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MiltonGhia
Samba Member
Joined: September 11, 2021
Posts: 32
Location: Toronto, Canada
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 Posted: Sat Sep 11, 2021 5:53 pm Post subject: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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Hello from Toronto Canada
I recently acquired a 63 Ghia Coupe in need of some TLC and in doing some research stumbled across this forum, it seems like a great community with lots of helpful info, many of my questions have already been answered using the search function. But I know I will have many more.
The gentleman I bought the car from didn't know much about it as he was given the car by somebody who owed him money, which is not ideal but the price was right. The car runs (poorly) and does not drive, I'm currently trying to learn more about it and figure out what it will need to be a decent driver.
What he could tell me is the car was "restored" about 15 years ago and has been sitting for 10. It was originally red, painted teal and now has a fiber glass front clip. He also told me the motor has been changed to a 2000CC dual carb. Can anyone tell me does this look like a 2000CC motor (if you can tell) and what does this make for HP roughly? I have also attached a photo of the only part number I could find on the motor but it did not help me in getting any answers.
Last edited by MiltonGhia on Sun Sep 12, 2021 9:24 am; edited 1 time in total |
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obus 
Samba Member
Joined: March 08, 2001
Posts: 11812
Location: just off Garden State Parkway Exit 81
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Marcdeb
Samba Member
Joined: May 22, 2019
Posts: 3268
Location: Vermont
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| Posted: Sat Sep 11, 2021 6:36 pm Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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Welcome to TheSamba. This is a great resource and the Ghia Forum has lots of very knowledgeable people.
Your car is made up of quite a blend of parts from many different years. The seats appear to be from 1971. The rear quarters are patch panels for 72 to 74 as they have indentations for the larger bumpers. The side mirrors are not from any Ghia. Your dash looks mostly correct for a 63. As to your engine, I don't know, but someone will surely answer you questions. I suspect your engine is not an original stock German block, but I'm only guessing.
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Marc
68 Karmann Ghia Cabrio Autostick
71 Karmann Ghia Cabrio
Previously Owned:
2011 VW EOS Hard Top Conv
2008 Saab 9-3 2.0T Conv
2003 Saab 9-3 SE Conv
2001 Saab 9-3 Conv
1998 BMW 3 Series Conv
1997 Saab 900 Conv
1997 Mazda Miata
68 Ghia Vert Survivor with 22,350 miles: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=768107&highlight=
71 Ghia Vert Restoration: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=726710&postorder=asc |
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obus
Samba Member
Joined: March 08, 2001
Posts: 11812
Location: just off Garden State Parkway Exit 81
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Ian Godfrey
Samba Member
Joined: September 25, 2006
Posts: 1217
Location: Melbourne Australia
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| Posted: Sat Sep 11, 2021 6:41 pm Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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Welcome to the forum.
your car looks like an unusual collection of parts. the pan and dash looks to be early 60's, but the seats are late 60's early 70's, and the rear corners of the body have the indentations for the last of the KG bumpers in the 70's.
Hard to tell you much about the engine, but it is a 1600 twin port (late 60's) and has dual Kadron carbs and what looks like a Berg breather. With the Kads and the exhaust you would be lucky to get 100 hp. the engine size is harder to work out without taking it apart. Big VW engines are a product of bore size and stroke. Very common are some bigger piston and barrels which can take the capacity of a 1600 to 1776 and up to 1914cc. To get to 2000cc you need a stroker crankshaft. The case AS21 should be a good foundation for the motor as long as it is not to worn to line bore
The fiberglass front end and spun tank definitely give the car a race 'look'.
I'm sure other will chime in particularly on the body/pan.
i would be curious to see a photo of the gear box as it will tell us more. |
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Rome
Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2004
Posts: 10819
Location: Pearl River, NY
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| Posted: Sat Sep 11, 2021 7:07 pm Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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(edit: all responses since the OP's came in while I was composing mine; therefore partially duplicate info)
Welcome to theSamba and to Ghia ownership! You have a "Frankenstein" Ghia with all of those body modifications and rust repairs... The nose's side attachment clamps are really overly large and clumsy looking. Will you try to integrate a sleeker fastener design? That rectagonal indent-corner on your right rear fender under the taillamp is indicative of a generic rust repair panel for a '72 and later Ghia that has the large bumper...
