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Jeremy
Samba Member
Joined: August 01, 2002
Posts: 300
Location: gilbert, az- not anymore- now in co
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 Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 11:59 am Post subject: cb lifters - worth it? |
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I'm getting ready to build a 2110 for my notch 
Here's my setup / plans so far
Dell 45's with shorty manifolds matched to
p/p cb 044 heads
dual springs / chromoly retainers
cb or scat 1.25 rockers ( don't have yet)
aluminum push rods
forged scat crank w/ h beams
web 119
total seal seconds
full flowed
compression around 9.5:1
this motor will see around 7k rpm max
hopefully about 170 - 180 hp
This car will be driven HARD almost daily
Now I can't decide on lifters
scats - too many problems
reground stockers - NO
ceramics - My #1 choice but $$$$
CB - look good, I can afford them
I want this to be reliable and not have to be torn down after 4500 miles cause a lifter went and royally screwed up EVERYTHING.
Any suggestions are appreciated
BTW here's the link
http://www.cbperformance.com/catalog.asp?ProductID=68 |
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danimal
Banned
Joined: April 05, 2004
Posts: 587
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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as always, you should get the lifters at the same place you get the cam... so cb lifters with a cb cam... i believe that they grind their own cams.
beyond that, i'm thinking that slr reground stock lifters are as good a bet as any these days.
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Dazed42
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Joined: May 01, 2004
Posts: 1148
Location: Copperas Cove, Tx
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 2:11 pm Post subject: |
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I'd like to hear some opinions on those also, maybe from someone who has used them before.
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vwracerdave
Samba Member
Joined: November 11, 2004
Posts: 15600
Location: Deep in the 405
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 4:58 pm Post subject: |
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Who actually makes CB lifters? I have heard that there are only 2-3 companys that actually MAKE lifters. The rest just buy somebody else's and put them in their own packaging.
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clearsurf2001
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Joined: February 26, 2004
Posts: 1671
Location: Dave-AKA-fortyeye-Oceanside, Ca
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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Web Cam Part #00-213
Assuming your cam is new ... that's what Web recommends.
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BoredandStroked
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Joined: May 31, 2003
Posts: 169
Location: South East of Disorder
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 10:13 pm Post subject: |
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CB=Scat lifter
Web=Scat lifter
The 2 piece CB is probably not a scat. I love the old eaton lifters, also old made in the usa bugpacks are good. Reground version of a good proven set of used lifters would be my pic. I'm done with new lifters.
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Jeremy
Samba Member
Joined: August 01, 2002
Posts: 300
Location: gilbert, az- not anymore- now in co
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 1:10 pm Post subject: |
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If the web lifters are scat, those are out of the question.
The 2 piece cb's look like what I'm going with, unless someone has heard bad things about them. |
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The Noof
Samba Member
Joined: January 25, 2005
Posts: 4346
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 1:27 pm Post subject: |
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| I also used a web cam shaft and lifter set, and the stuff is first class. Excellent product and service there. |
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Kaferfiend
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Joined: August 15, 2004
Posts: 439
Location: Selah WA
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 2:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Jeremy wrote: |
If the web lifters are scat, those are out of the question.
The 2 piece cb's look like what I'm going with, unless someone has heard bad things about them. |
What's wrong with the scat's? I've heard nothing but good stuff from Scat stuff....
On a side note, if you're looking for people that have had problems with every part.... you'll never complete a motor. There are people out there that can't make a cable tie work correctly... and these people have no voice as far as I'm concerned.
-kf |
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The Noof
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Joined: January 25, 2005
Posts: 4346
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 3:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Kaferfiend wrote: |
| Jeremy wrote: |
If the web lifters are scat, those are out of the question.
The 2 piece cb's look like what I'm going with, unless someone has heard bad things about them. |
What's wrong with the scat's? I've heard nothing but good stuff from Scat stuff....
On a side note, if you're looking for people that have had problems with every part.... you'll never complete a motor. There are people out there that can't make a cable tie work correctly... and these people have no voice as far as I'm concerned.
-kf |
rotflmao...excellent point.  |
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Dazed42
Samba Member
Joined: May 01, 2004
Posts: 1148
Location: Copperas Cove, Tx
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 3:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Kaferfiend wrote: |
There are people out there that can't make a cable tie work correctly... and these people have no voice as far as I'm concerned.
-kf |
I'll get the zip ties to work someday 
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Jeremy
Samba Member
Joined: August 01, 2002
Posts: 300
Location: gilbert, az- not anymore- now in co
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 4:56 pm Post subject: |
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Kaferfiend that is true.
I had a scat lifter destroy my last motor after about 4000 miles. The head of the lifter broke off and dusted my cam. one other was pitted badly. Who knows maybe it was a bad lifter, since I have never had a problem with any of their other stuff. which IMO is some of the best out there. Btw I am still using a scat crank and rods in this motor but I am somewhat concerned about the lifters. I'm just wondering if there is a better option besides ceramics |
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Kaferfiend
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Joined: August 15, 2004
Posts: 439
Location: Selah WA
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 8:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Jeremy wrote: |
Kaferfiend that is true.
