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js99nielsen
Samba Member
Joined: August 12, 2002
Posts: 116
Location: Battle Ground, WA
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 Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2022 8:49 pm Post subject: Engine ID help |
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Can anyone help me ID an engine. There is only "14" stamped on the generator stand below the firing order casting. The engine is in a 1950 vw powered tempo matador which originally came with a 25 hp. Thanks.
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'50 Tempo Matador (VW powered)
'65 Type 34
'65 dove blue doublecab
'89 Porsche 911 Carrera Targa ROW
'67 #1 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'63 beige gray/swr 15 window deluxe...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #2 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #3 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'64 turquoise kombi...100% original, O rust...sold, shoulda kept |
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js99nielsen
Samba Member
Joined: August 12, 2002
Posts: 116
Location: Battle Ground, WA
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| Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2022 8:21 am Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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Could no number mean it is the original engine?
_________________
'50 Tempo Matador (VW powered)
'65 Type 34
'65 dove blue doublecab
'89 Porsche 911 Carrera Targa ROW
'67 #1 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'63 beige gray/swr 15 window deluxe...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #2 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #3 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'64 turquoise kombi...100% original, O rust...sold, shoulda kept |
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sgmalt46
Samba Member
Joined: April 20, 2005
Posts: 1333
Location: south san francisco
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| Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2022 3:54 pm Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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looks like an aluminum case . believe they where used to early 50 ?
see if it has casting dates. that may be a clue. or replacement case .
is it complete? heads and tin are different 25hp vs. 36hp.
that will tell you more. or try a different forum. other vw vehicles / volksrods.
maybe better luck there. not to many of those around. cool ride.
Steve
_________________
55 deluxe 23 window bus
64 crew cab
55 rag top beetle
66 beetle
71 square back (sold) ! good luck with it Henry!
46 beetle 552nd royal army service corps CCG |
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busdaddy
Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004
Posts: 52736
Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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| Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2022 4:57 pm Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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| js99nielsen wrote: |
| Could no number mean it is the original engine? |
That's a question for Tempo experts to answer, did they use bespoke non numbered engines?, or industrial models for their builds?, unless that's a replacement case it's safe to say it likely wasn't previously installed in a VW car.
Does #14 show up in any of the Tempo's numbers?
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Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
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js99nielsen
Samba Member
Joined: August 12, 2002
Posts: 116
Location: Battle Ground, WA
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| Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2022 7:08 pm Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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Thanks guys. This started in another forum but Everett moved it here saying I would probably get more traction.
I've checked with the Tempo crowd and the thought (only comment I received) is it may be original but there is only so many Tempo owners and likely many of their vehicles had the engine replaced at some point.
The engine is complete and still installed in the Tempo. Where would casting dates be and what tin differences should I look for?
_________________
'50 Tempo Matador (VW powered)
'65 Type 34
'65 dove blue doublecab
'89 Porsche 911 Carrera Targa ROW
'67 #1 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'63 beige gray/swr 15 window deluxe...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #2 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #3 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'64 turquoise kombi...100% original, O rust...sold, shoulda kept |
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js99nielsen
Samba Member
Joined: August 12, 2002
Posts: 116
Location: Battle Ground, WA
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| Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2022 7:30 pm Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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Here are a couple photos...left and right side of the motor:
_________________
'50 Tempo Matador (VW powered)
'65 Type 34
'65 dove blue doublecab
'89 Porsche 911 Carrera Targa ROW
'67 #1 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'63 beige gray/swr 15 window deluxe...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #2 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #3 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'64 turquoise kombi...100% original, O rust...sold, shoulda kept |
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FarmerBill 
Samba Member
Joined: July 25, 2017
Posts: 859
Location: New England
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| Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2022 8:16 pm Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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| Casting dates should be just under the fuel pump boss and on the left side of the generator pedestal. |
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56samba
Samba Member
Joined: June 25, 2015
Posts: 274
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2022 11:29 pm Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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| Depending on the age of your engine case (up to early 1950 cases), you may find the casting dates behind the dizzy and generator stand, albeit covered by the fan shroud. |
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sgmalt46
Samba Member
Joined: April 20, 2005
Posts: 1333
Location: south san francisco
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| Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 7:28 am Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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25hp for sure. very cool. looks to have all the correct stuff.
_________________
55 deluxe 23 window bus
64 crew cab
55 rag top beetle
66 beetle
71 square back (sold) ! good luck with it Henry!
