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Type 4 Bench ran fine, installed in the bus failing.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 6:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Type 4 Bench ran fine, installed in the bus failing. Reply with quote

Terminatez wrote:
Oh, and this is how the Orings looked before the shims...


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.



They wouldn't go further in. Without the other side coming out the same way. Heads torqued correctly.

After adding the shims they were ok... short push rod tubes or what is your guys opinion?


Either the tubes are too short or the cylinders and/or shim pack too long/thick. How much did you shim the bases of the cylinders?
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Terminatez
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 7:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Type 4 Bench ran fine, installed in the bus failing. Reply with quote

Used .120 cylinder shims to get a CR of 7.9. Type 4 Store recommended a range from 7.6-8.1:1.

I've been wondering why the tubes were like that, guess that's the reason.

What the consensus on using shims on the tubes, spring versions, or just longer ones?

http://www.europeanmotorworks.com/pvw/054-712/type-4-lifters-pushrods/Stroker+Pushrod+Tube
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aeromech wrote:
I don't think I've ever seen an engine in worse shape.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Type 4 Bench ran fine, installed in the bus failing. Reply with quote

0.12" shims seem like a lot especially assuming those are new AMC heads with a step in them. The original VW deck height was around 0.080" and the heads had no step, so your engine may have somewhere around 0.160" of deck which is going to kill your squish.

I would recommend giving The Type 4 Store a call.
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SGKent Premium Member
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 8:14 am    Post subject: Re: Type 4 Bench ran fine, installed in the bus failing. Reply with quote

are you using flat top pistons?
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MorkC68
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 1:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Type 4 Bench ran fine, installed in the bus failing. Reply with quote

If it helps you guys, VW Heritage over here in the UK had a batch of short type 4 pushrod tubes.

When we built our 1911 we found four of them sat incorrectly, a bit like the image. When we removed them and measured them, they sat low when lined up with one another.
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Terminatez
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 4:54 pm    Post subject: Re: Type 4 Bench ran fine, installed in the bus failing. Reply with quote

SGKent wrote:
are you using flat top pistons?



Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.



Type4Store camper special kit bought when the 1975 kit was available early of last year.
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aeromech wrote:
I don't think I've ever seen an engine in worse shape.
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aeromech
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 5:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Type 4 Bench ran fine, installed in the bus failing. Reply with quote

I’m surprised that you’re having issues. I thought the CS was the best available.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 6:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Type 4 Bench ran fine, installed in the bus failing. Reply with quote

Terminatez wrote:
SGKent wrote:
are you using flat top pistons?



Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.



Type4Store camper special kit bought when the 1975 kit was available early of last year.


If that picture was taken with the engine at TDC you have way too much deck and have an engine that will make poor power and is prone to knocking.
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Terminatez
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 8:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Type 4 Bench ran fine, installed in the bus failing. Reply with quote

IIRC, this picture was taken when the shims arrived, don't think engine was at TDC. We opened the box, slapped a few stuff on to see what we were dealing with. My engine builder did the calculations for CR and talked with t4store when doing the calculations. Engine builder is on vacations right now, so I was left with hooking it up to the bus.. we're exchanging emails talking about the current issues. Deck height should have been at .12 inches, the shims gave us that number for a CR of 7.9. Thoughts?


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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1972 Westfalia P30 hardtop Campmobile [On-going Restoration]
aeromech wrote:
I don't think I've ever seen an engine in worse shape.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 9:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Type 4 Bench ran fine, installed in the bus failing. Reply with quote

My preference would be a tighter deck and a live with the compression you get.

I just used the Summit Racing compression calculator using these parameters from memory. Might be some mistakes here?

Bore: 94mm
Stroke: 71mm
Head vol: 57cc
Dish vol: 19cc
Deck height: .040"
CR= 6.94:1

If you change your deck to .120" then you get

CR= 6.08:1
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Terminatez
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 04, 2017 10:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Type 4 Bench ran fine, installed in the bus failing. Reply with quote

Shit.

I believe, it's 50cc for the head vol., I'll have to double check that.
Regardless, it looks like .120 isn't the correct deck height.

I'll keep everyone updated.
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1972 Westfalia P30 hardtop Campmobile [On-going Restoration]
aeromech wrote:
I don't think I've ever seen an engine in worse shape.
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Terminatez
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 10, 2017 1:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Type 4 Bench ran fine, installed in the bus failing. Reply with quote

Ok so I've resolved one issue, a few left though.

I changed the small 3/16 outlet hose and used the 5.5mm Honda hose aeromech recommended long ago. If you're new here, don't be like me. Follow what others already know works. Exclamation Exclamation Exclamation Exclamation Exclamation Exclamation

I tested the fuel pressure but it was still wacky below 2 psi and would not move.

Regulator:
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hly-12-803

I decided to work backwards from the gauge to the regulator. I went online and bought a gauge from summit and also noticed for $7 they had a repair kit for the regulator so I said why not.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/HLY-12-807

Took the gauge apart, used compressed air to test it and it didn't even work. I also took the time to replace the diaphragm from the regulator, and when I opened it noticed the spring was bent poorly. So I'm pretty sure it was a mixture of a bad regulator (now fixed using the kit) and a bad gauge.

Both are now fixed and fuel pressure works as it should now.
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1972 Westfalia P30 hardtop Campmobile [On-going Restoration]
aeromech wrote:
I don't think I've ever seen an engine in worse shape.
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