So, the engine... Man, that exhaust system just looks "busy", with all the junk hanging down in direct view from the rear. The carburetors are Kadron (Brazilian Solex) 40 mm single-throats which can work from stock 1600 dual port all the way up to 2+ liters. Just seeing the rest of the engine we cannot decisively determine what the displacement is, or verify that it's a "2000 cc" aka 2-liter. There are a few ways to achieve approx. 2 liters, with the most traditional configuration being 78 mm stroke x 90.5 mm bore. That comes to 2007 cc. Another is 76 mm stroke x 92 mm bore = 2021 cc.
To determine the stroke, you could remove one of the rear spark plugs, rotate the engine by hand so that the piston is at bottom dead center, insert a pencil into the cylinder so that it rests against the piston, mark where the pencil comes out of the plug hole, then rotate the engine until that cylinder reaches TDC. Mark the pencil at the same engine reference point so that you get the piston/crankshaft travel, and measure. But since the stroke is only half of the displacement formula, you really cannot determine the bore other than taking the engine out, removing one of the heads, and measuring the piston diameter. Those pushrod tube seals, at least the red ones, are already cracking at the engine case side so removing both heads to replace the seals with new, ivory-colored ones would be prudent.
Fan shroud and cylinder tins are cheap aftermarket units instead of original German. The fan shroud does not have the outlets for the forced-air heat that goes through the heater boxes. Your engine probably has "J-tubes" that go from the front cylinders to the header connection. The cooling parts appear to be chrome, whereby the fan shroud was painted black and the paint is peeling off the chrome. Those fan shrouds tend to have less air cooling vanes inside compared to German shrouds.
Your crankshaft pulley is a small-diameter "power" pulley which is usually used for drag racing engines because the smaller diameter does not rotate the engine fan as much and supposedly frees up a few HP. But such a pulley is not optimal for a street-driven engine; just replace it with a stock diameter pulley which is usually approx. 7" diameter.
When you adjust your valves, you'll see a 9-digit part number inside the head below the right rocker shaft attachment tower. The first 3 digits can give a clue as to the valve sizes; such as 311, 040, 041, 043, 044. Though some of those can be fitted with larger size valves by a machine shop.
You can probably get the engine to run decently after setting the valve clearances, checking your ignition timing, points clearance, running some new gas through the carbs, and synchronizing the carb linkage to make certain that both carbs' throttles are opening off idle at exactly the same time. The Kadrons have been around for decades and are easy to take apart, clean, and note some minor adjustments.
The tall air filters on the Kadrons interfere with the 2 engine lid springs that are normally directly above them. That's why the springs were removed and you have the stick to keep the lid up. On my Ghia with Kads, I installed shorter air cleaners- maybe half the height of yours, to keep the lid springs. Actually what I did was to take the perforated metal screen that surrounds the air filter element, cut it in half, used each half on each carb, and used a 6" round foam element from a garden tractor for the filter element. Then used a metal tube as spacer under the air filter support stud.
Seats are '69 or later with the separate headrests. The '69 seats have a narrower seat track than '68 and earlier. Wonder if among the rust repair, later pans were fitted and '69 tracks welded in? |
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MiltonGhia
Samba Member
Joined: September 11, 2021
Posts: 32
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Sun Sep 12, 2021 5:01 am Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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wow! you folks know your stuff, Thank you for the links and information everyone.
| obus wrote: |
| since it is already custom i would clean it up, get it running and stopping properly, and drive it like ya stole it |
^ That is the plan, get it cleaned up, as reliable as possible and drive it! |
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MiltonGhia
Samba Member
Joined: September 11, 2021
Posts: 32
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Sun Sep 12, 2021 5:34 am Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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| Rome wrote: |
(edit: all responses since the OP's came in while I was composing mine; therefore partially duplicate info)
Welcome to theSamba and to Ghia ownership! You have a "Frankenstein" Ghia with all of those body modifications and rust repairs... The nose's side attachment clamps are really overly large and clumsy looking. Will you try to integrate a sleeker fastener design? That rectagonal indent-corner on your right rear fender under the taillamp is indicative of a generic rust repair panel for a '72 and later Ghia that has the large bumper...
