Cooling System

[DAIZEE]

I didn't want to be accused of hijacking someone else's thread and as I have a very specific question concerning my Vanagon I opened this thread which I expect to be very short.

I have had repeated cooling system problems, mega I should say for months now. Many breakdowns, many tows. Last breakdown on me doing a normal super highway test blew a hose (different than any time before), replaced, put new clamp on it, filled it and then after I had burped it on a decline, still violent boiling within a few minutes I decided to have it towed. In the country no facilities around. Flat bedded to an unknown city to me so I said VW Dealer. Done, had to leave it due to their time and my time.

Fast forward, they found a leak (small) in a flange when they did the first pressure test. Lots and lots of air even tho I know I burbed it after a blown hose on highway. Replaced flange, bled and pressure tested again and then 45 minutes of super highway driving by Technician. Temp maintained temp (actual temperature gauge).

So I take the train there early am tomorrow and bring it home. My question is and I reasonabley expect opinions based on experiences with driving Vanagons long distances with 3 mths so no rush along the way.

If the never ending coolant problems (almost every T, flange, connector and hoses have been changed) have been overcome (and only time will tell), assuming the replacement (+/- 25 hrs on 145,000 mile engine) 94/95 Jetta 1.9L TD AAZ has not been affected, do you think it is reasonably safe for me to take my trip to the East Side of Nfld and back??? I do have plans to take it to a Vanagon expert for assessment. Oh and so its not said, fuel lines were all replaced with high quality.

I know no guarantees with these but I really am tired being stranded,

Would you go for it or not??? I'll not ever have this opportunity again and it is a late life dream PLUS I spent a lot of $$ provisioning it for a comfortable long distance 3 mth trip.

What sayest tho??????
_________________
'09 2.5L Jetta 5 cylinder, 5 spd, super turbo, see thread in H2O Cooled Jetta, etc...
83.5 Vanagon L Riviera Model with 98 1.9L TD AAZ 4 speed Daily Driver 3 out of 4 seasons (sold)
84 Vanagon GL Wolfsburg Westy WBX 4 speed (sold)

[Ahwahnee]

I'm in Arizona so when someone says they're going from Ontario to Newfoundland they might as well say they're going from Uruguay to Paraguay -- but from the context I'll assume it is a long trip.

Given your recent experiences I would think you'd want to take a few shorter trips of a couple of hundred miles (or kilometers or furlongs or whatever) to have confidence that this latest round of work did in fact resolve what was either many coolant issues or many facets of one issue.

I seem to see a lot of posts here from people who just finished major work or just picked the van up from the mechanic and are immediately leaving on a long trip.

Maybe I lack confidence in my work but I find there is no substitute for a shakedown drive that puts the engine thru several cold-hot-cold cycles and stresses every sub-system a bit.

Owning a Westy has made me a better person in many ways but it has never succeeded in making me an optimist.

[DAIZEE]

Oh I will, in fact this last incident 2 days ago was going to be a 100 km trip on super highway, to country hilly, windy roads and home. Broke down at 51st km! I was doing about 95 kmph (speed limit was 100 but I didn't want to push it.) VW says its okay now (first time seen by professionals) and I will take it next to a Vanagon expert for assessment.

We never know when we are going to break down but I guess I'm asking if it gets checked out by a Vanagon expert (business) should I attempt to overcome my paranoia with the past 3 mths of incidents. and go for it? I'm looking for realistic encouragement but also honest opinion based on people's extensive experience. I guess I should have made this a poll.
_________________
'09 2.5L Jetta 5 cylinder, 5 spd, super turbo, see thread in H2O Cooled Jetta, etc...
83.5 Vanagon L Riviera Model with 98 1.9L TD AAZ 4 speed Daily Driver 3 out of 4 seasons (sold)
84 Vanagon GL Wolfsburg Westy WBX 4 speed (sold)

[wasserbox]

[DAIZEE]

No as I don't deal in credit and they won't even consider a several thousand $$$ deposit. Like look where the world is because of credit. I have the $$$ set aside for this trip and I get better than great diesel mileage.

New problem is different than repeated system breakdowns but I've never had it gone over by a professional before.
_________________
'09 2.5L Jetta 5 cylinder, 5 spd, super turbo, see thread in H2O Cooled Jetta, etc...
83.5 Vanagon L Riviera Model with 98 1.9L TD AAZ 4 speed Daily Driver 3 out of 4 seasons (sold)
84 Vanagon GL Wolfsburg Westy WBX 4 speed (sold)

[jkidd152]

If it is really the trip of a lifetime, then you have to go for it! Unrealiable vehice or not. Hit the road! Way back when, my Bronco wouldn't run, so I rode my motorcycle across 4 states so as not to miss a good time with old friends. Not the original travel plan, but the memories of that trip are priceless.

