Best electronic ignition for my on road dune buggy

[Bikerndiver]

I currenly have a 1600 dp with twin carbs and dual cannon exhaust. I intend to remove the twin carbs and go back to a single carb. I finally obtained all the parts to change back to a single, OEM style carb. However, as I do this, I also want to change to electronic ignition. For a daily driver, which electronic ignition system is best?
Please, no debate on points vs EI.... I understand the points arguement, but want to make the change to an electronic ignion. Also, am I better off with the entirely new distributor with electronic built in, or just the module to put in my current distributor?
Thanks!!!
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1966 Manx clone (possibly a Joe Poty Enterprises) named SANDY. '70 to '73 1300 cc w/1600 DP heads, twin carbs and headers

[Glenn]

Just buy a Pertronix, at least it's a name brand.

The Hot Spark and other copies are much worse.

Personally i'd run a Winterburn CDI system and use points to trigger it. Since its just a switch and carries no current, you don't need a condenser and the points will never pit. Just lube the cam at every oil change and you're good for years of driving.
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Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"

Member #1009

#BlueSquare

עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי

[oprn]

Here is my experience with the Pertronics III complete system including matching distributor, coil and wires.

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=711733&highlight=
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Our cars get old, we get old but driving an old VW never gets old!

[Dale M.]

I have had good luck with Compufire (points replacement module), but not sure if quality is still there since Compufire was bought by Pertronix...

https://socalautoparts.com/product/ignition-module-fits-bosch-009-050-distributors/

https://socalautoparts.com/product/ignition-module-fits-vacuum-advance-distributors/
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“Fear The Government That Wants To Take Your Guns"
"Kellison Sand Piper Roadster" For Street & Show.
"Joe Pody Sandrover" Buggy with 2180 for Autocross (Sold)
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All suggestions and advice are purely my own opinion. You are free to ignore them if you wish ...

[Glenn]

A customer came in with an intermittent ignition issue. We replaced the Pertronix III with points and condenser and he's been good ever since.

I'll be happy to sell you a slightly used Pertronix III for half price.

_________________
Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"

Member #1009

#BlueSquare

עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי

[modok]

Best.......
Ford TFI module or good CDI
controlled by
msd 8680 or speeduino or megasquirt
triggered by
a generic GM mag pickup, or optical, or compufire, or points if below 5500 rpm

You didn't say what distributor, but it doesn't matter, the above works for any distributor.
pertronix was never the best at anything and they never tried to be either

It would probably be "best" to get rid of the dual cannons and put the dual carbs back on

[clonebug]

Last time I bought a Pertronics module it was about $80.00.....Accidentally hooked it up backwards on one of my winter maintenance schedules and fried it...went back to points and then upgraded to MS-1 with crank trigger..best $350.00 I ever spent.
I've never had an ignition issue since and that has been since 2011..... Come to think about it I haven't had a distributor since then either.
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[Bikerndiver]

Does anyone have any preference between the module that goes in the distributer or the whole Pertronix distributer????
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1966 Manx clone (possibly a Joe Poty Enterprises) named SANDY. '70 to '73 1300 cc w/1600 DP heads, twin carbs and headers

[Bikerndiver]

It would probably be "best" to get rid of the dual cannons and put the dual carbs back on[/quote]

Oh no...the cannons are the dune buggy look to me. I just put on new stainless steel cannons. Love those.
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1966 Manx clone (possibly a Joe Poty Enterprises) named SANDY. '70 to '73 1300 cc w/1600 DP heads, twin carbs and headers

[modok]

34pict experts (which I am not)
Generally agree that that carb and manifold needs the heat riser to function well, and be paired with the right distributor to function right.

A 34pict and dual cannons usually sucks, but don't really know if reason it runs so poorly is because the heat riser doesn't function, or if it's just screwing up the carb signal. Or both.
Probably can be improved a lot, but in any case sounds like a good job for somebody else to do. My heart would just not be in it.

[EVfun]

How about going with a bolt in HEI system to get a stronger spark? I was thinking something like the CB Performace Mangnaspark or Pat Downs Shockwave distributor. For little more than a well rebuilt older Bosch points type distributor and a points replacement module it should be a noticeable ignition upgrade.
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[oprn]

I have had dual cannons and stock center mounted 30 PICT-2 with the correct matching distributor run reasonably well. The 34 PICT-3 not so much. I am guessing the higher velocity of the smaller carb maybe offsets/masks somewhat the unequal impulse from the dual cannons?
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Our cars get old, we get old but driving an old VW never gets old!

[mikedjames]

Fifteen years ago, the Pertronix Ignitor 1 was a good bulletproof points replacement.

The Ignitor II that replaced it tends like all of the other in-distributor modules to suffer from failure after being fried by heat soak off a VW engine.