So, the engine... Man, that exhaust system just looks "busy", with all the junk hanging down in direct view from the rear. The carburetors are Kadron (Brazilian Solex) 40 mm single-throats which can work from stock 1600 dual port all the way up to 2+ liters. Just seeing the rest of the engine we cannot decisively determine what the displacement is, or verify that it's a "2000 cc" aka 2-liter. There are a few ways to achieve approx. 2 liters, with the most traditional configuration being 78 mm stroke x 90.5 mm bore. That comes to 2007 cc. Another is 76 mm stroke x 92 mm bore = 2021 cc.
To determine the stroke, you could remove one of the rear spark plugs, rotate the engine by hand so that the piston is at bottom dead center, insert a pencil into the cylinder so that it rests against the piston, mark where the pencil comes out of the plug hole, then rotate the engine until that cylinder reaches TDC. Mark the pencil at the same engine reference point so that you get the piston/crankshaft travel, and measure. But since the stroke is only half of the displacement formula, you really cannot determine the bore other than taking the engine out, removing one of the heads, and measuring the piston diameter. Those pushrod tube seals, at least the red ones, are already cracking at the engine case side so removing both heads to replace the seals with new, ivory-colored ones would be prudent.
Fan shroud and cylinder tins are cheap aftermarket units instead of original German. The fan shroud does not have the outlets for the forced-air heat that goes through the heater boxes. Your engine probably has "J-tubes" that go from the front cylinders to the header connection. The cooling parts appear to be chrome, whereby the fan shroud was painted black and the paint is peeling off the chrome. Those fan shrouds tend to have less air cooling vanes inside compared to German shrouds.
Your crankshaft pulley is a small-diameter "power" pulley which is usually used for drag racing engines because the smaller diameter does not rotate the engine fan as much and supposedly frees up a few HP. But such a pulley is not optimal for a street-driven engine; just replace it with a stock diameter pulley which is usually approx. 7" diameter.
When you adjust your valves, you'll see a 9-digit part number inside the head below the right rocker shaft attachment tower. The first 3 digits can give a clue as to the valve sizes; such as 311, 040, 041, 043, 044. Though some of those can be fitted with larger size valves by a machine shop.
You can probably get the engine to run decently after setting the valve clearances, checking your ignition timing, points clearance, running some new gas through the carbs, and synchronizing the carb linkage to make certain that both carbs' throttles are opening off idle at exactly the same time. The Kadrons have been around for decades and are easy to take apart, clean, and note some minor adjustments.
The tall air filters on the Kadrons interfere with the 2 engine lid springs that are normally directly above them. That's why the springs were removed and you have the stick to keep the lid up. On my Ghia with Kads, I installed shorter air cleaners- maybe half the height of yours, to keep the lid springs. Actually what I did was to take the perforated metal screen that surrounds the air filter element, cut it in half, used each half on each carb, and used a 6" round foam element from a garden tractor for the filter element. Then used a metal tube as spacer under the air filter support stud.
Seats are '69 or later with the separate headrests. The '69 seats have a narrower seat track than '68 and earlier. Wonder if among the rust repair, later pans were fitted and '69 tracks welded in? |
Thank you for all the info, I will take your advice on the pulley and replace it for something more street friendly. Do you think this would do?
https://www.cip1.ca/c24-113-105-251-g/
The nose fasteners - Those side fasteners have to go, a friend suggested hood pins up top and thinks we can make them work. I also need to figure out the hinges for the front clip, they were seized so the old man I bought the car from cut them to access the fuel tank. I've been checking out websites that sell the fiber glass front clips but can't find any hinge kits, anybody have a suggestion for replacement hinges?
I'm starting to order some of the obvious things I need right now, having a bit of a frankenstein may make that tough. This might be a stupid question but does all the glass look 63? I'm assuming none of that has been touched but want to be sure, I am ordering new seals for front and rear windshields, quarters and door windows.
