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DanHoug
Samba Member
Joined: December 05, 2016
Posts: 4808
Location: Bemidji, MN
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 Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2024 6:35 am Post subject: Re: Changing rear wheel bearing while on the road |
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| mtnhome wrote: |
| DanHoug wrote: |
| Bill just moved the bearings together until the spacer stayed in position, put the circlip and seals in, stub, and did a final high torque with a strong impact wrench. . |
Hopefully the outer bearing rollers were NOT touching the spacer to hold it in place. The inner race of the outer bearing is free floating.
When I rebuilt my rear hubs, the hub was packed with grease and the spacer stayed put on its own.
Sodo provides an excellent write up in this thread.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=776438 |
You’re right! The inner race of the outer bearing slides in from the outside so now i’m not sure what i saw. He did comment that he was surprised at how tight my hub was to the outer races, had to be pulled into place. He’d seen them very loose to the point of barring re-use of the hub.
I’ll look over Tom’s thread and see if i can make sense of things. He did pack the space with grease and after drawing the bearings in, just moved the spacer with the tip of a screw driver.
_________________
-dan
60% of what you find on the internet is wrong, including this post.
'87 Westy & '89 Westy both 2.1 4spd
Past projects can be found at--
www.thefixitworkshop.com |
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ZsZ
Samba Member
Joined: December 11, 2010
Posts: 1647
Location: Budapest Hungary, Europe
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Abscate
Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014
Posts: 22677
Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2024 8:04 am Post subject: Re: Changing rear wheel bearing while on the road |
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Well done , you should post a guy like that the shop rate to pull parts, plus FMV
That makes it nice for the next guy in a jam , too
😀
Do you guys ever thing of cracking that big nut , lubing before a road trip ? It’s not coming loose at 300 plus cotter pin
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.ssS! |
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Sodo
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 9630
Location: Western WA
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2024 8:11 am Post subject: Re: Changing rear wheel bearing while on the road |
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| Abscate wrote: |
| Do you guys ever thing of cracking that big nut , lubing before a road trip ? It’s not coming loose at 300 plus cotter pin |
Yep if that nut's been tight 35 years, that's a good idea.
If your van is at a shop, for any reason - a shop that has a big air wrench etc, pay the mechanic to bust your nuts loose.
Add a little grease to the nut, re-torque, re-pin. (<-----simple, quick, low cost)
Then when you're ready to re-pack (or needle-grease) you can be certain it will come apart at home.
As long as you don't wait 'til y2044.
However, if it's really been 20+ years, it's better idea to...
at least....
needle-grease the bearing,
push out all the old grease that you can.
Replace inner seals if you can ( this is easy if you have rear disc brakes).
Replace the outer seals for sure.
_________________
'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb |
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E1
Samba Member
Joined: January 21, 2013
Posts: 6615
Location: Westfalia, Earth
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2024 8:26 am Post subject: Re: Changing rear wheel bearing while on the road |
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| bsrad wrote: |
| E1 wrote: |
Veddy intedesting……
Our rears have Zerk fittings just for this purpose… perhaps I should use them. |
I installed zerks on a set of carrier several years ago. Be careful with those. Just one too many pumps and the grease will push that outer seal out of the carrier. Ask me how I know…. On my current rebuilt carriers I did not drill and tap zerks in them. |
On second thought, I’d love more input on how much grease I could safely add to my zerks…
One challenge is I don’t know what grease was used, but have some red, high-pressure Stabil in stock. I presume that’s similar to Redline’s but dunno, temperature point is 550.
_________________
‘84 Westy, 2.1L with Digijet, 5.43 R+P, GT Gears
"Adding power makes you faster on the straights.
Subtracting weight makes you faster everywhere."
— Colin Chapman |
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shagginwagon83
Samba Member
Joined: February 07, 2016
Posts: 3805
Location: VA/TN
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2024 9:07 am Post subject: Re: Changing rear wheel bearing while on the road |
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Okay so speaking of breaking nuts, when I try to break my nut, I can't do so with my 16" Mercedes CLK Fuchs. I have to put an OG steel wheel on, put it on the ground, and then break the nut.
I need to check to see if I can do this with my Mercedes wheels.
_________________
Brandon
"Jo Ann" - '83.5 Westfalia EJ22e w/Peloquin
Instagram @joannthevan |
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shagginwagon83
Samba Member
Joined: February 07, 2016
Posts: 3805
Location: VA/TN
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2024 9:11 am Post subject: Re: Changing rear wheel bearing while on the road |
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Right about the zerks. It's sealed - so no where for old grease to go. I don't plan to add zerks, rather needle grease every now and then.
_________________
Brandon
"Jo Ann" - '83.5 Westfalia EJ22e w/Peloquin
Instagram @joannthevan |
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Abscate
Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014
Posts: 22677
Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2024 11:12 am Post subject: Re: Changing rear wheel bearing while on the road |
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You crack a stuck nut with heat, not with force. Break the chemical bond of the thread and nut with a series of hot/cool down cycles - at least three.
