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Fast Brake Lights switch review
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toxicavenger70
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2020 12:27 pm    Post subject: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

I have noticed people have been riding the back of my 65' frequently. When I engage my brakes it takes a bit for my taillights to actually turn on. I think I read somewhere it takes 20lbs of pressure for them to light up. Kind of nerving racking considering the way people drive these days.

I saw the Fast Brake Light switch that Keith sells in the classifieds and I believed it might be a solution to the problem I have been experiencing. Luckily it is!

Here it is installed:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Black wire pig-tailed off the fuse box.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Red wire from the switch goes to the black/red tail light junction
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

The installation was pretty easy. I feed the red/black wire down thru the grommet on the front left hand side of the gas tank. Then I ran the wire inside of some black shrink tube down to the pedal assembly.

Check it out if you are experiencing the same issues.

Take care.
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brando90gl
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2020 1:17 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

I installed one of Keith’s kits a couple weeks ago. Super smooth install, no issues. Works as it should.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2020 3:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

LED brake light bulbs are another solution. Instant turn on and much brighter.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2020 3:52 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

I installed these on both my bugs. As soon as you touch the brake pedal the lights come on. I also have the LED bulbs which are much brighter.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2020 4:15 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

I have also installed this on my beetle and love it. I put just enough "slop" in the brake pedal so that when I press the pedal the micro switch triggers the brake lights without any brake pressure to the wheels. Gives a good break check light to people behind me. I also installed a 55W red fog lamp on the bumper so there is no way they are going to miss my lights, lol.
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vwoldbug
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2020 5:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

Thanks for the information.
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tcmia
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2020 5:43 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

I have put together a similar setup in my buggy since the original switches stopped working. Excellent idea!
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glutamodo Premium Member
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2020 6:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

I don't know the spec, but even 20PSI in a brake system is not really that much. The problem is that hydraulic switches degrade and end up needing a lot more than that. Non-German switches have a horrible track record. I have German switches in both of my bugs and they work fine. I have NOS German switches to replace them if and when they stop working right. And with the exception of the bulb in the add-on third brake light in my Baja bug, I have incandescent bulbs in my rear lights.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2020 7:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

FYI for you guys running cars that don't have the brake warning light on the dashboard, a rear brake light switch from a Harley-Davidson screws right into the master cylinder and activates with the barest amount of pedal pressure. Been using one on my Square for a few years now with no degradation in performance. The switch is also DOT5-friendly.

Coupled with super-bright LED brake lights like the ones from CuLayer, life is good.

The HD part number for the switch is 72023-51E.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 12:10 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

rcroane wrote:
LED brake light bulbs are another solution. Instant turn on and much brighter.

How is it a solution if it still takes 20lb of pedal pressure to make them turn on?
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toxicavenger70
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 12:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

iowa vw wrote:
I have also installed this on my beetle and love it. I put just enough "slop" in the brake pedal so that when I press the pedal the micro switch triggers the brake lights without any brake pressure to the wheels.

I did it the same way.
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toxicavenger70
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 12:14 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

glutamodo wrote:
I don't know the spec, but even 20PSI in a brake system is not really that much. The problem is that hydraulic switches degrade and end up needing a lot more than that. Non-German switches have a horrible track record. I have German switches in both of my bugs and they work fine. I have NOS German switches to replace them if and when they stop working right. And with the exception of the bulb in the add-on third brake light in my Baja bug, I have incandescent bulbs in my rear lights.


I have a new German brake switch and master cylinder. They still take a while to turn on.

Where I live people are constantly tailgating. With this addition it has seemed to slowed this down.
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toxicavenger70
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 12:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

sjbartnik wrote:
FYI for you guys running cars that don't have the brake warning light on the dashboard, a rear brake light switch from a Harley-Davidson screws right into the master cylinder and activates with the barest amount of pedal pressure.

The HD part number for the switch is 72023-51E.

Great info. I might do this if the switch ever goes bad.
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Acab77
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 1:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

toxicavenger70 wrote:
I have noticed people have been riding the back of my 65' frequently. When I engage my brakes it takes a bit for my taillights to actually turn on. I think I read somewhere it takes 20lbs of pressure for them to light up. Kind of nerving racking considering the way people drive these days.

