Need help troubleshooting my blinkers

[Bret Young]

Okay guys. Quick question for you all. I have a fresh wiring harness run through my 64 panel (65 Wiring Works harness, they don't carry a 64 one), and despite following the supplied diagram along with the Bentley manual, I have still been troubleshooting piece by piece. I have figured out all of the problems so far, but the current one has be kinda dumbfounded.

So when I push my turn signal lever towards the front of the bus (passenger side blinkers), the turn signal relay (Wolfsburg West 12v relay), it clicks, the lights in the speedometer flash, but when you get out to inspect the lights, nothing up front, but both rear lights flash. Looks like my hazards are on.

I figured to myself maybe i just have two wires switched around at the relay. So i go back into the bus and pull the lever towards me to activate the drivers side turn signals. Same thing happened. Relay clicks like normal, speedometer indicators flash but still just flashing rear lights. So nothing from the front blinkers.

And its not a ground issue or a bulb issue because if I turn on the emergency lights/hazards, they work flawlessly.

Anyone ever deal with this problem when running a new harness? I followed the instructions to a T and hooked up the corresponding colored wires with what the manual/Bentley said. I will crawl back up in there tomorrow to double check, but wanted to see if you guy had any experience with it.

[Jerry]

Sounds like a ground issue.... also check your 9-pin connections one more time.
_________________
Looking for SO34 parts.

thevwcompound *instagram*

[landkholdings]

This may be helpful, it's a wiring diagram with only the turn signal wiring highlighted:

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/info/wiring/65bus_TurnSig.jpg
_________________
Kevin

[BarryL]

On a '65 the green arrows' bulb holder's outer contact is powered constantly from the domelight toggle on the speedo pod. The flasher grounds the bulb to illuminate it. Does it work right when the key is on? How did you wire yours?

[Bret Young]

[Bret Young]

So nobody has had this problem with their blinkers? I hooked up all color-coded wires from the turn signal assembly to the corresponding color-coded wires as specified wires in the wiring diagram from the technical page here and the Wiring Works harness instructions.

I crawled in the bus last night to double check that all the colors were correct, and everything checked out. Trying to figure out what else it could be that is causing the problem.

Any help is appreciated.

[ToolBox]

[Bret Young]

[ToolBox]

[Bret Young]

I sure hope its not FUBAR. I bought it off someone here to replace the wrong year one that came with my bus. It is not in its housing (just hanging right now because the last coat of paint is drying on the housing). I am not an electrical genius, but is there any tell-tale signs that I should look for? I don't really know the problem areas in the turn signal switches...

[coolerthanelvis]

If it's not in the housing then it'll be easy to check. It should look like this:

If you look closely at the little board that the wires are soldered to, you will see letters and a couple numbers that should correspond to the wiring diagram. Your switch should be the same, with the same colors in the same spots. It's kind of hard to tell from the pic but from top to bottom, the wires are black-purple (brake switch), black-yellow (left rear), black-white (left front), black-green (right front), black-red (right rear), and black-green-white (flasher). Also, notice that there are two insulated jumpers going across the switch. If they are not insulated and a wire is touching them then it won't work right.
_________________
Shawn
SV2s member #420
'68 Westy

"Do or do not, there is no try."
-Silent Bob

[telford dorr]

I think the best way to debug this problem is to disconnect the turn signal switch and power up the light wires, one at a time, and see what works and what doesn't. I'd make up one of these (use the proper voltage bulb for your battery voltage):

Use it as the jumper between the battery power source (somewhere on the fuse block) and the light being tested. That way, if anything is shorted, the headlight will harmlessly light up (instead of melting wires).

The post above gives the harness color codes:

- black-yellow = left rear
- black-red = right rear
- black-white = left front
- black-green = right front

- black-purple = power from brake switch
- black-green-white = power from flasher

You want to apply power to the first four (the turn lamps), one at a time, and verify that all the bulbs light up individually. If they don't, then there's a harness issue that you need to solve before messing with the turn switch.

If they all work properly, the next thing to do is to connect a test light between the brake light switch wire and ground, and verify that the brake switch works. Then do the same with the flasher wire.

If all that's OK, then there's likely an issue with the turn switch.
Here's a closer view of the switch (photoshopped version of pic above):

Here's what it does (ignore the high beam wires - you don't have those):

Take your ohmmeter and verify that, with the switch centered, there's a connection between the brake switch input wire and the two rear taillight wires. Do the same for the flasher wire to either the left or right turn light wires with the switch in the left or right turn positions. Make a note of any wire color discrepancies.

If all this works as it should, hook the switch back up and see if all works properly.

If you get stuck somewhere in this (long) process, post here and we'll analyze the issue.

While it seems complicated, it's just a process of elimination. It's do-able. You just have to plug your way through it. Good luck.
_________________
'71 panel, now with FI
'Experience' is the ability to recognize a mistake when you're making it again - Franklin P. Jones
In theory, theory works in practice; in practice, it doesn't - William T. Harbaugh
When you're dead, you don't know you're dead. The pain is only felt by others.
Same thing happens when you're stupid. - Philippe Geluck
More VW electrical at http://telforddorr.com/ (available 9am to 9pm PST)

[BarryL]

Do what these last two posters said. Since two rear lights light simultaneously could you have something in the emergency system haywire? All that system does, in your year bus, is tie all 4 corners together and make them blink.

[Bret Young]

You guys were right. It was a messed up switch. Upon further inspection of the switch, the moving peices inside the switch dont move back and forth with the switch arm and sporadically move where they want. So upon further diagnosis, and working with it, I found that sometimes I would get one front one, then I would get both rears, then I would get none, then I would get ones on opposite corners. Never know what your gonna get. Glad I found it before I started driving it, people around me wouldn't know what the hell was going on.

[Bret Young]

Wanted to bump this thread back up.

I know others have had problems with their blinkers when running the wiring works harness and the WW turn signal relay. I followed the fix in this thread and the other thread I linked further up in this thread, where you have to run a constant power wire from the fuse box to the post on the speedometer, which effectively fixed the grounding issue and the buzzing noise and my blinkers work correctly, but now the turn signal lights in my speedometer don't work.

I know most people would look at this inquiry as odd because the turn signals are working as needed, but I a bit OCD regarding this restoration and want that turn signal light to work in my speedometer.

Has anyone figured out a way to fix both at the same time? It's not like I can plug in double prong onto that terminal and plug a constant power on one side (the fix) and a ground (the wire that made the light operate, but caused the turn signals to go haywire) on the other. I am not an electrical wizard by any standard, but I am sure there is a way to fix this. Right?

[busdaddy]

Try moving the blue K wire to S on the relay (you'll need a piggyback connector).
_________________
Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.

Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!

Слава Україні!

[j.pickens]

After going through the wiring, and finally getting it all hooked up right, I still have intermittent turn signal problems on my '60 bus. Using the test rig shown above with the alligator clips, I have confirmed that it is my turn signal switch, acutually three different used turn signal switches.

I'd like to keep it as stock as possible, and WW doesn't seem to make a commercial turn signal switch (black).

My question is, can I buy the WW switch and just swap the switch and wire part into an original housing? Anybody done this?

Thanks,
j.

Also, I can confirm the S pin (49a) is the one where the blue wire should go, assuming the other lead to the speedo blinker is hooked to the black pos. lead from the ignition switch.
_________________
Founder and Chairman Emeritus, ECMSAS
BBX BBXII and BBXXI Long Distance Award Winner

[BarryL]

[quartermilecamel]

So basically, barrys trying to see if you have signal at all on that light socket.
_________________
Waiting for santa to drop off funky green. I can wish can't I????

[shortwing]