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Sodo
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007
Posts: 9630
Location: Western WA
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2024 11:57 am Post subject: Re: Changing rear wheel bearing while on the road |
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Pumping grease into a closed system..... very risky.
I'd keep it down to one or two pumps max every few years.
There is some benefit as the grease is 'displaced'
and forced to move around a little.
Perhaps with luck,
your inner seal is worn loose and the extra grease leaks
into the trailing arm....
rather than onto the brakes.
If you pull the hub out of the seal, the pressure cannot rise.
But that means you have to bust your nuts etc.
Valid modus operandi for zerk-equipped hubs could be:
Bust nuts.
Pull hub off the axle stub.
If you do this periodically like every 10-20k miles:
Pump some grease thru a grease nipple.
Look for grease emerging into the seal area around the stub axle.
When you see _any_ grease emerging, stop, dig out all the grease you can get out, and put it back together.
If seldom, like 50,000 miles etc.
Pump like a S.O.B. and rotate the stub,
until you see only clean grease coming out.
Then take out the spacer and dig out all the grease you can,
trying to leave as much airspace as you possibly can attain.
Put in a new seal or two or four and re-assemble.
_________________
'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb |
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Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50360
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2024 12:40 pm Post subject: Re: Changing rear wheel bearing while on the road |
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| Abscate wrote: |
Well done , you should post a guy like that the shop rate to pull parts, plus FMV
That makes it nice for the next guy in a jam , too
😀
Do you guys ever thing of cracking that big nut , lubing before a road trip ? It’s not coming loose at 300 plus cotter pin |
I would say that the removal force is typically around 1000 ft*lbs. |
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DanHoug
Samba Member
Joined: December 05, 2016
Posts: 4808
Location: Bemidji, MN
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2024 5:41 pm Post subject: Re: Changing rear wheel bearing while on the road |
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| Sodo wrote: |
Replace inner seals if you can ( this is easy if you have rear disc brakes).
Replace the outer seals for sure. |
So Bill had made a cool tool for this…. The inner seal has restricted access thru the trailing arm hole for the driveshaft. To pull this seal while on the car, Bill took a standard Tee handle double beaked seal puller, took the arm off, and put a 3/8” drive square hole in the beak part. It took about 10 seconds to reach in and pop the seal using a ratchet handle.
_________________
-dan
60% of what you find on the internet is wrong, including this post.
'87 Westy & '89 Westy both 2.1 4spd
Past projects can be found at--
www.thefixitworkshop.com |
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DanHoug
Samba Member
Joined: December 05, 2016
Posts: 4808
Location: Bemidji, MN
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2024 5:48 pm Post subject: Re: Changing rear wheel bearing while on the road |
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| Wildthings wrote: |
| Abscate wrote: |
Well done , you should post a guy like that the shop rate to pull parts, plus FMV
That makes it nice for the next guy in a jam , too
😀
Do you guys ever thing of cracking that big nut , lubing before a road trip ? It’s not coming loose at 300 plus cotter pin |
I would say that the removal force is typically around 1000 ft*lbs. |
and if your van has even thought of salted roads, the threads on the shaft will be rusted and chowder the nut threads as it comes off. Wire wheel the stub threads clean before taking the nut off and have a new one on hand. You may have to run a thread file or die over the stub threads too. Use anti seize on the threads both coming off and going on.
_________________
-dan
60% of what you find on the internet is wrong, including this post.
'87 Westy & '89 Westy both 2.1 4spd
Past projects can be found at--
www.thefixitworkshop.com |
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Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50360
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2024 8:45 pm Post subject: Re: Changing rear wheel bearing while on the road |
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| DanHoug wrote: |
| Wildthings wrote: |
| Abscate wrote: |
Well done , you should post a guy like that the shop rate to pull parts, plus FMV
That makes it nice for the next guy in a jam , too
😀
Do you guys ever thing of cracking that big nut , lubing before a road trip ? It’s not coming loose at 300 plus cotter pin |
I would say that the removal force is typically around 1000 ft*lbs. |
and if your van has even thought of salted roads, the threads on the shaft will be rusted and chowder the nut threads as it comes off. Wire wheel the stub threads clean before taking the nut off and have a new one on hand. You may have to run a thread file or die over the stub threads too. Use anti seize on the threads both coming off and going on. |
Just turning the nut an extra 40° may get the tightening torque up to the range of 600-800 ft*lbs, and then years of exposure to the elements is going to make it take even more torque to remove. I will certainly agree on using never seize on the threads. I am sure I have removed ones that have seen road salts that took 2000 ft*lbs to remove, though at some point heat becomes a better alternative than more torque. |
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