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Behind the rotar grease
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bugbenginer
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 29, 2025 8:53 pm    Post subject: Behind the rotar grease Reply with quote

Do you repack/grease the backside of the rotor when installing new CV axles?

I bought these from bus depot
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Here is my brand new transmission that I just had installed, do I take out the Blue tabs/plugs?
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Do I repack grease on the back of the rotar where the cv axle mounts to
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Thanks in advance!!
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kreemoweet
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 29, 2025 10:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Behind the rotar grease Reply with quote

The thing you call a "rotor" is a "flange", it is the differential output flange (inboard) or the stub axle drive flange (outboard). The blue seal is to prevent transmission oil from leaking into the CVJ, you never pull that out when intalling/removing the CVJ's.
You put all the grease INSIDE the CVJ's, some grease will always work its way out into the flange recess due to CVJ/axle movement.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2025 2:54 pm    Post subject: Re: Behind the rotar grease Reply with quote

I have always filled the depression in the flange. Many of these old rigs came with a second plastic cap that kept the grease out of the flanges, so there was no area to fill, but few of those caps are still in existence anymore so filling the flange with grease helps to keep grease in the CV where you want it.
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SGKent Premium Member
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2025 3:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Behind the rotar grease Reply with quote

I've always just replaced the CV joints and never the whole thing. I did that on an Acura with one from Napa and it broke at a casting flaw about a block and a half later. Wasn't even turning or getting on it. Had to back all the way home. Put the old ones in and took the Napa one back. Then put in refurbished Acura ones and they worked perfectly for years. So for that reason I am leery of aftermarket kits, and only use Lobro CV's as replacements on the factory axles. They wear but that is the design. I want to say that with service the Lobro CVs would last 100,000 miles or there abouts until the pits were too deep to use anymore. I'd keep the old ball bearings and use only the best when rebuilding them at about 45,000 miles, or every 3 years. Some places now sell new cages, ball bearings, and inner races if those are worn.

I looked online and there are some later VW's and Bugs that use a stamped metal plate to contain the grease, and some Vanagon kits have a foam seal that keeps the CV's from slinging. Although if one uses a good grease they normally won't sling as long as they are properly tightened.

Also I did figure out the difference between the Vanagon and Bus difference in torque on the bolts. There are two different bolts used on CV's. One was for Bays, and one was for Vanagons. The bus ones are 10.8 hardness and are allen style head. They use the special washers to lock. The later Vanagon ones are hex head and 12.9 hardness. They do not use the special washers but are torqued to a higher torque. There was a lengthy dicussion where some use the washers regardless. I am merely saying what VW ENGINEERS DID, not what some others say to do.

After some discussion on greases, RG said that tests he was involved in suggested using the Redline Synthetic CV-2 grease worked better for preventing wear than the greases in the small pouches that come with the CV's. I recently replaced the boots and repacked the CV's after 12 years use. Used the redline CV-2. It is a good but messy grease. One can use wire or wire ties to hold the CVs to the boots so that they do not fall apart during transport or installation.

All that said, CV joint service is a job every bus owner gets to know, and one that is messy. Personally I hate it due to the mess. But the show goes on and it has to be done.
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raygreenwood
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2025 5:50 am    Post subject: Re: Behind the rotar grease Reply with quote

SGKent wrote:
I've always just replaced the CV joints and never the whole thing. I did that on an Acura with one from Napa and it broke at a casting flaw about a block and a half later. Wasn't even turning or getting on it. Had to back all the way home. Put the old ones in and took the Napa one back. Then put in refurbished Acura ones and they worked perfectly for years. So for that reason I am leery of aftermarket kits, and only use Lobro CV's as replacements on the factory axles. They wear but that is the design. I want to say that with service the Lobro CVs would last 100,000 miles or there abouts until the pits were too deep to use anymore. I'd keep the old ball bearings and use only the best when rebuilding them at about 45,000 miles, or every 3 years. Some places now sell new cages, ball bearings, and inner races if those are worn.

I looked online and there are some later VW's and Bugs that use a stamped metal plate to contain the grease, and some Vanagon kits have a foam seal that keeps the CV's from slinging. Although if one uses a good grease they normally won't sling as long as they are properly tightened.

Also I did figure out the difference between the Vanagon and Bus difference in torque on the bolts. There are two different bolts used on CV's. One was for Bays, and one was for Vanagons. The bus ones are 10.8 hardness and are allen style head. They use the special washers to lock. The later Vanagon ones are hex head and 12.9 hardness. They do not use the special washers but are torqued to a higher torque. There was a lengthy dicussion where some use the washers regardless. I am merely saying what VW ENGINEERS DID, not what some others say to do.

After some discussion on greases, RG said that tests he was involved in suggested using the Redline Synthetic CV-2 grease worked better for preventing wear than the greases in the small pouches that come with the CV's. I recently replaced the boots and repacked the CV's after 12 years use. Used the redline CV-2. It is a good but messy grease. One can use wire or wire ties to hold the CVs to the boots so that they do not fall apart during transport or installation.

All that said, CV joint service is a job every bus owner gets to know, and one that is messy. Personally I hate it due to the mess. But the show goes on and it has to be done.


Yep on the different bolt types.....and you can even add to that bolt insanity variation, before the main years of the bay window bus.....411/412 and other acvw....the CV bolts were triple square and were class 12.9.