Was also thinking I would like to put some bumpers back on it for a more complete look, If I was to source the 56-66 Euro style could they work, or is this a no go on an American Ghia?
https://www.cip1.ca/vwc-143-798-104/
Drop spindles - I know my car has front drums and fairly certain it has the link pin front set up also. These should be okay?
https://www.cip1.ca/c13-22-2858/
Thank you for all the input and info so far, it is greatly appreciated as I am a newby to these cars and the aircooled world. Although excited about this project feeling a bit of intimidation as well so I do appreciate the patience regarding some of my dumb questions. |
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Rome
Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2004
Posts: 10819
Location: Pearl River, NY
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| Posted: Sun Sep 12, 2021 6:25 am Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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Bumpers: The ones to which you linked would work well, though they are quite expensive. I think a major problem will be how to mount the front ones to your flip nose. Wait- I see you already have nerf bars in the front; your repro bumpers would use stock T-style brackets and fasten to the same locating points as the nerfs. I realize you first need to figure out a sturdy hinge at the bottom of the nose that attaches to your steel pipes coming off the front axle. There are probably no reinforcement ribs on the inside of the nose where you could mount the front bumper brackets so that they would also swivel with the nose. As such, the front bumper would be regarded simply as ornamental, though would likely still meet your province's inspection law if applicable. If you post a photo of the inside of the flip nose, even by just laying it on a clean surface upside-down, then we can see if there is anything/bracing/ribs on the inside onto which you could attach the bumper brackets.
The rear bumper would be fastened using stock-style "T" brackets to the same holes where your nerf bars are. The fronts of the bumper blades have a fastening nut which is fastened to the body thru an approx. 1/2" hole about 2" back from the rear curve of the wheelwell. On your car that hole has been filled in, but you can probably feel the back side of it in the wheelwell. That bolt keeps the blade from moving up and down when the car goes over bumps. wjoef gallery of right rear quarter panel showing the hole-
And you'd need to fill in that rectangular corner on the quarter panel from the late rear bumpers, because it would look very mismatched to have the blade bumpers go over that indented area. Hope you have access to the current body color for having a can of spray paint touch-up mixed at a good auto body supply store...
Rather than spend all that $ for those CIP stainless ones, how about considering fiberglass bumpers? These are simply the blades, no overriders, but the pair costs less than $300. You could either paint the blades in your body color, a contrasting color such as gunmetal grey or silver, or have them wrapped with chrome-look vinyl. You still have to figure out a mounting method for the front bumper. https://www.glass-action.com/index.php/products/ghia-products/Euro-Bumpers-p70394710
Drop spindle: yes, you have a link pin front axle. I would suggest first figuring out your nose hinge, the bumpers, engine and brakes before you think about the spindles. You want to have the nose in a consistent mounting position to see the gap of the tops of the tires to the fender edge. Might be that with all of the inner steel body cut out, that the nose and fender edge could be down low enough so that you don't need the drop spindles. A more sensible modification would be to consider a disc brake kit for the front, which usually needs a later, dual-circuit style master cylinder. The front end has been lightened considerably with so much original metal cut out, that the discs might lock up the front tires already at moderate braking. This is another reason why you should first get the current stock brakes in good order. You can also buy better brake shoes from aircooled.net before making the jump to the disc kit. |
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MiltonGhia
Samba Member
Joined: September 11, 2021
Posts: 32
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Sun Sep 12, 2021 8:18 am Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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| Rome wrote: |
Bumpers: The ones to which you linked would work well, though they are quite expensive. I think a major problem will be how to mount the front ones to your flip nose. Wait- I see you already have nerf bars in the front; your repro bumpers would use stock T-style brackets and fasten to the same locating points as the nerfs. I realize you first need to figure out a sturdy hinge at the bottom of the nose that attaches to your steel pipes coming off the front axle. There are probably no reinforcement ribs on the inside of the nose where you could mount the front bumper brackets so that they would also swivel with the nose. As such, the front bumper would be regarded simply as ornamental, though would likely still meet your province's inspection law if applicable. If you post a photo of the inside of the flip nose, even by just laying it on a clean surface upside-down, then we can see if there is anything/bracing/ribs on the inside onto which you could attach the bumper brackets.
