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Installing engine: Won't slide in
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gergokocsis
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2022 10:20 am    Post subject: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

Hi everyone!
While installing my engine I've run into a problem. I could line up the bottom engine studs with their holes on the gearbox housing and I could slide the engine in but just halfway. On every available source about engine reinstalling it seems that everybody could just push the engine back into place with little to no trouble. Some says that it took a few minutes of wiggling to finally pop it into place but I've been trying for days with no success.

I haven't replaced the clutch or did anything to that area that could influence the alignment since the removal. The flywheel is perfectly parallel to the bell housing and the bottom studs are inside their holes. The engine can move freely, the heater boxes aren't banging against the firewall. I've rotated the crankshaft a dozen times so the input shaft can align but that didn't help either. I've tried putting the car in gear and rotating one wheel while holding the other to rotate the shaft too but no success.

I've been wrestling with it for days, does anyone have any tip?

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matthew henricks
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2022 10:24 am    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

Curious what parts you did change while the engine was out? That may give you a clue to why it wont go in. Also can you tell where exactly is it sticking?

My initial thought was the clutch is either out of rotation or out of alignment but it sounds like you have checked that.

Not alot of help but maybe food for thought.
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vwoldbug
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2022 11:02 am    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

When you pull the engine back out do you have a clutch alignment tool to check alignment . Also do you have a helper. What repair did you do.
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Michael Ambrozik
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2022 12:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

It looks like you installed new trans mounts, The studs that mount to the transmission are to long and need to be cut down.
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Cusser
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2022 3:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

matthew henricks wrote:
Curious what parts you did change while the engine was out? That may give you a clue to why it wont go in.


That, and whether this is the same engine that came out of the VW.

And if you posted your location, gergokocsis - someone here might be close and could help you get that seated within 15 minutes.



[quote="gergokocsis"]I've been trying for days with no success.
I've been wrestling with it for days, does anyone have any tip?

Get some experienced help, will be easy !
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Last edited by Cusser on Wed Jun 01, 2022 3:31 pm; edited 1 time in total
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gt1953
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2022 3:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

Seems like the clutch disc is ou of alignment. I have had the same issue, would not go in. A freind had a transmission input shaft, loaned it to me, realighned the clutch disc, then the engine slipped in.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2022 3:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

gt1953 wrote:
Seems like the clutch disc is out of alignment. I have had the same issue, would not go in. A friend had a transmission input shaft, loaned it to me, realigned the clutch disc, then the engine slipped in.


gergokocsis has few posts, and may be new to the VW world. He did not state whether his pressure plate had been removed, if it's the engine that came out of it, what he did while the engine was out, or his location. So it's tough to help without more information.

Myself - I do have a steel input shaft for aligning the clutch disc, and also found my wooden alignment tool. But when the wooden tool was misplaced for a decade, I did use pieces of old broom handle, even a dowel with area built up with duct tape. Easy if you know how to R&R an engine....
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gergokocsis
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2022 4:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

I've pulled the engine last November to change the trans mounts and to change the gearbox nose cone, so I didn't do anything to the engine, yes it is the engine that came out in November. I can wiggle it around the center so I suppose the input shaft is not lining up. I didn't checked the clutch alignment because I've assumed that it didn't change in the past few months, is it possible that that's the problem? I work alone and I'm located in Hungary, Europe so I don't think that any of you would be within a few minutes of drive.
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[email protected]
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2022 5:58 pm    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

Michael Ambrozik wrote:
It looks like you installed new trans mounts, The studs that mount to the transmission are to long and need to be cut down.


This is the only issue I have ever had in hundreds of engine installs that completely baffled me. If the threads are quite a bit past a wave washer, and a standard non-locking nut, there is your issue. Color the face of the teeth of the flywheel with a marker, and see if any is rubbed off on an install attempt. The studs on the mount in the pic below were about 1/8 of an inch too long.

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Cusser
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2022 6:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

gergokocsis wrote:
I've pulled the engine last November to change the trans mounts and to change the gearbox nose cone, so I didn't do anything to the engine.