I also give a x2 on some short trips to build your confidence. Got any rush-hour traffic on a really hot day? If you can get through that and not overheat, then you'll be fine on your Super Highway. What is that, anyway? My imagination is active...
_________________
'85 Syncro Westy

[DAIZEE]

3 to 12 lane (each direction) speed 100 kmph (highest speed in Ontario) = 60 mph. Yes I have no problem in driving in rush hr super highway. I do intend a few more test cruises.

I guess what I'm saying when I have done/have had done everything possible should I just go for it. Of course if I breakdown I will then have yet another decision to make. OK say 2 more 100 km 1 to 2 hr drives. Say done successfully (but not attempted until independant professional Vanagon expert assessment.

Perhaps this is too difficult opinion to ask. Is it we all have to stick our necks out at sometime after doing all one can do?.
_________________
'09 2.5L Jetta 5 cylinder, 5 spd, super turbo, see thread in H2O Cooled Jetta, etc...
83.5 Vanagon L Riviera Model with 98 1.9L TD AAZ 4 speed Daily Driver 3 out of 4 seasons (sold)
84 Vanagon GL Wolfsburg Westy WBX 4 speed (sold)

[randywebb]

I found a receipt in the package that came with my '86 where a PO paid to have every hose in the cooling system replaced...
_________________
1986 2.1L Westy 2wd Auto Trans.

[DAIZEE]

Not planning to take off anywhere for at least a week. I'll do 2 test runs (one in hot & traffic, stop and go), if both tests successful with constant good results then I will attempt trip. Not making any decisions when upset by events!!!

I really want to do this and in my case the destination is equal to the trip (have travelled NA extensively in the past - I've never been to the rock) AND i do want to go, just need to feel comfortable. After Mtl I would be going places I've NEVER been.

Unfortunately I have no documentation on the TD Conversion and everything else done. Have requested same several times. Another alas is that I've used up all my free towing from CAA until Oct. I still get a reduced rate tho thru CAA/AAA.
_________________
'09 2.5L Jetta 5 cylinder, 5 spd, super turbo, see thread in H2O Cooled Jetta, etc...
83.5 Vanagon L Riviera Model with 98 1.9L TD AAZ 4 speed Daily Driver 3 out of 4 seasons (sold)
84 Vanagon GL Wolfsburg Westy WBX 4 speed (sold)

[bridgetroll13]

I have an AAZ in my Westy. I replaced the stock 1.6 diesel myself. The upgrade has not been without lumps and bumps. Rereading your original post it seems strange that there would have been so much air in the system

[bjrogers86auto]

I know exactly what you are looking for...and none of us can provide it for you...confidence in your van. Even a few short successful trips can end up with the next one being a breakdown. Sad but true.

All of these issues provide you with the experience and knowledge of your van. This is worth as much as a CAA membership. For me, a check by someone who knows the vans and you know and trust, would send me on my way.

If you make it to Montreal you can always check in at Ben's. I don't know the others on the rescue squad but they are out there. There is so much to see on this coast and we would sure be happy if you make it. Nothing ventured...nothing gained is a pretty good phrase for today. Or...f*** it! I'm goin! Whatever fits.

Brian.
_________________
2020 T@B 320 Teardrop(Has been van guy)
21 Ford Ranger XLT
19 Honda Civic Hatchback

A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day. Calvin and Hobbes.

[DaveCA]

Lots of good advise from others.

How old all the rubber and plastic parts you put faith in? The van needs to be tested and inspected by someone who's seen all these problem 100 times before. Then, because we are all only human, have it gone over again by someone else who's seen all this before 100 times. It's the only real way to determine whether the van is in good shape.

Otherwise working on an inner peace and enjoying the experience is all there is for you when it breaks.

A hakedown run after a patch job is only good for the period of the test.

Enjoy the trip!

[Bruce Wayne]

did you replace the radiator? if it has blockage it could affect the whole cooling system. I will be leaving next week for Red Rocks,Co. about 3500 miles round trip,not sure how far your planned trip is for.if you have towing coverage on your insurance,go for it!

[snowsyncro]

I would do it!

It is really not that long of a drive. The T-dot to here is 18 hours driving the speed limit, say 24 at vanagon speeds. I have done it many times in one stint (in a car mind you). Then four hours to Nfld ferry, say 5 - 6 easy.

Then you are there -- easy-peasey!

