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Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings?
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Thoragaverung
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 4:31 am    Post subject: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

I am in the last stages of negotiating for an '85.

I want to replace ALL the brake lines. I'd be bending and flaring my own lines (never done this before).

What size line should I be using? Are there metric lines and SAE lines, or does one just use the same stuff you get at a US parts store? What size line would I use, and what size fittings for the master/slave cylinders and calipers?

Thank you.
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Thoragaverung
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 4:47 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

Oh, and would the 1985 use double or bubble flaring?
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 4:47 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

3/16 ths for the hardline. We buy a roll of hardline from Oreillys auto parts. Its coated and is very similar to OE Summit Racing sells the fittings. They are 10mm x 1.0 pitch. The clutch may have a larger line, but Im not sure. You will need a tool that can make a bubble flare.

Making lines is one of my least favorite jobs. If you are talked into stainless, that is even more frustrating.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 5:52 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

Yes=Bubble flared
My local stores had a very poor selection of fittings in the 10mm x 1 range
Bought this last year worked out very well

https://www.ebay.com/itm/3-Way-Tubing-Pipe-Bender-...Sw4w9fNO0V
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 8:21 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

I don't bother with the pipe bender tool because I use nickel copper (nicop) line for my replacement brake lines and fuel lines. I put a bubble flare on both. Rubber line and a hose clamp seals nicely against a bubble flare for fuel lines. Not only does nicop easily bend by hand, it flares so much easier as well. I find a little grease in the flare tool die helps to get the perfect bubble each time.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


https://www.amazon.com/4-75-Copper-Nickel-Brake-Fi...s9dHJ1ZQ==

And it doesn't rust.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 8:59 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

4Gears4Tires wrote:
I don't bother with the pipe bender tool because I use nickel copper (nicop) line for my replacement brake lines and fuel lines. I put a bubble flare on both. Rubber line and a hose clamp seals nicely against a bubble flare for fuel lines. Not only does nicop easily bend by hand, it flares so much easier as well. I find a little grease in the flare tool die helps to get the perfect bubble each time.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


https://www.amazon.com/4-75-Copper-Nickel-Brake-Fi...s9dHJ1ZQ==

And it doesn't rust.


Some bends are too tight to bend by hand (01 pathfinder)
T
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Thoragaverung
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 9:12 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

Hm... what size hard line would I use if I were going to replace the fuel lines, too?

If I have a tool to make a bubble flare on the end... that would make things simpler too. Nice hard lines, less chance of leaks.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 9:23 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

Fuel line is likely close to 5/16ths.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 10:54 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

4Gears4Tires wrote:
I don't bother with the pipe bender tool because I use nickel copper (nicop) line for my replacement brake lines and fuel lines. I put a bubble flare on both. Rubber line and a hose clamp seals nicely against a bubble flare for fuel lines. Not only does nicop easily bend by hand, it flares so much easier as well. I find a little grease in the flare tool die helps to get the perfect bubble each time.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


https://www.amazon.com/4-75-Copper-Nickel-Brake-Fi...s9dHJ1ZQ==

And it doesn't rust.


^^^ all of this!

dont bother with stainless.

you can buy rolls of cunifer brake line and all kinds of fittings from fedhill.com

ive been really happy with the eastwood flaring and bending tools. thankfully never had to remake any vanagon lines but this stuff worked amazing one a couple other much higher pressure systems.

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Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.



the best part of the cunifer as mentioned, is that you can straighten it by hand. it also flares buttery smooth and you dont wear your tools out flaring it.


Thoragaverung wrote:
Hm... what size hard line would I use if I were going to replace the fuel lines, too?

If I have a tool to make a bubble flare on the end... that would make things simpler too. Nice hard lines, less chance of leaks.


i did this on one of my project cars - use hard line to come out to compression fittings (i did An on that setup) and you can adapt those compression fittings to whatever you want from there - nice barbs, actual AN line, etc etc

again the cunifer is super nice to work with here because the larger sizes in any other material get REALLY tough to handle

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Thoragaverung
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 4:22 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

Thank you!

I had one other idea, now that I've gone down the rabbit hole of flaring pipe ends... one could fab up some nice coolant pipes out of 1.5" copper. GoWesty sells those stainless steel ones for 350 bucks a set, but you could get 20 feet of copper in that diameter for 80 bucks. The only thing is, it would be great to flare the ends so the rubber hose wouldn't slip off the copper when the system pressurizes. How could a guy flare something that big? I'm not seeing a tool for that, at least not in the consumer space...

If I did this I think I'd polish the copper and then lacquer it. I think it would look very cool under there.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 4:44 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

Read up on how Copper and Aluminum play together...... it ain't pretty!

I put in BusDepot Stainless but have often wondered if 1 1/2 PEX would work.
I think the temperature rating is too low though.

Dave
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 4:47 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

i've been buying my flare fittings and tubing direct from Federal Hill. in addition to a very informative website on SAE vs DIN flares, they stock all sizes of fittings and true Cunifer brand tubing, beware of Amazon.
https://store.fedhillusa.com/

one thing to keep in mind... often the toughest part of a line to duplicate is the snakey part as it goes into the body by the driver and mounts to the master cylinder. frequently, these line sections are in good shape because they are out of the salt and road abrasive spray so one can just install a coupler in the line to use new stuff from the bad part rearward. yes, it means lying on your back using a hand brake flaring tool.[/url]
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 6:25 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

There is a tool for adding a bead to larger pipes. Turbo folks run into this all the time. Pegasus Auto Racing sells one, but its more than youd likely want to pay. You can modify a pair of vice grips to add a bead. My bet there is a you tube video how to do this.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 10:04 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

I did that and it works really well! $7 locking pliers, $3 exhaust clamp, random washer. Took me a few minutes to make the tool and takes a few minutes to go around the pipe but for someone who isn't cranking out piping all day long it suits me just fine. I used a cheater pipe to pull down on the pliers because I did not have the hand strength to bend it.

Held 18psi no problem.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 10:19 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

Cool tool. Cool
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 11:21 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

djkeev wrote:
Read up on how Copper and Aluminum play together...... it ain't pretty!

Dave


Good callout! I guess copper doesn't like OAC coolant much either.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 3:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

You might find this info helpful when making new hard brake lines:
https://campwestfalia.com/making-custom-rigid-hydraulic-brake-lines/
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 5:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

Jeffrey Lee wrote:
You might find this info helpful when making new hard brake lines:
https://campwestfalia.com/making-custom-rigid-hydraulic-brake-lines/


Thank you!
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 4:01 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

I have been examining "The world of tubing" for a cheaper alternative and I note that stainless steel exhaust tubing is both readily available in 1.5" OD and cheaper than other alternatives. I'm wondering... these would be welded down the seam, no? Would that pipe be able to stand up to the pressure of a sealed, hot cooling system? Or would it blow?

This discussion has morphed such that it should probably be its own thread... but WTH...
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2021 7:17 am    Post subject: Re: Hard brake line replacement: what size line and fittings? Reply with quote

Exhaust is much hotter than 200 degrees and the measly 20psi is not an issue for any metal tubing.

Maybe if you made tubing out of gallium it would be a problem. Laughing
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