Then likely the clutch disc is still where it had been.


[email protected] wrote:
Michael Ambrozik wrote:
It looks like you installed new trans mounts, The studs that mount to the transmission are to long and need to be cut down.


This is the only issue I have ever had in hundreds of engine installs that completely baffled me. If the threads are quite a bit past a wave washer, and a standard non-locking nut, there is your issue. Color the face of the teeth of the flywheel with a marker, and see if any is rubbed off on an install attempt. The studs on the mount in the pic below were about 1/8 of an inch too long.


Worth looking into...
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Last edited by Cusser on Thu Jun 02, 2022 6:16 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2022 6:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

Cusser wrote:
But it looks like he installed the new mounts with the bolt heads up in the bell housing, not from underneath - at least on the one we can see. But agree that if bolt heads were on the outside, then the threaded part would be too long.

The bolts that can be seen in either of the OP's pics are not the ones that can cause the problem, regardless of which way the bolts have been installed. You're only seeing the bolts that attach the mounts to the transmission cradle.
As seen in the picture below, the ones of concern are the two circled studs extending out of the mounts inward through the bellhousing.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2022 7:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

If it not the mount bolt interference as indicated above then put the tranny in gear and turn the crankshaft pulley while pushing (you need to line up the splines on the clutch disc and the tranny output shaft so it goes together).
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gergokocsis
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2022 2:10 am    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

No, I don't think the trans mount bolts are the problem. Here you can see that the end of the studs are barely past the nuts inward the bell housing.

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AirHead1966
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2022 4:59 am    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

If there is nothing binding, then making sure that the car is lifted higher in the back than the front and the engine is going in at an angle (sloping towards the front of the car) would help lodge it in place.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2022 5:10 am    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

Possibly the pilot bearing inside the gland nut has self destructed and is blocking the input shaft.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2022 6:19 am    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

gergokocsis wrote:
No, I don't think the trans mount bolts are the problem. Here you can see that the end of the studs are barely past the nuts inward the bell housing.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Yes, that looks fine.

I always loosen the wingnut on the clutch cable to its end, and grease/lube/clean that BEFORE I install any engine, then adjust the clutch cable after the install. I know you stated you didn't monkey with the clutch or cable, but that might be worth a try.

Yes, Hungary is a long way from Arizona, so I won't be traveling there to help.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2022 6:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

Did you have a tough time pulling the engine back when removing .
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gergokocsis
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2022 6:39 am    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

I didn't have a tough time pulling it, it came out easily. I have read somewhere that when someone was stuck where i am now, they put two long bolts in the upper two mounting holes and cranked it down until the engine popped into place. I don't know, it sounds a bit unorthodox. Wouldn't it damage the input shaft?
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2022 7:12 am    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

gergokocsis wrote:
I didn't have a tough time pulling it, it came out easily. I have read somewhere that when someone was stuck where i am now, they put two long bolts in the upper two mounting holes and cranked it down until the engine popped into place. I don't know, it sounds a bit unorthodox. Wouldn't it damage the input shaft?


You've heard it a bunch of times... make sure the clutch is properly aligned using a pilot tool. Unless I missed something, you haven't checked it.

Mechanical work is often a methodical process of elimination. Don't assume anything isn't a problem until you've checked it. Go for the obvious stuff first, the low hanging fruit so to speak. Takes minutes to align the clutch disc. Takes days of screwing around if it isn't aligned.


Forcing things = breaking things. If it don't go, figure out why.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2022 7:20 am    Post subject: Re: Installing engine: Won't slide in Reply with quote

gergokocsis wrote:
I have read somewhere that when someone was stuck where i am now, they put two long bolts in the upper two mounting holes and cranked it down until the engine popped into place. I don't know, it sounds a bit unorthodox. Wouldn't it damage the input shaft?


I strongly advise AGAINST doing this !!!!

I've installed about 100 VW engines, most often by myself....
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