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glennj3cub
Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2020
Posts: 262
Location: South Carolina
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 Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2020 3:48 pm Post subject: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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How to shift gears??
I assume it’s up, back then to the right up and back. Reverse is pull the lever up and push toward the driver and to the rear?
I’ve not used the shifter yet but the previous owner (who also never drove it) said the previous owner said it was difficult to get into one of the gears.
I’m not sure how it’s supposed to feel not running but I can’t really tell it goes into reverse.
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Glenn 
Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001
Posts: 76963
Location: Sneaking up behind you
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| Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2020 3:52 pm Post subject: Re: 73 Super Bee Hurst Shifter |
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Standard H pattern. It most likely need to be adjusted or there's a problem with the transaxle.
_________________
Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
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volksworld
Samba Member
Joined: November 26, 2011
Posts: 2529
Location: formerly NY currently NC
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| Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2020 5:43 pm Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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| those shifters are pretty miserable and are virtually impossible to adjust if theres any play at all in the shift rod bushing or shift coupling...the difference between going into gears properly or not is moving the shifter side to side thousandths of an inch |
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glennj3cub
Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2020
Posts: 262
Location: South Carolina
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| Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2020 6:04 pm Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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| Thanks, do I need to replace the bushing & coupling? Would that help? |
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ashman40
Samba Member
Joined: February 16, 2007
Posts: 15989
Location: North Florida, USA
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| Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2020 8:58 am Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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| glennj3cub wrote: |
| I’ve not used the shifter yet but the previous owner (who also never drove it) said the previous owner said it was difficult to get into one of the gears. |
You may need to adjust the position of the shifter base.
Hint: If you have trouble getting into a certain gear (or gears) move the shifter base in the opposite direction. For example, if you cannot get the transmission to slide into 3rd gear, move the base slightly left and rearward. This applies more pressure to get into the 3rd gear gate. If you have trouble w/ 3rd & 4th, slide the base to the left.
Difficulty finding gears is often a sign the shift rod bushing (located below the shifter) could be worn out. To check, remove the shifter and with a pair of pliers try to move the shift rod up/down/left/right. Any excess play in the rod means the bushing (located just rear of the shifter opening in the tunnel) needs to be replaced. By design, the rod should only move fore/aft/CW/CCW.
| glennj3cub wrote: |
I’m not sure how it’s supposed to feel not running but I can’t really tell it goes into reverse.
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The pic of your shifter base hints to the reason you can't feel reverse. The reverse lock out for that style of shifter is dependent on the disc at the base of the shaft (visible just below the crescent cut plate). When you pull up on the reverse lock out ring at the top of the shifter you are lifting the disc up so it can clear a barrier on the right side of the shifter base. My Empi shifter had too much play in the lock out adjustment so the disc sat too low when at rest and would allow the shifter to slide into the reverse gate w/o lifting the lock out.
Try lifting the reverse lock out ring a few mm and see if you can now feel the "barrier" that prevents the shifter from going into the reverse gate. To fix my shifter I ended up wrapping a few coils of bailing wire into the space below the ring that you pull up on to keep the ring slightly raised when at rest. When done, there will be a small gap at the split in the shaft just below the "I" in EMPI. The other way to fix it would be to take the shifter apart and adjust the tension in the cable running from the ring to the disc.
_________________
AshMan40
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'67 Beetle #1 {project car that never made it to the road  }
'75 Beetle 1200LS (RHD Japan model) {junked due to frame rot}
'67 Beetle #2 {2019 project car - Wish me luck!} |
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Cusser
Samba Member
Joined: October 02, 2006
Posts: 31389
Location: Hot Arizona
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Jimbug57
Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2002
Posts: 817
Location: Mid Michigan
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| Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2020 9:27 am Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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| Cusser wrote: |
| Chances are that you'd be happier with a stock shifter. |
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2377264
My '73 SB came with some kind of fancy shifter. I got a stock one off The Samba and made it look new again. I also replaced the bushing and coupler.
The one I took out worked fine - just not my cup of tea. Maybe I'll dig it out and post a pic and someone might know what it is.
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Repeat after me "I am smarter than metal!" |
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ashman40
Samba Member
Joined: February 16, 2007
Posts: 15989
Location: North Florida, USA
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| Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2020 9:29 am Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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Found a good video that shows how the Hurst trigger shifter (which the Empi is patterned after) lockout works.