If you break down here Brian (bjrogers86auto) is always ready to jump in and help!

Kidding -- I won't commit him to anything, but I can help around here if you need it.

RonC

[DAIZEE]

Great comments. To the best of my knowledge all the plastic fittings in the coolant system have been replaced with metal. As for the radiator I asked VW specifically about that. It appears to be fine. They did a 45 minute road test (highway also) after the repair and a 2nd pressure test. I'm going to pick up a bunch of clamps of various sizes also. Some of the spring loaded are pretty darn old. I plan to make a Libby Bong.

I will be contacting a Vanagon expert with an established business for a complete mechanical inspection next week AND as I've said several times I will do my own road tests (I also record all the data - 4 gauges plus engine hrs gauge). I realize that all could go well and I could still break down (its a Vanagon). New tires, new wheels, new brakes, all new cooling, jetta TD conversion 1.9L TD AAZ, new bright bulbs (but I don't drive at night)and new exhaust.

If I have radiator problems then I will have to track down a source and installation. At least I will be able to sleep in the van as I will have my companion dog with me so no stress about needing to be home.

If, just if, I have ongoing problems then I will just have to get it fixed and limp home BUT I will have tried!!!

Right now taking each day by day before making the decision to cast off. Mtl is 5 hrs from Toronto so say 6 to 7 hrs. Will stop several times to walk the dog. I think I can get there on one tankful of diesel but of course once the trip omoter gets to a certain figure I will refill until I get a feel for my distances. That will change south and east of Mtl thru Vt & Me when I get into hills and mtns.

I'm going to stop by the fairgrounds (well across the street) and see if any of the Vanagons are in the areain Freyburg, Me. Maybe there will be one or two left over from Vanatube. Then I'll probably head for the coast. But I'll make decisions along the way. If I come to a great place for the right price and I feel like staying up to a week, then I will.

I figure roughly one mth to get to Nfld, one mth there and one mth back. I want to do the Saguney(?) on the way back for sure. I'd really like to travel off the big highways where possible.

I carry tools, spare belt and 2 pairs of nylons, water, oil, 1.5 gal diesel, spare water pump, spare master brake cylinder. I'm not very strong but I manage. Oh yes and I have my Bentley but I'm not sure that it covers the Jetta TD conversion. I tried figuring out where the thermostat was the other day but the diagram didn't look what I have.
_________________
'09 2.5L Jetta 5 cylinder, 5 spd, super turbo, see thread in H2O Cooled Jetta, etc...
83.5 Vanagon L Riviera Model with 98 1.9L TD AAZ 4 speed Daily Driver 3 out of 4 seasons (sold)
84 Vanagon GL Wolfsburg Westy WBX 4 speed (sold)

[bjrogers86auto]

That's what us firemen do...help others. If I can be of assistance I most definitely will help. Just don't catch fire!

We plan on taking off on Sunday for our Staycation. Staying local, N.S. and N.B. 3 weeks of westy life...half the speed...twice the pleasure!

Even after 14000kms last summer of almost incident free driving I still am never sure....but that's part of the adventure.

Brian.
_________________
2020 T@B 320 Teardrop(Has been van guy)
21 Ford Ranger XLT
19 Honda Civic Hatchback

A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day. Calvin and Hobbes.

[Californio]

I'd be a bit nervous about going on a long trip like this. There is some specific problem with your cooling system, and it sounds like no one to date has told you what it is. That problem needs to be identified and remedied before you go.

The fact that you have replaced all those parts simple means that no one has diagnosed the problem. Twenty parts don't go bad at once.

The cooling system is quite simple. Coolant moves around in tubes and is cooled by the radiator, which in turn is cooled either by wind or by the fan.

If the coolant doesn't move, it is either a pump problem or a blockage (radiator or stuck thermostat.)

If the coolant isn't there, you have a leak.

If the coolant isn't getting cool, you have a radiator or a fan problem.

It's pretty much just that simple. Find someone who can diagnose the problem without throwing parts at it. Much easier in your home town than on the side of the highway...

[kamzcab86]

[Californio]

I would also confirm that the fan is functioning properly. A highway test won't accomplish this.

[DAIZEE]

I've just got driven home from Newmarket again (this time in a 2011 Passat Stn Wgn). Took the GO up to pick it up. Talked with the Technician and he reported that the rad is fine and ditto the fan. He drew my attention to one hose which does need replacing asap. Its the same hose that the tow truck driver identified. It's a custom hose. Mine is very soft when cold and as it takes a sharp turn it will choke off when hot. They filled it with coolant and burped it several times in different positions. I was told that I should not have been running water in the system. I had thought that too but I had been assured that water was fine for now. It has to do with evaporation and boiling points.

