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lowbay
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 7:05 am    Post subject: Single Port Performer Reply with quote

So i recently picked up a '68 ghia for my wife. Currently she drives a 2003 Mitsubishi <sp? eclipse spider gt (v6) anyways she likes the power of that thing alot. i know i will never get that kinda power out of the stock 1500 but i wanna build a fun little motor for her.

The case is a 1500 in perfect shape im gunna bump it up to a 1600, im also going to run a set of dual solex 34mm from cb performance. as for heads, stock single port and internals all will be balanced but stock

heres my question, ive been looking at engle 100 cam and also the 120 any suggestions, other recomendations for cams? im just looking to take her attention away from it not going as fast, but still be a zippy little car thanks!
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modok
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 12:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

230-240 deg at .050", that's all you want with a 1600 sp
The engle 120 is way too much!
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 1:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I built a 1776 sp with a 110 cam out of spare parts just to see what it would do. It was in bone stock bug. That little motor ran really good and made for a great DD. It did run on the warm side with the stock jetting. After re jetting motor ran great. The possibilities are endless. Search for single ports on here to see what others have built.
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LUNATIK
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 2:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Right now Im repairing my 1500 SP engine, I am using a Engle 100 with 1.25 ratio rockers and hi-rev single valve spring, retainer and keepers. I am polishing the intake and running dual kadrons. Im expecting this little engine be reliable and torquey for a daily driver. Let you know how it feels whe I get it intalled this week.
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Dangermouse
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 3:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds pretty similar to what I'm trying to build. A stock 1600sp with a W100 cam. In my case I'm going for the dual Weber 34 ICT kit from CB (curious to know why you went with Solex carbs? Not suggesting it's a poor choice, just curious to know what swung it for you?). I'll be using a 200mm 6V flywheel, new Mahle 1600 P&Bs, new Mahle lifters, full flow filtering, stock 69mm crank and rotating assembly balanced from gland nut to pulley nut.

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Quote:
Im expecting this little engine be reliable and torquey for a daily driver. Let you know how it feels whe I get it intalled this week.


Reliable and torquey; that's what I'm after Wink Will be interested to hear back how yours runs.
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Dangermouse
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dangermouse wrote:
Sounds pretty similar to what I'm trying to build. A stock 1600sp with a W100 cam. In my case I'm going for the dual Weber 34 ICT kit from CB. I'll be using a 200mm 6V flywheel, new Mahle 1600 P&Bs, new Mahle lifters, full flow filtering, stock 69mm crank and rotating assembly balanced from gland nut to pulley nut.


Quoting myself here but can anybody suggest what would be an appropriate distributor for a setup like this?
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LUNATIK
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 2:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dangermouse wrote:
Dangermouse wrote:
Sounds pretty similar to what I'm trying to build. A stock 1600sp with a W100 cam. In my case I'm going for the dual Weber 34 ICT kit from CB. I'll be using a 200mm 6V flywheel, new Mahle 1600 P&Bs, new Mahle lifters, full flow filtering, stock 69mm crank and rotating assembly balanced from gland nut to pulley nut.


Quoting myself here but can anybody suggest what would be an appropriate distributor for a setup like this?


A 010 dizzy is my choice, I think is the best distributor overall.

Im using the kadrons because I had them already for free, probably later I will change it to the webers 34's or something close.

Sorry lowbay for hijacking your thread.
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Almost Alive
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 11:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

010 is far too much for a 1600sp.
019 is a good choice.

To be honest you can get a lot out of a small single port engine. I've got just shy of 80hp on my 1641 single port.

Your splitting the case so here is what I would recommend.
Get a DPR counter weighted crank, they are $175. This will allow you to rev a bit higher to suit her driving needs a little better. It won't kill you if you don't but it would make the bearings last longer.
Engle 100 cam, absolutely. SP's do not like large cams at all. I wouldn't even put a 110 in a single port smaller than a 1776.

If you get a set of ported SP heads you will quickly realize how easy it is to get more power out of them. Brother's can make you a nice set D port and welded with SS valves for about $500 for the pair. WELL worth the money... they will prove to give you the most power out of anything else in your build.

You may even want to consider using thick wall 88mm pistons which would bump you up to 1679cc. They are stock bore at the case and only the heads need to be opened up.

Dual 34's are a good idea as well. If you need the electronic chokes go Kadron or Solex if they offer them, if not grab a set of Weber 34's instead. They will give you more power though do NOT buy the cheap ones, they are absolute junk and you will be replacing them within a year.

