'67 Bug-Should I remove the heater boxes and other ?'s

[Jim Bear]

I pulled the engine to replace oil cooler seals and clean things up; the engine was an oily mess as the PO (I have had the car a year and have not driven it) did not see that it was leaking for some time. I pulled everything off short of the distributor, fuel pump, the heater boxes, the sled tins, and the pulley tin. I attempted to get the sled tins off and could not figure out how to do it without pulling the heater boxes. This got me thinking about the state of the heater box gaskets and the boxes themselves. The boxes appear solid, although have surface rust and there was no sign of bad gaskets. I decided to wait to think about this until after I replaced the oil cooler and then gave the engine and the tins a good cleaning. The whole purpose of this endeavor has been to replace the oil cooler seals, clean things up, assess, reassemble, and get this vehicle on the road for further assessment as a potential daily driver.

THE REAL QUESTIONS:
1) Should I preempt gasket issues and replace the heater box gaskets now? DONE
2) When are heater boxes replaced? I have never dealt with having to do this and knowing when there is an issue. These are OK. Just maybe need a blasting and paint
3) How do you get out the manifold gaskets? They look like they are part of the damn head
4) Should I deal with the push-rod tubes and seals? I do not think they are leaking as they are slightly surface-rusty appearance and not oily. Not Worrying About These Now
5) Do you have to take off the pulley to get to the pulley tin? Question Answered
6) Anything else you can think of while I am where I am?

THANKS. Here is a craptastic pic for kicks.

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"You're either on the bus, or you're off the bus." ~kk
'85 Vanagon Westy - George In the Stable 2020-?/'74 Weekender - Ophelia In the Stable 2007- ?/'69 Beetle Convertible - SOLD 2017-2020/'67 Beetle - September SOLD 2013-2016 /'67 SO42 Westy - Sage SOLD 1996-2001 /'69 Transporter - Baby Blue SOLD 1995-1995/'72 Westy - Nelly - SOLD 1990-1995--STOP FRACKING

[noah2burchell]

Heater boxes are generally replaced if you are getting exhaust fumes in the cabin when you use the heater or if they have rust holes in them and they are not good for heating. As for the gasket issue if I were going to replace the gaskets I would just replace the boxes while I had them off. If your push rod tubes are not leaking and don't have holes in them i wouldn't worry about replacing them unless you just feel like they need replaced. But if you do that you need to start replacing lifters and then the cam and I don't think you are wanting to get that far in. As for the pulley tin you do have to take the pulley off to get to the screw behind the pulley and I can't remember if the tin surronds the pulley or not but you'd need a very tiny bent screwdriver to get behind it. If that is your fuel filter on the end of that fuel line connected to the fuel filter I would suggest to move it under the car (less risk of fire). That is all I can think of. I'm not sure which manifold gaskets you are talking about,but they more than likely used gasket sealer so just scrape on them to get them off if that is the case.
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Wanted: Anything from Risacher Motors VW dealership in Morristown, Tennessee or Westgate VW in St. Louis Missouri.

Original flat window 1302 Super Beetle

[Danwvw]

Heater boxes themselves are so thick they don't leak exhaust gasses unless the car or the engine has set in water for a long time and they rust out. Generally they get oil in them because of a valve covers leaking and that can be a real problem in the cab when the heat is on. If this is happening Just remove the heater boxes and clean them with some carb cleaner etc then soak them in some detergent and rinse with hot water.

Yes you will need to scrape off manifold gaskets if the paper ones were used. They are nice though less likely to leak.

When you remove the heater boxes you run the risk of twisting a exhaust stud off the head so take care and try to avoid twisting too hard on them. Best to use copper nuts on the exhaust manifold bolts. If the flanges are warped on the heater boxes you will need to surface them to get them to re-seal.
Manifold Gaskets,
Intake and Exhaust Nuts etc....

That engine would look great with new black paint on the valve covers and tin!
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1960 Beetle And 1679cc DP W-100 & Dual Zeniths!

[Jim Bear]

[Jim Bear]

[cory464]

yes, take the heater boxes off. reason is you will want to see what kinds of crud and junk has blown down between the cylinders over the years, and make sure the fins are clean and free of debris. if the heater boxes show no signs of rusting apart, and the flappers work, they are fine.

