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BOTH alternator bracket holes stripped badly. Any ideas?
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wehrbüchse
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 10:03 am    Post subject: BOTH alternator bracket holes stripped badly. Any ideas? Reply with quote

You guys should see me as I type this. I am just dismayed. I've been struggling lately with a drain on my battery and a back-with-a-vengeance bucking problem, and so I woke up bright and early determined to make some progress.

No dice.

I noticed the head sheared from the bolt where my alternator tension bar attaches, and set about replacing it. Once I had it off, I noticed the bracket to be quite loose. I went to tighten the left bolt and it kept turning, and it was LOOSE. It is stripped badly. This leaves me with BOTH holes stripped and deformed by the back-and-forth of the loose bolt. The right mount hole was completely stripped last spring, and until now I've bolstered the left bolt with the GoWesty bracket. One guy on here warned me!

I could roll with just the tension bar and the stainless GoWesty bracket and some rigged strap down to a muffler mount bolt or something, but for how long?

It's an impossible spot to access to do a helicoil, and I simply can't afford shop work that involves engine removal.

Any ideas?

Sad
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dredward
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 10:17 am    Post subject: Re: BOTH alternator bracket holes stripped badly. Any ideas? Reply with quote

wehrbüchse wrote:
You guys should see me as I type this. I am just dismayed. I've been struggling lately with a drain on my battery and a back-with-a-vengeance bucking problem, and so I woke up bright and early determined to make some progress.

No dice.

I noticed the head sheared from the bolt where my alternator tension bar attaches, and set about replacing it. Once I had it off, I noticed the bracket to be quite loose. I went to tighten the left bolt and it kept turning, and it was LOOSE. It is stripped badly. This leaves me with BOTH holes stripped and deformed by the back-and-forth of the loose bolt. The right mount hole was completely stripped last spring, and until now I've bolstered the left bolt with the GoWesty bracket. One guy on here warned me!

I could roll with just the tension bar and the stainless GoWesty bracket and some rigged strap down to a muffler mount bolt or something, but for how long?

It's an impossible spot to access to do a helicoil, and I simply can't afford shop work that involves engine removal.

Any ideas?

Sad

Tap it to the nxt size up.
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sbclayton
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 10:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Better - TimeSert it and never worry about it again. No worries, no strain - you'll be just fine! Smile Not that difficult to access..... Go for it!
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BlackDogVan
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 10:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya x2 on the timesert or helicoils. Going to he next size bolt is rarely a good idea, the other side of the connection might need mods to fit, your next alternator won't fit etc.
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wehrbüchse
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 11:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sbclayton wrote:
Better - TimeSert it and never worry about it again. No worries, no strain - you'll be just fine! Smile Not that difficult to access..... Go for it!


Sounds like this is my only hope, though I'm pretty sure I can't get a drill in there, even if I pulled the coolant pipe. And at least one of the holes (the right one) is now oblong. Not sure where to start. If anyone's got experience with this, I'd sure be thankful for guidance.
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Dimitrios
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmm you car is a panel/kombi right ?
It is tight here but consider also the option to have the engine hanged down at the front only to make the work easily...You have to remove the two shields,accelarator cable,AFM box and some coolant lines,also six 10mm bolts that secures the muffler shield and some more but it will work.If you have fresh coolant you can use a bucket to catch it and reuse it...

Good luck,
Jim
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wehrbüchse
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 12:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, the guy at North Westy just told me they could do it on Monday but it sounds like quite a bit more labor than I can afford. However, they have special body-work drills they can use to get in there. Maybe I could do prep-work at home and have AAA tow it in for the time-sert. Or is it the case that I could do the time-sert myself if I can get the coolant pipe out if the way? Not sure where I'd start with that. It seems my Bentley was recently stolen out of my van. I've torn my entire house apart looking for it.
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Dimitrios
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 12:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you have patience you can do it.You need basic tools,a bucket and a jack (hydraylic...10,13,6 allen and very very few more tools are required to do the job...It will take no more than 3 hours.
I can provide you step by step instructions if you like ?

Rgds,
Jim
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Captjon1959
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 1:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had the same problem on the passenger side of the engine. If you remove the coolant pipe and use a 90 degree drill adapter (I got a cheap one from Harbor Feight for ten bucks) and a short bit you can get in there. I replaced all the threaded areas with inserts and then used the GoWesty bracket. It is worth the effort.
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Alaric.H
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote


Link
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dredward
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BlackDogVan wrote:
Ya x2 on the timesert or helicoils. Going to he next size bolt is rarely a good idea, the other side of the connection might need mods to fit, your next alternator won't fit etc.

I agree but was thinking access. However letteing the motor hang for access and timeserts or helicoils is way to go.
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wehrbüchse
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I profusely appreciate the responses, but letting the motor hang seems slightly over my head, particularly with my Bentley guide disappearing just in time. Do you guys think I could do it removing only the obstructing coolant pipe?