This combo properly set up would put you at about 75-85hp which will be plenty for your Ghia and your girl will be very pleased with the power band.
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mark tucker
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

do you want to keep it a single port?or do you want more power and dont want or have to spend $ to buy dual port heads? look in the vintage section there is a lot of single port stuff going on there. if you just want more power and a biger cam go dp. but if you want I need to stay sp , that can be done with out much problems also. check with spencer on the vintage threads.
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Almost Alive
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 11:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mark tucker wrote:
do you want to keep it a single port?or do you want more power and dont want or have to spend $ to buy dual port heads? look in the vintage section there is a lot of single port stuff going on there. if you just want more power and a biger cam go dp. but if you want I need to stay sp , that can be done with out much problems also. check with spencer on the vintage threads.


At this small of a displacement the HP is really about the same.
If he wanted to go bigger, the DP heads would cost much more to get work done on than SP's.
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Bulli Klinik
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 3:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a similar setup to what you want to run. SP 1600 with Kadrons. I run heater boxes and a stock peashooter. I chose a stock cam to go with mine since it's in a 59 Bus. It's a terrific running motor with a very nice powerband. It pulls harder and longer than a stock motor but I don't worry about over-reving it with those tiny little ports. I figure it acts as a governor.

Personally, I'd recommend running a stock cam, especially if you are after torque. Anything else is going to move the powerband up. If you're not diggin' it, you can always use ratio rockers to pop the valves open a bit more.

I'm all for counterweighted cranks and ported heads, but I think you're wasting your money porting single ports and putting a CW crank in a SP motor. It's just not going to see the RPM's that make it a worthwhile investment.
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Almost Alive
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

COBussmuggler wrote:
I have a similar setup to what you want to run. SP 1600 with Kadrons. I run heater boxes and a stock peashooter. I chose a stock cam to go with mine since it's in a 59 Bus. It's a terrific running motor with a very nice powerband. It pulls harder and longer than a stock motor but I don't worry about over-reving it with those tiny little ports. I figure it acts as a governor.

Personally, I'd recommend running a stock cam, especially if you are after torque. Anything else is going to move the powerband up. If you're not diggin' it, you can always use ratio rockers to pop the valves open a bit more.

I'm all for counterweighted cranks and ported heads, but I think you're wasting your money porting single ports and putting a CW crank in a SP motor. It's just not going to see the RPM's that make it a worthwhile investment.


Sorry guy but you couldn't be more wrong. My 1641 has a totally bone stock bottom end and I got it to produce just under 80hp at the flywheel.... that's quite a bump from stock.
Using the ports as a governor is silly. You can certainly over rev your stock engine with them... especially with your dual carbs.
Your bus came stock with a governor on the carb for that reason.
A counter weighted crank not only allows you to rev past 4500rpm's safely but it elongates the bearing and case life.
I think you need to do some serious reading before you give advise on something that you apparently know nothing about. Not trying to be rude but there is no other way of saying it.
Jake Raby build many 2100cc+ single ports successfully producing well over 100hp.
There is a fellow on this forum who has a 2180 SP I believe with a turbo on it and he drag races it. That engine see's well over 9k RPM's and he runs 11's with it (if I recall correctly).
I've used stock cams on small displacement SP's before and they work wonderfully for all around power and MPG but a E100 will give you much more power band and torque.
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kingodirtp3
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 6:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i have a 1776sp in my lowered bus with a 4.12 68 bug trans and 205/60/14 tires.
weber ICT carbs 145/60 jets, SVDA distributor with vacuum to both carbs,
e100 cam with 1.25 rockers on solid shafts,
everythign balanced, stock crank and rods,
1 3/8 header with $20 cherry bomb oval turbo muffler and custom pipe
routing(that made a big improvement from the single quietpac)
cheap empi breather box, heads have valve job, cut back intakes,
cleaned up exhaust ports and single hd spring from lowbugget.
i love how it drives. the only thing i'd change is a 78 c/w crank.


Last edited by kingodirtp3 on Mon Nov 08, 2010 6:24 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Almost Alive
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here ya go.
Single port that runs 11.259's at 120mph quarter mile.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EV12RL3P8Bw
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gt1953
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One nice thing about counter weighted crank shafts is the smoothness it provides. Yes in my opinion worth the money.
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lowbay
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for all the info guys! im not lookin to make it run 11's lol i wanna build her something that will keep the hondas in her rearview mirrors from light to light and be able to merge onto the freeway without gettin smashed...