The rear bumper would be fastened using stock-style "T" brackets to the same holes where your nerf bars are. The fronts of the bumper blades have a fastening nut which is fastened to the body thru an approx. 1/2" hole about 2" back from the rear curve of the wheelwell. On your car that hole has been filled in, but you can probably feel the back side of it in the wheelwell. That bolt keeps the blade from moving up and down when the car goes over bumps. wjoef gallery of right rear quarter panel showing the hole-
And you'd need to fill in that rectangular corner on the quarter panel from the late rear bumpers, because it would look very mismatched to have the blade bumpers go over that indented area. Hope you have access to the current body color for having a can of spray paint touch-up mixed at a good auto body supply store...
Rather than spend all that $ for those CIP stainless ones, how about considering fiberglass bumpers? These are simply the blades, no overriders, but the pair costs less than $300. You could either paint the blades in your body color, a contrasting color such as gunmetal grey or silver, or have them wrapped with chrome-look vinyl. You still have to figure out a mounting method for the front bumper. https://www.glass-action.com/index.php/products/ghia-products/Euro-Bumpers-p70394710
Drop spindle: yes, you have a link pin front axle. I would suggest first figuring out your nose hinge, the bumpers, engine and brakes before you think about the spindles. You want to have the nose in a consistent mounting position to see the gap of the tops of the tires to the fender edge. Might be that with all of the inner steel body cut out, that the nose and fender edge could be down low enough so that you don't need the drop spindles. A more sensible modification would be to consider a disc brake kit for the front, which usually needs a later, dual-circuit style master cylinder. The front end has been lightened considerably with so much original metal cut out, that the discs might lock up the front tires already at moderate braking. This is another reason why you should first get the current stock brakes in good order. You can also buy better brake shoes from aircooled.net before making the jump to the disc kit. |
Rome - Your knowledge of these cars is impressive, Thank you very much for your input. Fantastic suggestion with the fiberglass bumpers! I really like that look, and I would prefer to not spend the $1400+ if I don't have too. This is the perfect alternative. I am going to have the car resprayed once I'm happy with the body, as close to the current color as I can get it.
Great advice for the front end as well, right now because it is so light i'll replace the drum brakes and see how she does, if its not sufficient i'll make the leap to the discs. As for clearance I was thinking about a lower profile tire, that should free up some space for the spindles, I'm not opposed to the low look  Speaking of low - Do you think the rear end is sagging or is that normal ride height in the back? My friend commented "looks like your rear suspension is shot and sagging" I imagine the shocks are not great and have already ordered 4 new KYB from my local parts shop in town anyhow but just curious is that correct height or will the new shocks lift it up?
I don't have a photo of the inside of the flip nose, its at my friends shop but I will snap one Monday and post it, I'm all ears for suggestions on figuring it out. Thank you again! |
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MiltonGhia
Samba Member
Joined: September 11, 2021
Posts: 32
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Sun Sep 12, 2021 9:27 am Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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| Ian Godfrey wrote: |
Welcome to the forum.
your car looks like an unusual collection of parts. the pan and dash looks to be early 60's, but the seats are late 60's early 70's, and the rear corners of the body have the indentations for the last of the KG bumpers in the 70's.
Hard to tell you much about the engine, but it is a 1600 twin port (late 60's) and has dual Kadron carbs and what looks like a Berg breather. With the Kads and the exhaust you would be lucky to get 100 hp. the engine size is harder to work out without taking it apart. Big VW engines are a product of bore size and stroke. Very common are some bigger piston and barrels which can take the capacity of a 1600 to 1776 and up to 1914cc. To get to 2000cc you need a stroker crankshaft. The case AS21 should be a good foundation for the motor as long as it is not to worn to line bore
The fiberglass front end and spun tank definitely give the car a race 'look'.
