don't intentionally misrepresent items on customs forms. You're <part> will ship out <time>.
Best Regards,
Atlantic"
Done. 
Also, even if you declare it a gift, you still give a value. I've had people not even know their own regulations, and ask that I "just make sure I don't have to pay anything extra."
Sure buddy, I'm gonna look up your laws, and then break mine for your convenience. 
I also refuse to send "personal payment" paypal for the purpose of allowing a seller to avoid fees.
_________________
Evan H.
| EverettB wrote: |
| In a perfect world, anyone running chromies would be shot. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
EverettB 
Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000
Posts: 71460
Location: Phoenix 602
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 11:22 pm Post subject: |
|
|
If you don't feel comfortable doing it, don't do it.
The response above should suffice.
I have heard "Gift" doesn't matter for some countries, they still look at the contents and value to determine import taxes.
If you feel it's an issue that needs to be addressed in all of your ads, add a statement to your Classifieds signature in your profile.
_________________
How to Post Photos
Everett Barnes - [email protected] | My wanted ads
"Water is the only drink for a wise man" | "Communication prevents complaints"
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bruce
Samba Member
Joined: May 16, 2003
Posts: 17568
Location: Left coast, Canada
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 12:18 am Post subject: |
|
|
| HerrrKafer wrote: |
"Hi,
I don't intentionally misrepresent items on customs forms. You're <part> will ship out <time>.
Best Regards,
Atlantic"
I also refuse to send "personal payment" paypal for the purpose of allowing a seller to avoid fees. |
How generous of you. You make other people pay extra tax so you can hold your head high.
I bet if you were on the other end of the transaction you'd think otherwise.
Here's a question for you. If you buy something online from another state, do you voluntarily contact your state and remit the appropriate sales tax? Legally you are obligated to pay this tax.
_________________
| overheard at the portland Swap Meet... wrote: |
| ..... a steering wheel made from a mastadon tusk..... |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
zozo
Samba Member
Joined: October 15, 2005
Posts: 5217
Location: South of Ol' San Antonio
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 6:30 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Bruce wrote: |
| HerrrKafer wrote: |
"Hi,
I don't intentionally misrepresent items on customs forms. You're <part> will ship out <time>.
Best Regards,
Atlantic"
I also refuse to send "personal payment" paypal for the purpose of allowing a seller to avoid fees. |
How generous of you. You make other people pay extra tax so you can hold your head high.
I bet if you were on the other end of the transaction you'd think otherwise.
Here's a question for you. If you buy something online from another state, do you voluntarily contact your state and remit the appropriate sales tax? Legally you are obligated to pay this tax. |
Providing the REQUIRED information is not a voluntary thing in the case described above.
I would venture to guess that if there was a REQUIRED form for us to fill out for each interstate purchase, most would comply.
How would YOU go about paying state sales tax, if you were in the US and making an interstate purchase? How do you do it Canada? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Thornton
EMPI Guru
Joined: August 27, 2001
Posts: 2107
Location: Portland to AZ back to Portland
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 7:01 am Post subject: |
|
|
When i lived in a smaller town, the post office seen me 2-3 times aweek
the "Gift" thing stopped working and one guy called his manager to inform me that it was breaking the law to mis represent the custom forms
so from there on I couldnt use Gift because they all knew me
_________________
Thornton |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Yellowbeard
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2006
Posts: 2288
Location: At large again...
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 7:20 am Post subject: |
|
|
| zozo wrote: |
Providing the REQUIRED information is not a voluntary thing in the case described above.
I would venture to guess that if there was a REQUIRED form for us to fill out for each interstate purchase, most would comply.
|
There is. A link to Illinois' (where I live) form is below:
http://www.revenue.state.il.us/taxforms/Sales/ST-44.pdf
In Illinois, if your annual sales tax liability is less than $600, you can file annually. More than that and you have to file monthly.
_________________
| Lohe wrote: |
Thanks. Thread went from me not being able to understand what Ipis was saying because English is obviously not his first language to me not being able to understand it because English is my first language  |
Fuel pumps galore:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=845378 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
zozo
Samba Member
Joined: October 15, 2005
Posts: 5217
Location: South of Ol' San Antonio
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 11:18 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Yellowbeard wrote: |
| zozo wrote: |
Providing the REQUIRED information is not a voluntary thing in the case described above.