Then they went to the class 10.9 with Allen wrench heads and washers. Then the vanagons got the hex head 12.9.
Then supposedly around the same time as the Vanagons.....supposedly according to various parts sources.....they went back to 12.9 on replacement bolts for all VW bought from dealer stocks. Rolling Eyes

So, about packing the dishes in the flanges. Yes, pack them just level. Try to keep excessive grease out of the threads or clean them out when done.

The reason is notable in cold weather areas. If there is space in the dish, some of the grease in the joint gets pushed out into that empty area. And....it cannot readily flow back into the joint. You get some of the same issue with grease migrating into the boot and not migrating back which is why once the joint is greased/packed and the flange dish is packed, it's a good idea to put kind of a barrier ring of grease just inside the first rib of the boot.

For decades, I have found that the 90 gram book volume of grease is about 10 to 20 grams too little. Requiring grease by weight is kind of stupid because the density of various greases can be all over the planet. For example, 90 grams of one grease may be 4 fluid ounces. 90 grams of another grease may be 3 fluid ounces.

I watch as many of the boot reviews as I can. I am hoping the titan boots are holding up. The problem is nearly 50/50...changes in the boot rubber and the formulation of the greases these days.
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wiscowesty
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2025 9:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Behind the rotar grease Reply with quote

Thanks for clueing us in on bolt hardness and torque specs. Certainly answers that question. Because of failing boots i have become kind of handy switching them out and use the expensive greases to be found. I fill the void in drive flange and also pack CVJ's by rubber gloved hand. But first i use brake clean and remove all offending grit grime and grease clean bolts and threads. Due to escaping grease from boot flange to drive flanges. I started to smear a semi transparent oil resistaint gasket maker goop on inside boot flange and drive flange face and let it set up. Before install. Torque to spec. I have unknownly torqued to vanagon specs while using bay window fasteners. Seems fine? But the gasket maker goop really stops hot thin grease from ozzing out. And than my fear of not enough grease prompted me to purchase a stainless steel syringe used for injecting juicey spices deep into meat. The syringe is a chore to pack full, but one finds creative ways. The longest needle in the kit with largest bore is bent slightly to allow insertion between axle and small end of boot. Use a tiny flat nose screw driver to open a gap to slip the needle in Qwells my lack of grease sydrome. Hoping the VW tirgon OEM boots hold up for a decent time. Grease it if it will take it. Have fun
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jlrftype7
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2025 10:41 am    Post subject: Re: Behind the rotar grease Reply with quote

SGKent wrote:
I've always just replaced the CV joints and never the whole thing. I did that on an Acura with one from Napa and it broke at a casting flaw about a block and a half later. Wasn't even turning or getting on it. Had to back all the way home. Put the old ones in and took the Napa one back. Then put in refurbished Acura ones and they worked perfectly for years. So for that reason I am leery of aftermarket kits, and only use Lobro CV's as replacements on the factory axles. They wear but that is the design. I want to say that with service the Lobro CVs would last 100,000 miles or there abouts until the pits were too deep to use anymore. I'd keep the old ball bearings and use only the best when rebuilding them at about 45,000 miles, or every 3 years. Some places now sell new cages, ball bearings, and inner races if those are worn.

I looked online and there are some later VW's and Bugs that use a stamped metal plate to contain the grease, and some Vanagon kits have a foam seal that keeps the CV's from slinging. Although if one uses a good grease they normally won't sling as long as they are properly tightened.

Also I did figure out the difference between the Vanagon and Bus difference in torque on the bolts. There are two different bolts used on CV's. One was for Bays, and one was for Vanagons. The bus ones are 10.8 hardness and are allen style head. They use the special washers to lock. The later Vanagon ones are hex head and 12.9 hardness. They do not use the special washers but are torqued to a higher torque. There was a lengthy dicussion where some use the washers regardless. I am merely saying what VW ENGINEERS DID, not what some others say to do.

After some discussion on greases, RG said that tests he was involved in suggested using the Redline Synthetic CV-2 grease worked better for preventing wear than the greases in the small pouches that come with the CV's. I recently replaced the boots and repacked the CV's after 12 years use. Used the redline CV-2. It is a good but messy grease. One can use wire or wire ties to hold the CVs to the boots so that they do not fall apart during transport or installation.

All that said, CV joint service is a job every bus owner gets to know, and one that is messy. Personally I hate it due to the mess. But the show goes on and it has to be done.
You MIGHT want to really rethink the Redline CV grease.
Over in the Vanagon section, we've posted pictures of the Redline grease after it's been in service for a few years- like 1 or two even.
It changes color, to a dull grey, and starts to act like a mud more than a grease that flows, or feels slippery. I recently pulled all of it out and switched back to Sta-Lube CV grease.
My Redline grease had been in since early 2019, seemed to have kept wear from happening, which was a relief, but was breaking down and felt ashy in your gloved fingertips.
I'll see if I can find some pictures for you. The reason I bring this up is that I don't normally see anyone's CV grease behave like this on low miles in service.
Here's a picture from the Vanagon MOD, appox 25K on the grease. I had far less when mine started to seem to break down. I had my CVs off for drivestrain work repeatedly due to Automatic issues over the past few years, so, I was looking the CVs more than I wanted to... Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes
Almost all grey in color on my grease, tiny amount still Red for whatever that's worth. I never saw flaking or particles that scared me with using the Redline, but I didn't like what I saw anyway. So, picture much the same clumping or caking, grey in color, and you're not sure how much is rolling with the balls of the CV as it moves... Shocked


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