I'm sure other will chime in particularly on the body/pan.
i would be curious to see a photo of the gear box as it will tell us more. |
Thank you Ian, I will get some gearbox photos this week and post. I am eager to learn as much as possible about this car. |
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Rome
Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2004
Posts: 10819
Location: Pearl River, NY
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| Posted: Sun Sep 12, 2021 7:58 pm Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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This will certainly work, if you want to buy a new one rather than finding a used one at a swap meet or from a CDN seller. Stock pulleys have at least one small groove in the inner side of the belt's V channel for a timing mark. You'd have to hold a degreed timing pulley over the stock one to see what degree it is for your static ignition timing. Too bad that Mark's VW parts business appears to no longer be in the Toronto area. There was also John's Bug Shop down near Niagara Falls. Per another thread he closed that shop but is still working out of a NAPA store in Welland.
Since your engine looks like it was built in the 1980's and has a mechanical-advance distributor, this style pulley would be much better. It has the black ring with single degree markings for good contrast and accuracy, stock size and the 5 large holes. This style is traditionally known as a "Santana" due to the company that first made them in the late 1960's and 1970's. Unfortunately it is out of stock from the CDN CIP1. https://www.cip1.ca/c15-80227/
This one is in stock, but has only every other degree marked. Might be your best compromise. https://www.cip1.ca/acc-c10-5882/ |
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MiltonGhia
Samba Member
Joined: September 11, 2021
Posts: 32
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2021 3:38 pm Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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| Rome wrote: |
This will certainly work, if you want to buy a new one rather than finding a used one at a swap meet or from a CDN seller. Stock pulleys have at least one small groove in the inner side of the belt's V channel for a timing mark. You'd have to hold a degreed timing pulley over the stock one to see what degree it is for your static ignition timing. Too bad that Mark's VW parts business appears to no longer be in the Toronto area. There was also John's Bug Shop down near Niagara Falls. Per another thread he closed that shop but is still working out of a NAPA store in Welland.
Since your engine looks like it was built in the 1980's and has a mechanical-advance distributor, this style pulley would be much better. It has the black ring with single degree markings for good contrast and accuracy, stock size and the 5 large holes. This style is traditionally known as a "Santana" due to the company that first made them in the late 1960's and 1970's. Unfortunately it is out of stock from the CDN CIP1. https://www.cip1.ca/c15-80227/
This one is in stock, but has only every other degree marked. Might be your best compromise. https://www.cip1.ca/acc-c10-5882/ |
Once again Thank you Rome, unfortunately I have already ordered the stock one and it has been shipped, I'll try make it work.
Someone else also recommended Johns Bug Shop to me, but yes looks like its no more. I have spoken with a shop here locally that is confident they can help me in this journey "Davies" in Mississauga |
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rcooled
Samba Member
Joined: September 20, 2008
Posts: 2860
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
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| Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2021 4:33 pm Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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| MiltonGhia wrote: |
| I recently acquired a 63 Ghia Coupe in need of some TLC...the price was right. |
Hope you got a smokin' deal on this one. It'll be a big job taking it back to a safe and dependable driver, but with enough $$ and effort, it can be done.
I see that some engine compartment sheetmetal has been replaced...how's the rust situation in the rest of the car?
| Quote: |
| ...the car was "restored" about 15 years ago |
Describing it as "restored" would be mighty generous indeed.
Just curious: Do you plan on using this car year 'round, or just as a fair-weather cruiser?
Good luck with your project...post more pics as you go 
_________________
'63 Ragtop (current)
'65 Ghia coupe (totaled)
'67 Ghia convertible (current)
'69.5 Ghia convertible and
'62, '63, '65, '69 Bugs (all long gone) |
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Rome
Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2004
Posts: 10819
Location: Pearl River, NY
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| Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2021 8:57 pm Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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Your hood: A set of these would look more period correct, though are still out in plain sight and an indicator that they really don't belong there originally: https://www.7ent.com/products/leather-bonnet-strap...gLu2vD_BwE
If you try to fabricate a single latch at the top center of the hood that would be cable-actuated, the problem is that the sides of the hood would flap around because they are unsupported.