I saw the Fast Brake Light switch that Keith sells in the classifieds and I believed it might be a solution to the problem I have been experiencing. Luckily it is!

Check it out if you are experiencing the same issues.

Take care.


Great info, thanks for the review and photos!
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glutamodo Premium Member
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 3:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

toxicavenger70 wrote:
rcroane wrote:
LED brake light bulbs are another solution. Instant turn on and much brighter.

How is it a solution if it still takes 20lb of pedal pressure to make them turn on?


Keep in mind that the pedal itself give leverage to the piston and the size of the piston bore versus the small outlets end up with a huge amount of force multiplication. Twenty pounds of pedal pressure does not equal 20PSI of hydraulic pressure.


On my Baja Bug, it's nice to have the 3rd brake light in the back window so I can see any time I drive it at night the pedal action.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2020 4:06 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

glutamodo wrote:

Keep in mind that the pedal itself give leverage to the piston and the size of the piston bore versus the small outlets end up with a huge amount of force multiplication. Twenty pounds of pedal pressure does not equal 20PSI of hydraulic pressure.

With the stock setup I have to push the pedal down about halfway for the brake lights to engage. That is unsat. I also have a 3rd brake light installed.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 6:10 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

toxicavenger70 wrote:
rcroane wrote:
LED brake light bulbs are another solution. Instant turn on and much brighter.

How is it a solution if it still takes 20lb of pedal pressure to make them turn on?

Okay, it's not a complete solution; but, it IS a step in the right direction because an LED lights up faster than an incondescent bulb (regardless of what switch you're using). An engineer buddy of mine wrote this to me regarding the LED advantage:

>>>>>>>>>>
"LED will give a following driver a 347 millisecond earlier brake apply. If that driver was going 55 MPH that equates to 28 feet. If you assume that said driver would have stopped 5 feet behind you with your filament bulbs, it means he would have shoved your carburetor up your ass!"
<<<<<<<<<<

toxicavenger70 wrote:
sjbartnik wrote:
FYI for you guys running cars that don't have the brake warning light on the dashboard, a rear brake light switch from a Harley-Davidson screws right into the master cylinder and activates with the barest amount of pedal pressure.

The HD part number for the switch is 72023-51E.

Great info. I might do this if the switch ever goes bad.

When I went to my local Harley parts guy, he told me that part number is for "the Mini" because of its smaller size. He then show'd me a larger and less expensive part, which I bought and install'd due to having blown my original German switch by foolishly applying 12 volts to it while under pressure.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

BTW - Thanks @toxicavenger70 for the thread. Huge thanks to @sjbartnik for the Harley idea!


Last edited by MrGoodtunes on Thu Oct 21, 2021 8:24 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 8:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

glutamodo wrote:
...it's nice to have the 3rd brake light in the back window so I can see any time I drive it at night the pedal action.

I agree. I think I might entertain an idea to take this a step further: a small LED in the interior, somewhere, inconspicuous maybe, so the brakelight function can always be monitored. Could have an interruptor in case it gets annoying. Yeah, a bit extreme for most folk, requires a tiny bit of additional wiring.

I'm thinking something like one of the several types of "bolt beams" offered by superbrightleds https://www.superbrightleds.com/moreinfo/led-wired-bolts/bolt-beam-12mm-led-light/1494/
Maybe could stash it in the ashtray or something. That could be neat.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 7:33 am    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

Periodically, I check for operation of my tail light, brake lights, turn signal lights by looking at their reflection of vehicles behind me or in front of me.
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toxicavenger70
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 7:57 am    Post subject: Re: Fast Brake Lights switch review Reply with quote

MrGoodtunes wrote:
Okay, it's not a complete solution; but, it IS a step in the right direction because an LED lights up faster than an incandescent bulb (regardless of what switch you're using).


The issue isn't how long it takes the bulb to light up, it is the slow activation of the switch. I tried an LED, I personally did not like it. Instead I put some chrome tape on the taillight reflectors and it made a world of difference. Thanks for your input.
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