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Pepperbilly Samba Member
Joined: April 08, 2017 Posts: 977 Location: Seattle, Wa
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Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2021 3:47 pm Post subject: 412 Fender Beading |
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I think the fender beading on type 4’s is different from all others.. Trying to find some for my ‘73 wagon. Looks like it is a “flat” profile. Anybody out there have success locating the proper material? A few of us out here are trying to restore to factory fresh. You gotta love the challenge!
Bill |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21521 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2021 5:15 pm Post subject: Re: 412 Fender Beading |
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There are actually 3 different profiles. Starting at the front.....is the flat "T" profile fender beading that goes from the lower part of the fender under the headlight....up around the headlight where a portion of the T is not used and was either molded that way or trimmed off. It fits between fender and center chassis.
The second profile runs from just on the top side of the headlight under the edge of the hood.....along the top of the fender and is very similar to standard round top bug fender beading. I think the rear edge of the center between fender and door was sealed with a flat strip or the same profile as above the fender.
The rear strip...rear of the back door along the top exge of rear fender is the same as the type 3 "P" profile. It goes down the rear of the back fender...is trimmed/notched at the corner....and goes down to the end of the hatch.
From the hatch to tail light (sedans) or from the tailight down to apron....it reverts to the "T" profile like the front.
I have never in my life found a single piece of type 4 fender beading available.
Like other fender beading...it was colored to match the paint. But....it was not painted over at the factory. It was put on after paint.
This also means that it does not seal for shit and is major rust generator. It is also VINYL.....which means in sunny places with warm weather.....in about 6-8 years.....it curls and shrinks up.
I searched high and low for years. So.....in light of its other issues along with being unobtanium.....and it NEVER came in rolls like aftermarket beading.....each was a custom die cut part......I decided that I would not use detachable fender beading.
I decided ...and did some testing and experiments years back......that when I am ready to paint.....the fenders will be properly spaced and tightened down using stainless fender washers between body panels and chassis.
Then I will mask the areas requiring beading......and use a shaped spreader tool.....to apply paintable acrylic urethane, 25 year architectural caulk (home stores....xylene based). Caulk from both sides. Tape....apply...shape.....dry....seal the underside of the gaps under fenders....dry. Then wet sand shortly before priming with the rest of the body.
Then paint. Its slightly flexible.....and if you do a good job it will be indistinguishable from factory beading.....and the paint seals it....and it will not shrink.
My extra reasoning is that the only reason my fenders would EVER need to be removed ....is if I get hit and need body work. In that case.....it needs paint.....and in that case will have the fender beading redone as well.
Ray
Last edited by raygreenwood on Mon Aug 16, 2021 4:13 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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NurseryWalt Samba Member
Joined: January 29, 2016 Posts: 145 Location: Abbotsford, BC
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Posted: Mon Aug 16, 2021 11:47 am Post subject: Re: 412 Fender Beading |
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Thanks for the detailed answer Ray. Just not the answer I was hoping for (and I didn't even ask the question). At some point I too will get to the point of searching for fender beading. Silly me, I thought I could substitute something generic!
If you do find a lead, let me know!
Walter _________________ '66 Bug with collector plate and '73 412 project |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21521 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Mon Aug 16, 2021 4:27 pm Post subject: Re: 412 Fender Beading |
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NurseryWalt wrote: |
Thanks for the detailed answer Ray. Just not the answer I was hoping for (and I didn't even ask the question). At some point I too will get to the point of searching for fender beading. Silly me, I thought I could substitute something generic!
If you do find a lead, let me know!
Walter |
See....you CAN use something generic......if you can work with the appearance difference.
I am not saying its ugly. But it is noticable. Years ago....like 2001....when I was still driving the 412 daily and it was in rolling restoration mode.....I tried some standard round/ball top fender beading that you find on bugs.....available by the roll. This is the beading that normally goes between fenders and body.
And...for instance on the rear fender to rear quarter panel of a bug......because of the curvature of the fender connecting to the nearly vertical quaryer panel.....kind of a perpendicular fit.....it FITS there really well. You do not notice that its shape is technically a ball or bead on top of a stalk.......because its wedged in a triangular galley.
With me so far?
But.....when you use it between two essentially flat adjacent surfaces....like the front apron and gront fender under tbe headlight.....and the same under the rear tail light......the ball stands out relatively proudly from the surface.
It does not look "bad" but is a bit noticable.....and it does not SEAL. You still need to apply sealer to each side where the ball contacts the flat surface.
Now.....it WILL work fine.....along the top of the fender uner the ledge of the hood front and rear. The trick is.....that while tightening the fender bolts....you will need an assistant to press down hard on the beading to wedge it in tight....to deform it to seal....while you tighten the bolts.
It could probably work ok on the top of the rear fender.....same application method....but at least in that area....its wedged into a two sided triangular space similar to bug fender and quarter panel. I just never personally tried to apply any of it there.
The big issue....to me.....is that they are all VINYL.....PVC. The lifespan of PVC out in any kind of weather....even not in weather.....is a clock ticking from the day it is born as it outgasses, hardens and distorts.
Add in the fact that neither the orihinal beading or bug beading seal particularly well and ot has led to gnarly rust.....
Its why I made the decision to look for a better material.......and to really seal these areas well.....when I finally move forward. Ray |
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