[Danwvw]

I am trying to remember, I think they will come out if you bend them. But really it's no big deal just 4 exhaust nuts! The PB should do the trick, You could always use a torch on them if they won't turn. I would pull mine!
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1960 Beetle And 1679cc DP W-100 & Dual Zeniths!

[KTPhil]

I would remove the HEs now while you have easy access to replace/drill out a broken stud. Then I'd torque them carefully, use anti-sieze, and copper/brass nuts. It may save you some grief down the road. Clean, degrease, and paint them while you are at it.

[Jim Bear]

OK, we have a consensus. Can only 3 people do that? Off they will come. One more shot of PB, then off to the radiator shop to see about getting the gas tank cleaned, then back to bust some nuts...and hopefully no studs.

Several questions:
1) The flaps work well. What might be some lubrication method recommendations for these?
2) What would the preferred methods of rust removal be on the boxes?

Thanks!
_________________
"You're either on the bus, or you're off the bus." ~kk
'85 Vanagon Westy - George In the Stable 2020-?/'74 Weekender - Ophelia In the Stable 2007- ?/'69 Beetle Convertible - SOLD 2017-2020/'67 Beetle - September SOLD 2013-2016 /'67 SO42 Westy - Sage SOLD 1996-2001 /'69 Transporter - Baby Blue SOLD 1995-1995/'72 Westy - Nelly - SOLD 1990-1995--STOP FRACKING

[drscope]

Just don't bust an exhaust stud when trying to take them off!

Exhaust in the cabin is SELDOM a result of the heater boxes leaking. It's usually the result of poor or nonexistent engine bay seals allowing exhaust to get sucked up into the cooling fan and pumped into the cabin.
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Mother Nature is a Mean Evil Bitch!

[inzel]

Are you planning on putting the heater boxes back on? I dont really understand why people take them off in the first place except for cleaning and/or replacement. I have met numerous people that take them out and just plug the holes. Is there a good reason for that? Personally, I like having heat when I need it.

[Danwvw]

From what I have read about big valve heads you don't want to run stock heater boxes with them. They apparently have too small of exhaust ID and and cause larger valve engines to overheat. People run J-tubes or the larger ID exhaust heat exchangers for performance engines. Check out these 1 1/2" to 1 3/4" Heater Boxes at Air Cooled Net.
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1960 Beetle And 1679cc DP W-100 & Dual Zeniths!

[inzel]

Thats pretty interesting. Thank you for the information. Are they an issue with a small cam and dual carbs.. or are we talking high performance setups?

If I have to lose heat in the pacific northwest in order to have small performance gains, I think I will just stick as closely to stock as possible

[Jim Bear]

The exchangers came off remarkably smooth. Now to get blasted and painted? We'll see. New gaskets at least and now I can clean the sled tins better without bending anything.

**Regarding the manifold gasket. Any feedback on that?
**Any feedback on exchanger lever lube?
_________________
"You're either on the bus, or you're off the bus." ~kk
'85 Vanagon Westy - George In the Stable 2020-?/'74 Weekender - Ophelia In the Stable 2007- ?/'69 Beetle Convertible - SOLD 2017-2020/'67 Beetle - September SOLD 2013-2016 /'67 SO42 Westy - Sage SOLD 1996-2001 /'69 Transporter - Baby Blue SOLD 1995-1995/'72 Westy - Nelly - SOLD 1990-1995--STOP FRACKING

[Danwvw]

[cory464]

[cory464]

[Jim Bear]

[Danwvw]

Well the intake manifold gasket is the large round ones that come in most kits's got several around here as I have been using just the dual port heads. I take it it's a single port 1600 you have, That should be the large round gasket that comes in the link above (Manifold Gaskets) from Aircooled net or in any gasket kit for rebuilding the engine. Don't use sealer on the intake or exhaust manifold gaskets!
Lube on those boxes? I have never used anything on mine but they show it too. But I bet high temp anti seize would work. So something like Pinewood Derby Dry Graphite with Moly may work fine but I would not want to put it anywhere it will get into the air coming into the car.
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1960 Beetle And 1679cc DP W-100 & Dual Zeniths!

[cory464]