Link
_________________
AshMan40
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'67 Beetle #1 {project car that never made it to the road }
'75 Beetle 1200LS (RHD Japan model) {junked due to frame rot}
'67 Beetle #2 {2019 project car - Wish me luck!} |
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tcmia
Samba Member
Joined: April 30, 2019
Posts: 212
Location: Cleveland TN
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| Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2020 10:20 am Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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| I also have one of those sifters. I took it apart and cleaned everything really good and greased all moving parts. That helped some, but it was only better after I replaced the rivets with bolts and lock nuts. Its still not as good as a stock unit, but much much better than it was. The rod bushings were still good. Next i have to come up with a boot for it. The plastic cover is not staying on very long. I am thinking making a trim ring and get one of the generic leather boots and make up something. |
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glennj3cub
Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2020
Posts: 262
Location: South Carolina
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| Posted: Mon Nov 23, 2020 6:30 pm Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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I just getting around to working on the shifter and or replacing the rear part. Can’t think of the name of it right now.
Just beginning to drive her some and found problems with shifting. I’m not sure if most of it comes from the shifter or the rear.
1 st gear is pretty much a blind guess, 2nd I find OK but 3 rd is crazy. I have to go for 4th to get it lined up then go to 3rd, like synchronizing it. Then 4 th is ok. Gearing down is another hit or miss thing.
The rear part does not look very lose so the front may be the primary culprit! |
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ashman40
Samba Member
Joined: February 16, 2007
Posts: 15989
Location: North Florida, USA
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| Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2020 7:51 am Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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| glennj3cub wrote: |
| 1 st gear is pretty much a blind guess, 2nd I find OK but 3 rd is crazy. I have to go for 4th to get it lined up then go to 3rd, like synchronizing it. Then 4 th is ok. |
Since your troubles are with the forward gears (1st and 3rd) you could try moving the base of the shifter towards the rear of the car. This will apply more leverage as you shift into these gears hopefully making it easier to find/slide into them. Be careful you don't move too far and create a problem for 2nd & 4th.
_________________
AshMan40
---------------------------
'67 Beetle #1 {project car that never made it to the road }
'75 Beetle 1200LS (RHD Japan model) {junked due to frame rot}
'67 Beetle #2 {2019 project car - Wish me luck!} |
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glennj3cub
Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2020
Posts: 262
Location: South Carolina
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| Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2020 8:04 pm Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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I didn’t realize the shifter was adjustable. When I pull the shifter I guess I’ll see it.
Thanks! |
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ashman40
Samba Member
Joined: February 16, 2007
Posts: 15989
Location: North Florida, USA
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| Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2020 7:18 am Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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The two base bolt hole/slots in the shifter base are larger than they need to be. This allows the base to be slid a small amount in all directions. It means you should not expect to bolt it up and it will be perfectly aligned. Adjustment of the base is expected. When adjusting, make very small adjustments and then snug the bolts down before you test the shifting effectiveness. You are looking for the "sweet spot" that allows sufficient movement of the ball at the bottom of the shifter shaft to slide you into each gate of the shift pattern, including reverse.
The stock shifter holes were smaller and didn't allow as much adjustment.
Just realize that the pivot point is at the top of the shifter base. This means the bottom ball of the shift lever moves in the opposite direction from the top of the shaft. When you are trying to shift into 1st gear the ball at the bottom of the shaft is trying to move rearward and to the right. If you have trouble going into first you would adjust the shifter base slightly rearward and to the right to further push it into the 1st gear gate.
_________________
AshMan40
---------------------------
'67 Beetle #1 {project car that never made it to the road }
'75 Beetle 1200LS (RHD Japan model) {junked due to frame rot}
'67 Beetle #2 {2019 project car - Wish me luck!} |
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jarmchairpilot
Samba Member
Joined: March 04, 2013
Posts: 459
Location: GALWAY,IRELAND
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| Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2020 1:24 pm Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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Here's the funny thing about adjusting the alignment for the gears,
if you need the gearstick to move over to the Left... side more you move the baseplate a touch more to the Right.
That's the main thing to remember.
Guess what if you need the gearstick to adjust forward more?
That's it, you move the baseplate a touch back.
I recommend that you do the messy job underneath the car of draining the litre of gearbox/transmission oil and replace it with new synthetic ep90 for easier gearshifts.
Standard gearbox oil is fine too and cheaper but it doesn't flow well at freezing temperatures.
You will need a large hex. key to open the gearbox sump in the centre of the gearbox and a small flexible spout to pump oil in to refill it. It's best to drain the oil after a drive so the oil is warm but be careful not to get burned by the exhaust or heat exchangers. |
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jarmchairpilot
Samba Member
Joined: March 04, 2013
Posts: 459
Location: GALWAY,IRELAND
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| Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2020 1:32 pm Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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| My tip for keeping the correct gearstick alignment after you finally nail it correctly is to simply give a quick blast of a red ,white or yellow rattle can paint spray to the metal around the baseplate where it sits on the chassis so that when anyone needs to make a change in the future it is really easy to line everything up without making lots of adjustments again. |
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glennj3cub
Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2020
Posts: 262
Location: South Carolina
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| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2020 1:24 pm Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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I removed the shifter, there is very little room to slip the shifter but the female end does wobble around very loosely with the shifter ball removed.