I had a scat lifter destroy my last motor after about 4000 miles. The head of the lifter broke off and dusted my cam. one other was pitted badly. Who knows maybe it was a bad lifter, since I have never had a problem with any of their other stuff. which IMO is some of the best out there. Btw I am still using a scat crank and rods in this motor but I am somewhat concerned about the lifters. I'm just wondering if there is a better option besides ceramics |
Yikes! Did you contact Scat with a lawyer ready to fight?
-kf |
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Jeremy
Samba Member
Joined: August 01, 2002
Posts: 300
Location: gilbert, az- not anymore- now in co
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 10:29 pm Post subject: |
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LOL
I figured thats what I get for beating on that motor like it was a red-headed stepchild....
The rest of the motor was actually pretty good still.... case was toast, the lifter bore was beat badly. I did get $400 for the balanced crank assembly which is now living as a 1600 in a friends 66. Plus I still have the heads which are going on the 2110. |
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MaidenFan
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Joined: June 01, 2005
Posts: 94
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 11:22 pm Post subject: |
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Do you suppose you could win if a lifter did wreck your engine???
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Jeremy
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Joined: August 01, 2002
Posts: 300
Location: gilbert, az- not anymore- now in co
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 11:32 pm Post subject: |
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Dunno - It would be hard to prove for sure. They would get some "expert" saying that everything wasn't set up properly or some other bs. Plus the lawyer fees would probably be more than just building a new engine.  |
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jamestwo
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Joined: November 01, 2004
Posts: 2203
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| Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 5:08 am Post subject: |
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I had a failure with a SCAT lifter, and know of many others.
Most of the time it's pitting on the face of the lifter. Only people I hear from who like SCAT lifters are drag racer who only use their cars to race with.
If you running SCAT lifters on the street, it's not a matter if they will pit, it's only a matter of when. most of the time it's in the first 10,000 miles.
Search this forum and shoptalk, you'll see SCAT lifters are junk! |
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Alan_U
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Joined: July 10, 2004
Posts: 1762
Location: Vancouver, BC Canada
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| Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 7:50 am Post subject: |
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| jamestwo wrote: |
If you running SCAT lifters on the street, it's not a matter if they will pit, it's only a matter of when. most of the time it's in the first 10,000 miles.
Search this forum and shoptalk, you'll see SCAT lifters are junk! |
Tommy L at scat says theres no problems with those lifters 
A friend of mine has used the same exact lifters in his drag car for years and years and years with no problems. He might have a couple hundred miles on them but you must remember its 1/4 mile at a time.
kaferfiend, if your using a set of those scats (not made by them by the way) you'll have nice pits in due time guaranteed without a question. Theres an engine builder I know that had his scats explode on him and destroyed a brand new motor on a dyno. He was using K800 springs that have extremely high spring pressure at the nose of any cam.
I would have to admit that a broken lifter head potentially may not be the cause of the scat product. If per say the lifter bore was out of spec any wobble in the lifter will break any lifter on the market INCLUDING CERAMICS. The location of the lifter bore can vary from casting to casting of the engine case. That is just one of the potential problems I think with our flat 4.
James is generous saying 10,000 miles. I am finding most are experiencing pits in just 3000+ miles. A very high percentage of scat lifters will breakin beautifully but the pitting will follow afterwards in due time.
did I ever tell you how much I just love taking my motor apart. Its just like a cracker jack box and your just eager to see what prize you'll get. Whats the prize??? these babies
by the way those were reground virgin scats with precise maching of the head to promote good lifter spin. All 4 out of the 8 had pits and the other 4 showed signs of major heat spots just ready to get pitted. Had about 3000+ miles on them. NO VALVE FLOAT EITHER TO CAUSE PITTING.
you play you pay. This is just a part of aircooled performance.
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RUI FARIA
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Joined: July 23, 2004
Posts: 176
Location: Johannesburg, South Africa
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| Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 3:38 am Post subject: |
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| I have seen many pitted lifters both original German and aftermarket, one thing I can tell you is that I have seen a lot more aftermarket broken or damaged lifters than original German lifters, I have used only original German lifters and mostly refaced, I stay away from the other stuff. Most aftermarket lifters will be pitted or dished in the first 5000 kms, this will not happen even on a refaced original German lifter. |
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[email protected]
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Joined: August 15, 2002
Posts: 4394
Location: Brew City
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| Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 11:01 am Post subject: |
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| RUI FARIA wrote: |
| I have seen many pitted lifters both original German and aftermarket, one thing I can tell you is that I have seen a lot more aftermarket broken or damaged lifters than original German lifters, I have used only original German lifters and mostly refaced, I stay away from the other stuff. Most aftermarket lifters will be pitted or dished in the first 5000 kms, this will not happen even on a refaced original German lifter. |
YES, YES, YES!!!! I have really come to love stock reground lifters in almost all applications. I don't see the pitting and they really wear much slower. |
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