There are components soldered into the module that are heat sensitive and not really rated to the 220+ degrees you see above a stopped aircooled engine. Great on water-cooled where temperatures will be lower.

(I have stripped down both an Ignitor 1 and a modern clone ignitor module with a Dremel to take a look. )

Coupled with packaging it with a cheaply made distributor and you now have issues with that too.

I once searched AlieExpress and found I could buy VW fit ignitor modules for $1500 for 500 units and SVDA style distributors for about $15 each.

I dont know if any brands we use actually buy these, but if I were in their shoes I would be tempted.

The mark-up on the prices then nicely covers the cost of customer returns.

The European 123 distributor may be expensive but over here in the UK, Pertronix are stupid prices too now.

I have owned too many Pertronix and other in-distributor modules before realising that doing the same stupid thing over and over is not productive.
I own a box of ignition coils as often I suspected these instead of the module.

The Ignitor 1 I had first died from the wire-swap trick. Or the saga would not have started.

I went back to points, 1000 miles later the new condenser failed.
So I built an EDIS-4 based crank fire ignition system.
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Ancient vehicles and vessels

1974 VW T2 : Devon Eurovette camper with 1641 DP T1 engine, Progressive carb, full flow oil cooler, EDIS crank timed ignition.
Engine 1: 40k miles (rocker shaft clip fell off), Engine 2: 30k miles (rebuild, dropped valve). Engine 3: a JK Preservation Parts "new" engine, aluminium case: 26k miles: new top end.
Gearbox rebuild 2021 by Bears.

1979 Westerly GK24 24 foot racer/cruiser yacht Forethought of Gosport.
1973 wooden Pacer sailing dinghy

[Luftwagen 2180]

Yeah, I agree with the look off the dual cannons. I have a Holley 32/36 off my old Plymouth Horizon that seems to work well for me. I've been tempted over the years to try dual carbs but there are a lot of threads (some long) about jetting and tuning. Not my idea of how I want to spend my time. My buggy is a 2180 with everything about stock otherwise, built for an airplane. Lots of torque, which is what I want in my advancing years, 5,000 rpm is just too noisy.

I don't have any carb heat but do run the exhaust to intake manifold heat. It does run poorly when it gets too cold to drive even with the roof on, but then I don't usually drive it anyway. I did weld "scoops" in the exhaust pipes to help with the manifold heat and that seems to greatly help with the intake heat. 1 for pressure and 1 for suction.

[Luftwagen 2180]

After posting my reply, I realized that I didn't answer the OP question . This engine came with a Compufire module in a 009 distributor. It's been a number of years now and a trip to Phoenix and back and it's still working well.

[liquidrush]

[Glenn]

Not worth my time.

The customer has moved on an is happy with the way it runs with points.
_________________
Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"

Member #1009

#BlueSquare

עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי

[TheRookie]

I've been running a cheap Ali Express unit in my car now for over 2 years with no issues at all .

I do have a spare in the car for just in case

[esde]

I have seen a lot of the Pertronix knockoffs go into the round can within a month of being installed.. especially the EMPI and KUHLTECH flavors
ANd everyone I know that swore by Pertronix now has gone back to points, or 123, or the CB unit
Of course every once in a while one actually lasts on someone's car, and it fools people into thinking maybe they are a safe purchase.
I do like the simplicity of stock points and condenser, $10 worth of spare parts in the glove box is all you need for a backup plan
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modok wrote:
Bent cranks are silent but gather no moss. I mean, ah, something like that.

[mikedjames]

And yesterday, I managed to damage the coil on my wasted spark system.

One plug lead was lying by the spark plug and because the system runs with more energy around the place it was firing the plug OK.

Until it moved away and the voltage went up even more. And in the end it flashed over inside the coil and connected itself to the primary by burning a trail of a few thousand ohms of carbon.

So then no1 plug was shorted out by the carbon.

Lots of pops and bangs as it started to happen then it settled to running on three cylinders.


As my trip back home was about 15 miles and there were few big hills or road junctions, I drove it home.

About half a mile from home the ignition shut down with pops and bangs a couple of times, but I restarted it and coasted the last 200 yards ..

I have ordered a couple of coils , one replacement and a spare. Still less than $50 for two coils. And fitted points based ignition which feels less lively (maybe because it is a Bosch original rather than a tweaked ignition map.)
_________________
Ancient vehicles and vessels

1974 VW T2 : Devon Eurovette camper with 1641 DP T1 engine, Progressive carb, full flow oil cooler, EDIS crank timed ignition.
Engine 1: 40k miles (rocker shaft clip fell off), Engine 2: 30k miles (rebuild, dropped valve). Engine 3: a JK Preservation Parts "new" engine, aluminium case: 26k miles: new top end.
Gearbox rebuild 2021 by Bears.

1979 Westerly GK24 24 foot racer/cruiser yacht Forethought of Gosport.
1973 wooden Pacer sailing dinghy