My '77 Beetle has a fiberglass hood that was fitted by the PO. The stock pin and carrier bracket assembly are glassed into the underside of the hood and fit into the stock latch at the top of the front apron. Has worked flawlessly in the nearly 30 years I've owned the car, though I do have a thin safety wire attached to the latch that is routed out of the spare tire well in case they jam. You "could" add 2 such pins to the underside of the hood and make mounts for the corresponding latches that would attach to your 2 upright supports under the cowl. You could use the stock hood release, if your car still has it, to the left of the steering column and rig the release cable to the latches using a few pulleys. Sounds precarious... Otherwise your muscle car hood pins could work, as would a few Dzus fasteners which are painted in body color- one on each side of the hood down low, and one in the center. But both of those solutions require fabricating a sturdy base for the "anchors" on the body. |
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MiltonGhia
Samba Member
Joined: September 11, 2021
Posts: 32
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2021 6:09 am Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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| rcooled wrote: |
| MiltonGhia wrote: |
| I recently acquired a 63 Ghia Coupe in need of some TLC...the price was right. |
Hope you got a smokin' deal on this one. It'll be a big job taking it back to a safe and dependable driver, but with enough $$ and effort, it can be done.
I see that some engine compartment sheetmetal has been replaced...how's the rust situation in the rest of the car?
| Quote: |
| ...the car was "restored" about 15 years ago |
Describing it as "restored" would be mighty generous indeed.
Just curious: Do you plan on using this car year 'round, or just as a fair-weather cruiser?
Good luck with your project...post more pics as you go |
I think the price I paid would be considered more than fair, the goal is a driver. I'm well aware this Ghia will never be a showcar, just a fun evening cruiser but by no means will be depended on as a form of transportation.
The rust is ok. I was slightly concerned with the floors but I had a body guy get under it and says its ok, some surface rust but solid. He's going to clean it up for me, the doors have some bubbling there are a few other areas that require some cleaning up but I don't think (for now) there will be any welding in of new metal. But maybe that will change once we dive in, I'll keep you posted. Thank you for the good luck! |
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MiltonGhia
Samba Member
Joined: September 11, 2021
Posts: 32
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2021 6:32 am Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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| Rome wrote: |
Your hood: A set of these would look more period correct, though are still out in plain sight and an indicator that they really don't belong there originally: https://www.7ent.com/products/leather-bonnet-strap...gLu2vD_BwE
If you try to fabricate a single latch at the top center of the hood that would be cable-actuated, the problem is that the sides of the hood would flap around because they are unsupported.
My '77 Beetle has a fiberglass hood that was fitted by the PO. The stock pin and carrier bracket assembly are glassed into the underside of the hood and fit into the stock latch at the top of the front apron. Has worked flawlessly in the nearly 30 years I've owned the car, though I do have a thin safety wire attached to the latch that is routed out of the spare tire well in case they jam. You "could" add 2 such pins to the underside of the hood and make mounts for the corresponding latches that would attach to your 2 upright supports under the cowl. You could use the stock hood release, if your car still has it, to the left of the steering column and rig the release cable to the latches using a few pulleys. Sounds precarious... Otherwise your muscle car hood pins could work, as would a few Dzus fasteners which are painted in body color- one on each side of the hood down low, and one in the center. But both of those solutions require fabricating a sturdy base for the "anchors" on the body. |
I did come across these straps in my research for a solution, looks like these would be the easiest replacement for what I have now. But I like the idea of the Dzus fastners much more, as you mentioned getting the anchors to the body securely could be a challenge. The hood release idea is genius and would be ideal ! I need to get my Millwright friend out to have a look, he's great with this kind of stuff.
Once again thank you Rome great suggestions and a couple options to work with. |
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MiltonGhia
Samba Member
Joined: September 11, 2021
Posts: 32
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:45 pm Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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Some photos from inside the fiber glass clip and of the cut hinges.
