SP Rebuild For Trike ? Help

[johnb]

Hello Everyone. I have a homebuilt VW trike that has a 1600 DP with unknown miles that needs a little help. I have a 1500 SP that was given to me. The problem is Before I knew anything about the VW(and still don't know much) I sent the heads out to be rebuilt. They replaced everything and I now have a set of heads with about $325.00 stuck in them. They did a good job and I would like to use them My trike weighs 1200 lbs dry. If I move forward with this build what things should I do to have a trike that has good power and gas mileage and that I can trust on the road. I am not into multi carbs and big cams, but a little more power wouldn't be a bad thing either. I am open to any and all suggestions. Thanks in advance. John

[Dale M.]

Rear engine or mid engine ... Build a 1641 or 1776 ... Anything larger is going to be defeated by your SP heads.... On a trike a strong 1641 is more than enough to get you into trouble...

You sure about the 1200 pounds... Seems a bit heavy for trike....

Dale
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[morymob]

Sounds a bit steep if hds were just 'rebuilt', was ALL exhaust valves/ guides replaced, any sunken valve seats, just asking as a lot of unsuspecting people get a quick clean (vat ) grind valves & wire wheel valve heads 4 shine quick grind of valve stem ends & call it a rebuild, only 2 in this whole area i trust to do a head, as usual no warranty offered at this time. At a show this yr u could get 2 new hds 4 that price, diff areas, diff prices too.

[johnb]

Thanks for the responses. I should have been a little clearer in my posting. #1 some where I got the impression that the SP are not really worth building.
#2 If they are and it now seems so what would be a good combination for a 1200 pound trike to get a little more power, but I would like to stay with a single carb.But a cam upgrade would be ok.
#3It isn't a road racer and I prefer the secondary roads driving 50-65 mph range, but do need the occasional interstate 70mph .
#4 Good gas mileage right now with the 1600 I got 28-32mpg in that 50-65 range.
#5 I don't want to have to be messing with it all the time, I do the maintenance required and take care of my toys I want it to be as trouble free as possible like it was when I first built it.
I posted a pic of the trike in the Other vw/watercooled area. Thanks John

[volksnhousin]

I would keep your 1500 single port 100% stock. It will do what you describe without touching a thing if everything is working properly. A stock 1500 bug has around an 80 mph top speed. I don't think you need to do anything special to get to your 70 mph. I would concentrate on keeping things as simple as possible and enjoy riding.

Having said that here are some "performance" thoughts:
A common thing to do is to put 85.5 mm or 87 mm pistons and cylinders in a 1500 engine… They slide right in.

Going with 1 or 2 inch taller tires on the back is a way to lower rpms and raise top speed if that is what you want. Andrew

[earthquake]

Here's the picture of his trike from his gallery...

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[vwracerdave]

By removing your dual exhaust and replacing it with a 4-into-1 header exhaust you will gain 3-5 HP. The dual exhaust looks sexy on a trike and buggy but it hurts performance a lot.
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[esde]

last year I did a 1641 single port that surprised me with how well it ran. Total cost in parts and machine work was just over 1k, including $225 to rebuild the heads. Aside from the usual r&r work:
Balanced the rotating assembly
Minor fluff and buff of the single port heads. They're pretty rough as is.
Scat C-25 cam
Full flow oiling, was a small galley single relief case, opened up the main oil galley.
Originally started it with a vacuum distributor and the 30pict with the additional main jet. It ended up in a different bus with an 019 and dual solex carbs.
It was an easy motor to build, and runs great for what it is.
For a trike, I would try a very light flywheel.
SD

[nextgen]

After seeing the photos I now understand 1200 lbs of trike. I would stay with single port also. Real simple nice engine with more then enough power. Better exhaust, which allow a bit larger main jet, a good distributor timed to work with that machine and you will be very happy for a long time.
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[Dale M.]

Yeah... I see the weight numbers now...

Dale
_________________
“Fear The Government That Wants To Take Your Guns"
"Kellison Sand Piper Roadster" For Street & Show.
"Joe Pody Sandrover" Buggy with 2180 for Autocross (Sold)
============================================================
All suggestions and advice are purely my own opinion. You are free to ignore them if you wish ...

[johnb]

Thank you all for the great ideas. I now have to get through Christmas and I will then be able to return to the trike project. I have many things to think about. I will be needing new tires so I will consider an increase in size. Not sure about new exhaust will have to see how the cash flows. Is it worth the jump to 1600 pistons? And what is the lightened flywheel going to do ? Well I guess I have to get busy and read up on what I need to do . I will keep you all informed. Thanks again John

[vwracerdave]

Before you buy larger tires you need to know what gearing you now have in your transaxle. Taller rear tires could hurt performance.

On a trike with an exposed engine it may run cool enough to consider using 87mm pistons for a 1641cc engine.

A lightened flywheel will help it rev quicker.
_________________
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[volksnhousin]

I assumed you had stock size bug tires when I originally responded but it looks like I may have assumed wrongly: Looking at the picture it looks like the tires may be bigger already. What size are the current back tires? Stock bug tires are 165/80/15.

[johnb]

I have it put way for the winter but if I remember they are 205 x75 R15. I am unsure of the gear ratio . I am due for rear tires soon so it could be an opportunity to change

[volksnhousin]

Ah. You already have tires that are two inches taller than stock… Do not go any bigger! If you need to buy new tires get either 205/75/15 or 205/70/15… There is not much difference between the two. The 205/70/15 will make 100 more engine rpms at 65 mph and might have a very tiny bit better acceleration.

Click on specs and the overall diameter is listed on the right:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=C...mpare1=yes
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=K...mpare1=yes

Before you do anything to the engine I would first install it, set the timing, set valves, and drive it quite a bit as is and see what you are working with. Check acceleration, top speed, oil leaks, oil consumption, smoke, bad noises, and so on. You might be happy with it or it might need more attention than once thought: You won’t know until you install it and run it. If the thing uses a lot of oil or there is a lot of oil smoke the piston rings are probably the problem. If you have that issue the easiest thing would be to just make the jump and buy new 1600 or 1641 pistons at that time… 1600 pistons are easier to find than 1500 pistons. Do you still have your 1600 Dual port engine? If you do and it wasn’t using a lot of oil or making oil smoke you can try using the pistons and cylinders from it if you have oil use issues with the 1500. Anyways, those are my thoughts: Try everything as is first before swapping or buying stuff... You don't want to be buying stuff or swapping stuff if you don't need it.

[johnb]

The 1500 I have came to me in a box. Was free so like I said not knowing much about VW I took the heads in and had them rebuilt . I stuck a lot of money in them about 350 so I would like to use the motor if at all possible.The 1600 I have is getting tired and has become unreliable and I am tired of throwing money at it trying to get it running again. That is why I would like to build the 1500 and also I like a challenge . I also have a few friends that are big into bugs so I have help if needed. Like I stated earlier not looking for a hot rod but a little more power wouldn't be all bad either. I have gotten many good ideas from you guys. I bought the bug me video and have started watching it. After the 1st of the year I want to check into some machine work prices and make my final decision on what I am going to do.