i do want to stick with the sp heads for a few reasons, one i already have them and two im not looking to spend big bucks on the motor... im not going cheap by anymeans i want it to be reliable but i dont need a show piece. i think im gunna stick with the 1600 jug kit and go with the e100 cam, the crank is stock, i took it today to get it ballanced and pollished.
does anyone recomend a shop to get my heads ported? im in AZ thanks again guys
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BROTHERS VW MACHINE!
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kingodirtp3
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

for beating hondas and entering freeway you should at least go up to 1776, since its a ghia you can get away with 1914.
the best would be a 1955, maybe a 2007. if you have to buy a crank
anyway you might as well get a 78 stroker.
with one of those set ups hondas and the freeway wouldnt be a problem.
the 1600 will still struggle some, though the way you are building your's
it'll struggle alot less than stock.
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Bulli Klinik
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 8:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Almost Alive wrote:
COBussmuggler wrote:
I have a similar setup to what you want to run. SP 1600 with Kadrons. I run heater boxes and a stock peashooter. I chose a stock cam to go with mine since it's in a 59 Bus. It's a terrific running motor with a very nice powerband. It pulls harder and longer than a stock motor but I don't worry about over-reving it with those tiny little ports. I figure it acts as a governor.

Personally, I'd recommend running a stock cam, especially if you are after torque. Anything else is going to move the powerband up. If you're not diggin' it, you can always use ratio rockers to pop the valves open a bit more.

I'm all for counterweighted cranks and ported heads, but I think you're wasting your money porting single ports and putting a CW crank in a SP motor. It's just not going to see the RPM's that make it a worthwhile investment.


Sorry guy but you couldn't be more wrong. My 1641 has a totally bone stock bottom end and I got it to produce just under 80hp at the flywheel.... that's quite a bump from stock.
Using the ports as a governor is silly. You can certainly over rev your stock engine with them... especially with your dual carbs.
Your bus came stock with a governor on the carb for that reason.
A counter weighted crank not only allows you to rev past 4500rpm's safely but it elongates the bearing and case life.
I think you need to do some serious reading before you give advise on something that you apparently know nothing about. Not trying to be rude but there is no other way of saying it.
Jake Raby build many 2100cc+ single ports successfully producing well over 100hp.
There is a fellow on this forum who has a 2180 SP I believe with a turbo on it and he drag races it. That engine see's well over 9k RPM's and he runs 11's with it (if I recall correctly).
I've used stock cams on small displacement SP's before and they work wonderfully for all around power and MPG but a E100 will give you much more power band and torque.


I don't need to get into a pissing match about this. I'd suggest that your a bit off-base by saying that this is something that I know nothing about. I'm telling him my experience with a motor which is near identical to what he intends to build. From what I can tell from his initial post, he's using a stock crank, 1600 pistons and stock heads. He can cam it how he want's.
If you want a reliable motor your wife can drive, you can't beat a stock cam, especially for the small displacement and stock heads.

My motor pulls until it runs out of steam because of the small ports, not because of valve float. The small ports limit the amount of air coming into the motor, much like a governor, when it's at full steam. I'm not suggesting that the motor can't be over-revved. Some monkeys can break a bowling ball. Full pedal and a missed shift can grenade any motor.

I'm glad that your motor makes 80 hp how you built it. I'm curious as to why you wouldn't take your own advice about counterweighted cranks and also choosing to run slip-in big bores? I've always considered those a cheap way to run hotter and decrease engine life.

I'm quite thankful that we have experts like you to guide us newbies through, though this newbie has put probably a quarter million miles on his own ACVW's (100K on one bus alone) with his own motors since his first Bus in '87.

To the original poster, I'd recommend bringing the flywheel, pressure plate and crankshaft pulley to the machine shop that does your balancing. It's far better to have the entire unit balanced as a whole. I would also recommend that the machinist peen the perimeter of the pressure plate once he finds the best position for the plate. I've yet to see a VW pressure plate, Kennedy or otherwise, that doesn't "float" within the seat that it is mounted in. Mount it as central as you can, torque it up and then peen the perimeter in a few spots so that when the PP is removed and reinstalled with the disk, it goes back on the exact way it came off. It should almost be a press fit.

Good Luck!
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 8:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dangermouse wrote:
Dangermouse wrote:
Sounds pretty similar to what I'm trying to build. A stock 1600sp with a W100 cam. In my case I'm going for the dual Weber 34 ICT kit from CB. I'll be using a 200mm 6V flywheel, new Mahle 1600 P&Bs, new Mahle lifters, full flow filtering, stock 69mm crank and rotating assembly balanced from gland nut to pulley nut.


Quoting myself here but can anybody suggest what would be an appropriate distributor for a setup like this?


I use a 009 with an Ignitor module and a blue coil set to 10 initial advance...But I'm at 6000'. Subtract 5 degrees for sea level.
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