I would venture to guess that if there was a REQUIRED form for us to fill out for each interstate purchase, most would comply.
|
There is. A link to Illinois' (where I live) form is below:
http://www.revenue.state.il.us/taxforms/Sales/ST-44.pdf
In Illinois, if your annual sales tax liability is less than $600, you can file annually. More than that and you have to file monthly. |
Cool. Can you find one for Texas and post the link for me. Thanks. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
toyvergnugen
Samba Member
Joined: July 16, 2002
Posts: 1010
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 1:06 pm Post subject: |
|
|
The laws cocerning the collection of sales tax on out of state sales are not exactly clear and are undergoing a huge transition as a result of internet sales. I have a Texas sales tax permit and collect sales tax on all in state sales. Texas does not collect sales tax for other states and forward them. I believe the current law is that you have to have a "physical" presence in a state in order to be obligated to pay the "use" tax.
States are trying to redefine the term "physical presence" in the age of technology but it is by no means clear that this will apply to all sales especially for small retailers for ocassional sales.
Some large retailers pay the "use' tax voluntarily on internet and catalog sales in order to have immunity from future sales tax lawsuits.
This is getting a little off topic but I wanted to respond to my friend John's(Zozo) question. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
joescoolcustoms
Samba Member
Joined: August 08, 2006
Posts: 9054
Location: West By God Virginia
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 1:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Bruce wrote: |
| HerrrKafer wrote: |
"Hi,
I don't intentionally misrepresent items on customs forms. You're <part> will ship out <time>.
Best Regards,
Atlantic"
I also refuse to send "personal payment" paypal for the purpose of allowing a seller to avoid fees. |
How generous of you. You make other people pay extra tax so you can hold your head high.
I bet if you were on the other end of the transaction you'd think otherwise.
Here's a question for you. If you buy something online from another state, do you voluntarily contact your state and remit the appropriate sales tax? Legally you are obligated to pay this tax. |
This is comparing apples to oranges. The first one is asking someone to lie for your gain. The second one is you lieing for your own gain.
| Quote: |
| You make other people pay extra tax so you can hold your head high. |
There is a quote to be proud of. Don't like the law, work to change it.
_________________
Bad News Racing 2018 NORRA 1000 3rd in Class
Best Day Ever Racing 2022 NORRA 1000 2nd in Class and first All Female team to complete the race
Everyone is gifted. Some just do not open the package.
Looks like it was painted with a live chicken,polished with a brick and buffed with a pine cone |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Yellowbeard
Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2006
Posts: 2288
Location: At large again...
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 3:37 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| zozo wrote: |
| Yellowbeard wrote: |
| zozo wrote: |
Providing the REQUIRED information is not a voluntary thing in the case described above.
I would venture to guess that if there was a REQUIRED form for us to fill out for each interstate purchase, most would comply.
|
There is. A link to Illinois' (where I live) form is below:
http://www.revenue.state.il.us/taxforms/Sales/ST-44.pdf
In Illinois, if your annual sales tax liability is less than $600, you can file annually. More than that and you have to file monthly. |
Cool. Can you find one for Texas and post the link for me. Thanks. |
Done.
http://www.window.state.tx.us/taxinfo/taxforms/01-156.pdf
_________________
| Lohe wrote: |
| Thanks. Thread went from me not being able to understand what Ipis was saying because English is obviously not his first language to me not being able to understand it because English is my first language |
Fuel pumps galore:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=845378 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
zozo
Samba Member
Joined: October 15, 2005
Posts: 5217
Location: South of Ol' San Antonio
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 5:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Yellowbeard wrote: |
| zozo wrote: |
| Yellowbeard wrote: |
| zozo wrote: |
Providing the REQUIRED information is not a voluntary thing in the case described above.
I would venture to guess that if there was a REQUIRED form for us to fill out for each interstate purchase, most would comply.
|
There is. A link to Illinois' (where I live) form is below:
http://www.revenue.state.il.us/taxforms/Sales/ST-44.pdf
In Illinois, if your annual sales tax liability is less than $600, you can file annually. More than that and you have to file monthly. |
Cool. Can you find one for Texas and post the link for me. Thanks. |
Done.
http://www.window.state.tx.us/taxinfo/taxforms/01-156.pdf |
Thanks. That's a surprisingly simple form.