BTW: if I detach that pipe on the right, will it pull straight out of the pump?

Thanks!
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 5:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just had the same thing happen - both alternator bracket stud are broken off though fortunately are still sticking out a bit . They are pretty rounded though. Are these just threaded posts? I was thinking of welding a bolt on the end like some have mentioned. Are these supposed to be bolts or just threaded posts to receive a nut? What size are they? Heres a pic after I pulled the alt.

[img]

Thanks for any advice!

-Brian[/img]

edit - it won't let me post the pic - need to fiddle with that...
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wehrbüchse
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 9:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

They are bolts that screw into the aluminum, not posts threaded to accept a nut. It sounds like you're doing relatively great by comparison, as your holes aren't stripped (right?). I had to rig custom brackets that work along with the gowesty bracket* to enable me to run without using either of these posts. In retrospect I should've time-serted it when I had the pipe out of the way swapping my coolant pump.

Anyway, I bet you could get a grip on them with vise grips or one of those stud extractor bits they sell at hardware stores for 10 bucks. At the minimum, they will back right out if a nut is welded to them at a muffler shop. Somewhere in this thread or another thread I have about my alt bracket issues I list the part number of a v belt that'll enable you to drive a short distance (like to a muffler shop) without the alternator (it goes around the main drive pulley and the coolant pump pulley).

Keep us posted,

WB

*the GW bracket, which you are strongly advised to order ASAP, was not designed to be used this way, but nevertheless should not have been designed with the square corner that enables it to crack so easily. Additionally, when mine was fully installed it would no longer allow my undamaged alternator mount bracket to line up with both holes anyway.
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Cygnus
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 9:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the advice - I hope the bolts are not stripped - I tried turning em with vice grips (no dice) But I don't have any reason to believe they are stripped otherwise. I ordered the gowesty bracket today. I am not sure what you mean in that last part about the gowesty bracket - is it a bad design? Does it crack? Does it need the old bracket with it? Won't line up?

Do you know what the other v-belt that would work with the water pump is? That would be tricky to get on I expect since the alternator is used to tension it.

Thanks,

-B
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wehrbüchse
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 9:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just to be clear: it's the holes that strip, not the bolts. If yours are stuck it sounds like your holes are not stripped, which is GOOD news!

I don't remember what the belt number/brand is, I'm posting from a phone and I must officiate a wedding shortly, though you might be able to find it using the search for my posts including the word 'belt' along with 'bypass' or something. The belt stretches over the pulley with a screwdriver, not too tricky.

The gowesty bracket is intended to work along with the existing bracket. Since your holes probably aren't stripped, it probably won't crack and you should install it when it arrives. But it did crack on mine when I was using it with one unstripped bolt hole, and it wouldn't have if one particular corner were rounded.

One last thing: if you go to a muffler shop you should be assertive and don't ask them how much it'll cost or if they can do it. They can. Confidently state that you need them to weld nuts to the end of broken posts and ask them how much their hourly labor rate is. Because this job will take 10 minutes you should not be paying them 50 bucks or any such nonsense.
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Cygnus
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh OK thanks for the clarification - Good news! I towed it home last night and just now went and broke out the BIG vice grips and some PB Blaster - Both are out and the holes are not stripped! Now just to wait for my new bracket.

Thanks for the advice!

-B
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Ahwahnee
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have the GoWesty bracket in addition to the sotck bracket and observed no problem with that set up. As I recall Ben (poosibly on his website) came up with a home-made brace that did essentially the same thing as the GW bracket.

FWIW -- If needs must (with a good battery) you can drive a long way w/o an alternator -- my personal best is over 500 miles but that was only because I didn't realize the the alternator had failed. A temporary water pump belt can be fashioned from a length of nylon rope (did another 300 with that and the aux battery).
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 12:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ahwahnee wrote:
FWIW -- If needs must (with a good battery) you can drive a long way w/o an alternator -- my personal best is over 500 miles but that was only because I didn't realize the the alternator had failed. A temporary water pump belt can be fashioned from a length of nylon rope (did another 300 with that and the aux battery).


Thats Awesome! More details on the nylon rope fashioning please?

-B
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wehrbüchse
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 12:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bserret wrote:
Ahwahnee wrote:
FWIW -- If needs must (with a good battery) you can drive a long way w/o an alternator -- my personal best is over 500 miles but that was only because I didn't realize the the alternator had failed. A temporary water pump belt can be fashioned from a length of nylon rope (did another 300 with that and the aux battery).


Thats Awesome! More details on the nylon rope fashioning please?

-B


Ahwhanee helped me out too, but I'd say don't bother with rope. Took me only a minute to find my bypass belt post using the search tool:

wehrbüchse wrote:
I put a smaller v-belt on to bypass the alternator (DAYCO TOP COG 15300, slipped on tight without un-doing the pulley) and drove it to the muffler shop. Took the guy 10-15 minutes, the stud backed right out!
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