So other than getting that hose everything was fixed and they did me right with the bill too. Very considerate of my senior status. BUT

I couldn't get it started. Tried and tried, used my Eliminator, the mechanic came out, then another mechanic came out and did some tests. Tried their shop Eliminator, didn't/wouldn't start with or without the glow plugs onbut ascertained that the message was getting to the plugs, they just weren't paying attention. Initially it was thought that I had flooded it. They did something that should have meant it should have started regardless. Even the Service Mgr was out. Remember that I had been having trouble starting it since I got it back from an engine exchange due to previous mega coolant failures. Also they discovered that several of the vacuum lines were badly frayed and a new fuse box set up was totally corroded from again the previous mega coolant failures. Just rotted. I remember it new. I'm wondering now how much damage was caused by the coolant breaks.

Cut to final diagnosis after an hr of 2 mechanics (no charge) and they found that #1 glow plug was jammed in and cross threaded on an angle and it was leaking fuelspect that many of these problems were created by the previous melt down of plastic T's, connectors used in the initial conversion. They have now been replaced with metal. I had my head right in there when they were tracking the problem down.

Shortly after the engine replacement there had been a fuel leak and it caused the person who did the conversion and then the replacement a lot of problems but I had been assured that it was fixed and to get on the road. Managed to get the #1 glow plug out and testing it grounded nothing, not even a faint glimmer.

Because this is an old Jetta diesel it has a piece of metal that joins the glow plugs, fortunately they are able to order this from their wharehouse. So that glow plug connector rod, 4 glow plugs and labor is a reasonable (but not cheap) $$$$. BUT if they have to retap #1 glow plug chamber then they have to take the accelerator and a bunch of stuff off the engine so that they have a direct (non angled) line into the chamber to retap. Well that's going to really really hurt BUT service mgr assured me that if they can do it without removal of all then that will keep my labor costs down, otherwise it is a 6 hr job.

So I'm looking at from $500 to $1000 dollar repair for really old worn out, glow plugs that were run in my van for less than 20 hours, glow plugs and the joiner rod and replacement vacuum hoses. There is a total of 73 hrs on the engine gauge from the initial conversion. The replacement engine went in at around 55 hrs and its now at 73 hrs.

Am I p*ssed off? You betcha! I would have expected this to be part of the conversion and/or replacement engine. Obviously I'm wrong to have assumed that and also very gullable. I believe it all goes back to those initial high quality (and they were tested up to 250 degrees) plastic connectors in the coolant system and old hoses that should have been replaced. So much easier to have done it all then, the costs would certainly have been less in the end.

Will pay it and then put van up for sale. This has thinned my bank acct for the trip just too much. No safety net left. So the dream is over, the bucket is empty now but not for the right reason.

I will still take it to a vanagon expert next week for a complete check up as I think that is the responsible thing to do prior to selling it. I am going to be taking a mega loss on all that I spent on outfitting it for 2 X 3 mth trips. Was also going to try Az & NM for the winter. Never been there and I'm tired of Fl and other than Corpus Christi, I'm not interested in the Rio Grande Snowbird flock.

Many many of the employees, mechanics and mgmt came out to admire the van. They told me that a lot of their customers stopped to look at it. They parked it where it could be seen.

I also watched how the experts put tint on windows. Man this guy was good not just fast. He has it down to a fine art and he makes it look easy but of course its not.

So my Vanagon days are over (I'm pretty sure), the rust on the knife is that when I sell it I will have $$$ in the bank but not the expected pleasure. I really really liked driving this van, really nice ride. Liked it much better than the Westy even. Like I connected with Scooby Blu. I took it from a really dirty, rotten van to a clean, fresh fun interior. Besides my $ (and I would have paid more if asked at that time even before I got my hands on it) I put a lot of elbow grease and love into it. Lost count of the number of toothbrushes I used. It's simple I loved Scooby, we connected. I promise that SB will be as perfect as she can be when up for sale, mechanically especially.

I want to thank the people that have private messaged me with info and support and encouragement and all who have contributed to this thread.

New name should be 'one stranding too many! without ever really having gotten on the road!!! ' Mths and mths of problems have just worn me thin.
_________________
'09 2.5L Jetta 5 cylinder, 5 spd, super turbo, see thread in H2O Cooled Jetta, etc...
83.5 Vanagon L Riviera Model with 98 1.9L TD AAZ 4 speed Daily Driver 3 out of 4 seasons (sold)
84 Vanagon GL Wolfsburg Westy WBX 4 speed (sold)