I bought a key for $1.00. I wonder if they'd take a check for $0.09. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
HerrrKafer
Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2004
Posts: 1465
Location: East Fishkill, NY
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 6:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Bruce wrote: |
| HerrrKafer wrote: |
"Hi,
I don't intentionally misrepresent items on customs forms. You're <part> will ship out <time>.
Best Regards,
Atlantic"
I also refuse to send "personal payment" paypal for the purpose of allowing a seller to avoid fees. |
How generous of you. You make other people pay extra tax so you can hold your head high.
I bet if you were on the other end of the transaction you'd think otherwise.
Here's a question for you. If you buy something online from another state, do you voluntarily contact your state and remit the appropriate sales tax? Legally you are obligated to pay this tax. |
I'm not sure if you're just trolling or actually serious.
I've paid import taxes, and customs fees on numerous items. Do I enjoy it? Of course not, but I would never ask someone to lie on a customs form to avoid it. So you lose your bet; being on the other end of the transaction does not make me think otherwise.
And I fail to understand how my refusing to lie makes other people pay extra tax.   Seems to me, it may cause them to pay the tax. Whether or not the buyer finds that tax just or unjust is a matter between he/she and his/her government -- and doesn't make it polite or reasonable to request that a total stranger break the law for his/her benefit.
In regards to you question, I have no problem admitting to not paying every tax legally required for me to report. I also fail to see the relevance to the question asked or the point I made. The OP commented on buyer/seller etiquette and asked for advice or experiences. My input was commenting on the poor taste exhibited by someone asking for this favor, and how I deal with it. It had nothing to do with the morality of paying or not paying taxes.
_________________
Evan H.
| EverettB wrote: |
| In a perfect world, anyone running chromies would be shot. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 23034
Location: Northwest of Normal
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 7:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| HerrrKafer wrote: |
| Bruce wrote: |
| HerrrKafer wrote: |
"Hi,
I don't intentionally misrepresent items on customs forms. You're <part> will ship out <time>.
Best Regards,
Atlantic"
I also refuse to send "personal payment" paypal for the purpose of allowing a seller to avoid fees. |
How generous of you. You make other people pay extra tax so you can hold your head high.
I bet if you were on the other end of the transaction you'd think otherwise.
Here's a question for you. If you buy something online from another state, do you voluntarily contact your state and remit the appropriate sales tax? Legally you are obligated to pay this tax. |
I'm not sure if you're just trolling or actually serious.
I've paid import taxes, and customs fees on numerous items. Do I enjoy it? Of course not, but I would never ask someone to lie on a customs form to avoid it. So you lose your bet; being on the other end of the transaction does not make me think otherwise.
And I fail to understand how my refusing to lie makes other people pay extra tax. Seems to me, it may cause them to pay the tax. Whether or not the buyer finds that tax just or unjust is a matter between he/she and his/her government -- and doesn't make it polite or reasonable to request that a total stranger break the law for his/her benefit.
In regards to you question, I have no problem admitting to not paying every tax legally required for me to report. I also fail to see the relevance to the question asked or the point I made. The OP commented on buyer/seller etiquette and asked for advice or experiences. My input was commenting on the poor taste exhibited by someone asking for this favor, and how I deal with it. It had nothing to do with the morality of paying or not paying taxes. |
I go through this constantly on eBay. It amazes me sometimes how overseas buyers get pissed at us over their laws.
On the other hand, I've hit on a sort of verbiage that seems to work everywhere. When I sell old jazz records on eBay, I'll declare a nominal value and declare it as "Used phonograph records exchanged between collectors/ archivists". Since I'm frequently also buying from people I sell to in this regard, it's not an untruth.
But, I absolutely refuse to deal with people who bitch because their government charges them tax on something.
_________________
Немає виправдання для війни! Я з Україною.
| Bryan67 wrote: |
| Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
Those who can- do.
Those who can't? Subaru. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ALLWAGONS
Samba Member
Joined: June 03, 2000
Posts: 4607
Location: Pasadena CA/DTLA soon China
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 9:01 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Bruce wrote: |
| HerrrKafer wrote: |
"Hi,
I don't intentionally misrepresent items on customs forms. You're <part> will ship out <time>.
Best Regards,
Atlantic"
I also refuse to send "personal payment" paypal for the purpose of allowing a seller to avoid fees. |
How generous of you. You make other people pay extra tax so you can hold your head high.
I bet if you were on the other end of the transaction you'd think otherwise.
