Hello from Spain, suspension question.

[saharien]

Hello, my name is Joan, and I’m writing from Barcelona, Spain. I’m the owner of a 1970 VW 1300 that I’m currently restoring.

Believe me, I’ve searched the forum before posting this, but I haven’t been able to find specific answers to my question, and sometimes I’ve even come across conflicting information.

Here’s the situation: I want to raise the car enough to achieve a Class 11 look and fit off-road tires, but I don’t want to cut the fenders. I want to keep the original aesthetics but lift it within reasonable limits for daily use. I’m looking to fit 215/75-15 tires with the proper wheels. The rear suspension is a swing axle.

Another option I’m considering is fitting slightly larger tires at the rear compared to the front—perhaps 215/75-15 at the rear and 175/80 at the front. I’m a bit confused about this…

Specifically, I have the following questions:
• How much should I lift the front, and what’s the best way to do it? Is the simplest method cutting and rotating the front suspension tubes?
• How much can I lift the rear without causing the camber to go positive?
• After reaching a “reasonable maximum lift,” what tire sizes will fit, and what wheel dimensions are needed?

Thanks in advance for your help!

[oprn]

On a swing axle any and all lift will result in increased camber period. There is no way around it. You have to decide how much you are willing to accept as the the risk of rollovers increases as you increase the camber.

The only 2 ways to get more height without a large camber increase is reduction boxes from an older type 2 which comes with a lot lower gearing or change the car to IRS rear suspension. Both require extensive changes.
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[Wulfthang]

What about a body lift? Aren't VW's "liftable"?

[saharien]

Thank you very much for the reply. So, I understand that zero camber is achieved at the original ride height, and anything above that adds positive camber? The rear seems to be sagging, I think by at least an inch. At the original suspension height, would a 215/75-15 or 195/80-15 fit without rubbing? Or what is the maximum tire height that fits without rubbing?

[saharien]

[ORANGECRUSHer]

buy a different car. One where someone who's not afraid has done all the work for you.
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[petrol punk]

The only way you're going to lift a swingaxle without getting positive camber is to use a reduction gear box transaxle out of a bus. If you don't want to go through the trouble of that and don't want positive camber all your lift in the rear will be from the tires. I've ran 700x15s, 235/75r15s, 205/75r15s, and 205/70r15s on my BJ/IRS bug. My experience is any one of those is fine in the rear, I didn't have issues with rubbing in the rear. The front is a different story. 205/70R15s rub a little. 215/75R15s rub more but it's not intolerable. 235/75R15s and 700x15s rub so bad you have the turning radius of a full size truck. Very annoying at times. If you have 195/80/R15s in your market you could try those on the front and 215/75R15s in the rear to get *slightly* more ground clearance out of the rear. Keep in mind a stock motor will be a dog with big tires.
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[saharien]

Thank you very much for your clear response. It’s exactly what I needed to know. I’ll go for the setup you mentioned. I assume the wheel offset will be ok with something between ET34 and ET20, which are the most common sizes for original wheels.

[autohaus]

Hello

I have lift spindle (in France) if you need
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[trilogymac]

I'm going through the same thing now on my 57. here is a photo of the rear being raise 2" by indexing the spring plate. The tires are 215 75 15. To much camber for my taste.

I purchase a set of large nut reduction gear boxes for approximately 3" of lift without camber. I am also installing adjusters and lift spindles on the front beam. Russell at Old Speed in CA makes 2-1/8" lift spindles for a link pin beam and he also makes a bolt in kit (spring plates, spacer and hardware) for the RGB. It also looks like I may have to narrow the beam 2-4" because the lift spindles add 2" of track width. I'll know better when the spindles are installed.

This is a decent size, expensive project. All my life I have wanted a lifted oval so I'm making it happen, but, lifting a full fendered, swing axle/link pin car properly, is much more extensive than a ball joint/IRS car. Its worth it to me but I do my own wrenching and welding. Hope this helps!!
Bill

[Crogg]

A body lift solves your issue. I use body lifts on my VW's and have 235's under one of my bugs. Reduction boxes is a good idea if you can find some. I run bus transmission for better gearing with tall tires.

[Dusty1]

My old '67 practically set itself up. I used to swap out the entire front suspension once a year. OEM Mexican beams were cheap back then. If became obvious how far the back had sagged when I installed my fancy new front suspension. I raised the back one click and ditched the Z bar. I took the Z bar off because the links were rusty. No Z bar... no rusty links.

And they all lived happily ever after.


The camber never bothered me. I was almost born in a Bug. I may have spent more time in old Bugs than anywhere else.


I may go with IRS Thing suspension next time.

.
.

[Dusty1]

My '67 practically set itself up. I used to swap out the entire front suspension once a year. OEM Mexican beams were cheap back then. If became obvious how far the back had sagged when I installed my fancy new front suspension. In other words new OEM torsion leaves in the front gave me my ride height without compromising the stock ride.

I raised the back one click and ditched the Z bar. I took the Z bar off because the links were rusty. No Z bar... no rusty links.

And they all lived happily ever after.


The camber never bothered me.

I may go with IRS Thing suspension next time.

.
.

[Dusty1]

My '67 practically set itself up. I used to swap out the entire front suspension once a year. OEM Mexican beams were cheap back then. If became obvious how far the back had sagged when I installed my fancy new front suspension. In other words new OEM torsion leaves in the front gave me my ride height without compromising the stock ride.

I raised the back one click and ditched the Z bar. I took the Z bar off because the links were rusty. No Z bar... no rusty links.

And they all lived happily ever after.


The camber never bothered me.

I may go with IRS Thing suspension next time.

.
.

[saharien]

Hello and thanks for the help, agree too much camber. I’m carrying out all fabrication and mechanical work myself. I’m planning to install reduction boxes to compensate for the altered final drive ratio caused by the larger rear tires.

Regarding the front suspension, would repositioning the center pin on the beam, by cutting and rewelding it at a revised angle, not suffice to adjust the caster and ride height?

I’m hesitant to narrow the front beam, as it could compromise suspension articulation and reduce the effective torsional flexibility of the torsion leaves.