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Rome
Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2004
Posts: 10819
Location: Pearl River, NY
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| Posted: Tue Sep 14, 2021 2:51 pm Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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Thanks for the photos. Those "braces" for the front T bar bumpers are so precarious. I think the concept can be improved upon with some sturdier triangle-shaped braces that are welded to the bottom cross-pipe. With such minimal bracing, the stock-style bumper you are considering really would only be ornamental because a direct impact would buckle those braces. Also, I think that the basic hinge concept for the entire nose is feasible. You'd need to find a hefty hinge such as a gate hinge, weld the one end to the bar coming forward from the axle, cut off the other hinge end and bolt it to the existing holes in the nose. Lube the hinge regularly! Replacing that "U" channel that goes across the nose with a sturdy box profile steel pipe would also help considerably to provide stiffness to the bumper braces and the hinges. And provide a solid surface for welding on those bumper braces. You'd probably find something suitable at a scrap metal recycler for low cost.
Also, the 2 flat bars coming forward from the axle really need a triangular brace. The forward end needs to be welded to the bar close to the front, and the rear goes high up the beam's shock tower. Simple angle iron would be sufficient, but you'd have to make sure that the brace clears the ones for the bumper brackets. The nose itself is probably not that heavy, but going over bumpy roads, as well as wind buffeting, will shake the nose due to the large area. You need that additional bracing to stabilize the hinge mechanism.
Since you have no low-hanging nose parts, you could also make a sturdy metal brace that connects both shock towers high up for stiffness. 1" angle iron...
Do you have any local friends who are welders or even general metal fabricators who could take a good look at the nose and help you determine a simple solution for the hinges?
Another idea I had for fastening the hood is- your wheelwells are cut so much, that the "back surface" of the wheelwell is your footwell of the interior. I wonder if you could think up a simple mechanism to use the hole from that hoaky side latch that is on the hood, drill a hole in the wheelwell so that you could attach a release rod or handle to the mechanism for locking and unlocking. You'd have one release rod per side, though you'd have to lean over to get to the one on the passenger side. Just kicking ideas around... |
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MiltonGhia
Samba Member
Joined: September 11, 2021
Posts: 32
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:07 am Post subject: Re: 63 Ghia Coupe |
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| Rome wrote: |
Thanks for the photos. Those "braces" for the front T bar bumpers are so precarious. I think the concept can be improved upon with some sturdier triangle-shaped braces that are welded to the bottom cross-pipe. With such minimal bracing, the stock-style bumper you are considering really would only be ornamental because a direct impact would buckle those braces. Also, I think that the basic hinge concept for the entire nose is feasible. You'd need to find a hefty hinge such as a gate hinge, weld the one end to the bar coming forward from the axle, cut off the other hinge end and bolt it to the existing holes in the nose. Lube the hinge regularly! Replacing that "U" channel that goes across the nose with a sturdy box profile steel pipe would also help considerably to provide stiffness to the bumper braces and the hinges. And provide a solid surface for welding on those bumper braces. You'd probably find something suitable at a scrap metal recycler for low cost.
Also, the 2 flat bars coming forward from the axle really need a triangular brace. The forward end needs to be welded to the bar close to the front, and the rear goes high up the beam's shock tower. Simple angle iron would be sufficient, but you'd have to make sure that the brace clears the ones for the bumper brackets. The nose itself is probably not that heavy, but going over bumpy roads, as well as wind buffeting, will shake the nose due to the large area. You need that additional bracing to stabilize the hinge mechanism.
Since you have no low-hanging nose parts, you could also make a sturdy metal brace that connects both shock towers high up for stiffness. 1" angle iron...
Do you have any local friends who are welders or even general metal fabricators who could take a good look at the nose and help you determine a simple solution for the hinges?
Another idea I had for fastening the hood is- your wheelwells are cut so much, that the "back surface" of the wheelwell is your footwell of the interior. I wonder if you could think up a simple mechanism to use the hole from that hoaky side latch that is on the hood, drill a hole in the wheelwell so that you could attach a release rod or handle to the mechanism for locking and unlocking. You'd have one release rod per side, though you'd have to lean over to get to the one on the passenger side. Just kicking ideas around... |
Some really good ideas here and making some very valid points as well, lots to consider. I really like the idea of a locking and unlocking mechanism from the interior! |
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