Here's a question for you. If you buy something online from another state, do you voluntarily contact your state and remit the appropriate sales tax? Legally you are obligated to pay this tax. |
Sorry, but Out-of-State sales do not collect Tax! And YES, sending items as GIFT is tax evasion!!!
_________________
I'd be UNSTOPPABLE if not for Law Enforcement and PHYSICS.
I recycle old cars and parts, other than when I rot, that's as Green as I am going to get.
Thanks to my Tesla driving neighbors, I feel more relaxed driving my SUBURBAN and old VW's.
Everything sounds good on paper! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
joescoolcustoms
Samba Member
Joined: August 08, 2006
Posts: 9054
Location: West By God Virginia
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 9:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| Sorry, but Out-of-State sales do not collect Tax! |
Every State has differant tax laws. Where I live, I am supposed to self report and pay at the end of the year. Some states are required to collect for a select group of other states.
I am sure it will come to a crashing end with the current admin and be required for all sales internet or across state lines.
_________________
Bad News Racing 2018 NORRA 1000 3rd in Class
Best Day Ever Racing 2022 NORRA 1000 2nd in Class and first All Female team to complete the race
Everyone is gifted. Some just do not open the package.
Looks like it was painted with a live chicken,polished with a brick and buffed with a pine cone |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Bruce
Samba Member
Joined: May 16, 2003
Posts: 17568
Location: Left coast, Canada
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2009 12:15 am Post subject: |
|
|
| HerrrKafer wrote: |
| Bruce wrote: |
| HerrrKafer wrote: |
"Hi,
I don't intentionally misrepresent items on customs forms. You're <part> will ship out <time>.
Best Regards,
Atlantic"
I also refuse to send "personal payment" paypal for the purpose of allowing a seller to avoid fees. |
How generous of you. You make other people pay extra tax so you can hold your head high.
I bet if you were on the other end of the transaction you'd think otherwise.
Here's a question for you. If you buy something online from another state, do you voluntarily contact your state and remit the appropriate sales tax? Legally you are obligated to pay this tax. |
I've paid import taxes, and customs fees on numerous items. Do I enjoy it? Of course not, but I would never ask someone to lie on a customs form to avoid it. So you lose your bet; being on the other end of the transaction does not make me think otherwise.
And I fail to understand how my refusing to lie makes other people pay extra tax. Seems to me, it may cause them to pay the tax. Whether or not the buyer finds that tax just or unjust is a matter between he/she and his/her government -- and doesn't make it polite or reasonable to request that a total stranger break the law for his/her benefit.
I have no problem admitting to not paying every tax legally required for me to report. |
So you're quite comfortable evading your own taxes, but when someone else wants to do the same, you are opposed? That's quite hypocritical.
My "bet" was that if you were on the other end of the transaction. In other words if you were in that other country facing 15-20% incoming taxes. Not the trivial 2-4% charged by US Customs. Wouldn't you be choked facing such high tax? (BTW, some countries charge 50-100% duty, did you know that?)
Where I live, if I buy some used part locally, it is tax exempt. But if I buy that exact same used part 30 miles away in WA state then bring it home, the tax man wants 12%. Doesn't seem right to me. Then to add insult, if I had to pay for shipping from the seller to WA state, our tax man charges me tax on the cost of that shipping. That's a service that happened completely in another country, so why should they tax that? Luckily for me, shipping costs rarely make it onto whatever paperwork I show the Custom's thieves.
Just for the record, I don't ask sellers to put down undervalued amounts, or "gift".
_________________
| overheard at the portland Swap Meet... wrote: |
| ..... a steering wheel made from a mastadon tusk..... |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
HerrrKafer
Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2004
Posts: 1465
Location: East Fishkill, NY
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2009 7:39 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Bruce wrote: |
So you're quite comfortable evading your own taxes, but when someone else wants to do the same, you are opposed? That's quite hypocritical.
|
I have absolutely no opinion or interest in what someone does to avoid taxes on their own accord. No opposition as long as they keep it their own business (as I do, in your example) and don't involve me.
What I am opposed to, is someone asking me to contribute to their efforts at evasion. Likewise I wouldn't make such a request that I find to be in poor taste.
Exactly what is hypocritical about that stance?
_________________
Evan H.
| EverettB wrote: |
| In a perfect world, anyone running chromies would be shot. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