I cleaned the mechanism and this small guard looking piece fell out. It appears to have been tach welded at each end and was broken off. All I know to do is to use JB Weld. ???
Also the left side of the mechanism (the spring loaded bar) only pulls up when the handle is moved to the right which is opposite of the reverse side. I’m confused about that?
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Michael Ambrozik
Samba Member
Joined: October 17, 2020
Posts: 631
Location: San Jose, CA
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| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2020 1:39 pm Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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| Go to the samba classifieds and get a OE shifter the EMPI shifters are junk. The stock shifters have the adjustment and fell you will be happy with. Just looked in the classifieds and there are plenty of stock shifters for sell prices from $15.00-$40.00. |
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ashman40
Samba Member
Joined: February 16, 2007
Posts: 15989
Location: North Florida, USA
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| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2020 2:13 pm Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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| glennj3cub wrote: |
| I removed the shifter, there is very little room to slip the shifter but the female end does wobble around very loosely with the shifter ball removed. |
Do you mean the cup end of the shift rod inside the tunnel wobbles around? The cup at the end of the rod in the tunnel should rotate CW/CCW along the axis of the rod and be able to slide forward and rearward.
The cup should NOT move up/down/left/right. Any play in these directions means the shift rod bushing or the bracket in the tunnel is worn. The rod is held firmly in place as it runs thru bushing mounted in a hole in the support bracket inside the tunnel. If the bushing is worn the rod is loosely held and becomes very hard to find gears when shifting. Here is a good pic showing how the rod is suspended:
Everything in the above pic is inside the tunnel.
| glennj3cub wrote: |
I cleaned the mechanism and this small guard looking piece fell out. It appears to have been tach welded at each end and was broken off. All I know to do is to use JB Weld. ???
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This is bad. You need to reattach that metal bracket. It is the reverse lockout. From the above video it appears the outer edge of the bracket rests flush with the outer edge if the shifter base. But any misalignment could mean the shifter will not slide easily into the 1-2 and 3-4 gates.
You probably want to assemble the shifter on the center tunnel and and hold that bracket firmly in place. Then work the shifter thru a four gears making sure they slide easily into each. Slide that plate a little left and a little right until you find the perfect spot where the shifter lines up with both vertical gates. Note this position and weld or bond the lockout plate permanently in that spot. Get it wrong and it could be difficult to slide into each gear.
| glennj3cub wrote: |
Also the left side of the mechanism (the spring loaded bar) only pulls up when the handle is moved to the right which is opposite of the reverse side. I’m confused about that?
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The disc on the shaft is meant to contact the inside face of the crescent shaped piece. Your disc appears to be sitting too low. My guess is the cable between the trigger and that disc is too long. Try pulling up on the trigger just a bit until the disc hits the crescent piece. This crescent piece is the outer side of the 3-4 gate.
With the disc at this height, swing the shifter to the left and the disc should still be low enough that it contacts the loose lock out plate that broke off. The at rest height of the disc needs to be low enough that it is stopped by the broken lock out plate, but high enough that is contacts the inside of the crescent plate. I had to add some wire below the trigger as a spacer to keep it held up enough. You could also disassemble the shifter and adjust the length of the cable connecting the trigger to the disc.
This is all from memory so I hope it helps.
_________________
AshMan40
---------------------------
'67 Beetle #1 {project car that never made it to the road }
'75 Beetle 1200LS (RHD Japan model) {junked due to frame rot}
'67 Beetle #2 {2019 project car - Wish me luck!} |
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glennj3cub
Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2020
Posts: 262
Location: South Carolina
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| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2020 3:30 pm Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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Correct me if I’m wrong but if the disk does not fit below the crescent spring loaded piece, it won’t be pulled up. But then I don’t understand what the purpose is anyway.
The part that broke off seems to be a guard that keeps it from going into reverse unless I pull up on the shifter. ?? |
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glennj3cub
Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2020
Posts: 262
Location: South Carolina
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| Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2020 8:54 pm Post subject: Re: 73 Super Beetle EMPI Shifter |
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Correct me if I’m wrong but if the disk does not fit below the crescent spring loaded piece, it won’t be pulled up. But then I don’t understand what the purpose is anyway.
The part that broke off seems to be a guard that keeps it from going into reverse unless I pull up on the shifter. ?? |
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