46 beetle 552nd royal army service corps CCG |
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js99nielsen
Samba Member
Joined: August 12, 2002
Posts: 116
Location: Battle Ground, WA
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| Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 11:06 am Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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Thanks everyone. I'll do more digging and let you know what I find. I many need to lift the cab off to get better access and clean things up. The engine still has oil in it and is not seized which is cool.
A pic when she was delivered to me (Germany to Uruguay to the Netherlands to me).
_________________
'50 Tempo Matador (VW powered)
'65 Type 34
'65 dove blue doublecab
'89 Porsche 911 Carrera Targa ROW
'67 #1 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'63 beige gray/swr 15 window deluxe...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #2 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #3 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'64 turquoise kombi...100% original, O rust...sold, shoulda kept |
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js99nielsen
Samba Member
Joined: August 12, 2002
Posts: 116
Location: Battle Ground, WA
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| Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 3:15 pm Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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Found it! Tempo stamps the number between the fan housing and clutch.
If you can't read them...the casting on the generator stand is 4-8-20 and the engine number is 121-0220477
_________________
'50 Tempo Matador (VW powered)
'65 Type 34
'65 dove blue doublecab
'89 Porsche 911 Carrera Targa ROW
'67 #1 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'63 beige gray/swr 15 window deluxe...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #2 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #3 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'64 turquoise kombi...100% original, O rust...sold, shoulda kept |
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sgmalt46
Samba Member
Joined: April 20, 2005
Posts: 1333
Location: south san francisco
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| Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 3:35 pm Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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looks like a winner casting date 4th day 8th month 2nd production shift 1950 
congrats. 121- must be a matador thing. 122 is industrial. no other vw
stamped the number there except type-3's probably easier to see due to the design .
i think there is only 10 or so known in existence. only made a few hundred.
Steve 
_________________
55 deluxe 23 window bus
64 crew cab
55 rag top beetle
66 beetle
71 square back (sold) ! good luck with it Henry!
46 beetle 552nd royal army service corps CCG |
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js99nielsen
Samba Member
Joined: August 12, 2002
Posts: 116
Location: Battle Ground, WA
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| Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 3:47 pm Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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I got a little more input from the Tempo crowd and found out where to look.
Because of the way the engine is mounted in the cab it was really difficult to see the numbers where they typically would be stamped for VW so Tempo had them stamped there on top of the clutch housing.
The Tempo guy I've been working with ran the numbers and confirmed it is the original engine & transmission! He also said he doesn't know of any (tempos) that have had the original engine. I'm pretty excited!
_________________
'50 Tempo Matador (VW powered)
'65 Type 34
'65 dove blue doublecab
'89 Porsche 911 Carrera Targa ROW
'67 #1 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'63 beige gray/swr 15 window deluxe...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #2 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #3 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'64 turquoise kombi...100% original, O rust...sold, shoulda kept |
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busdaddy
Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004
Posts: 52736
Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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| Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 4:06 pm Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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| js99nielsen wrote: |
| I'm pretty excited! |
I would be too!, congratulations! 
_________________
Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
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EverettB
Administrator
Joined: April 11, 2000
Posts: 71486
Location: Phoenix 602
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js99nielsen
Samba Member
Joined: August 12, 2002
Posts: 116
Location: Battle Ground, WA
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| Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2022 8:11 pm Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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Now my next question...recommendations for an engine re-builder? Obviously this engine just became important to me so I want someone reputable, reliable and experienced in these early motors. Someone in the PNW would be awesome so I can deliver it myself.
_________________
'50 Tempo Matador (VW powered)
'65 Type 34
'65 dove blue doublecab
'89 Porsche 911 Carrera Targa ROW
'67 #1 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'63 beige gray/swr 15 window deluxe...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #2 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #3 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'64 turquoise kombi...100% original, O rust...sold, shoulda kept |
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kalymnos
Samba Member
Joined: January 22, 2010
Posts: 117
Location: Hamburg/Germany
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| Posted: Sun Aug 21, 2022 4:43 am Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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Very very cool find: a 1950 Tempo Matador with matching engine!
Today I found an ad for the original paperworks for a 1950 Tempo, engine no. 121-0207503
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50 split
Samba Member
Joined: January 23, 2006
Posts: 105
Location: Skellefteå (Sweden)
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| Posted: Sun Aug 21, 2022 11:57 pm Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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| js99nielsen wrote: |
I got a little more input from the Tempo crowd and found out where to look.
Because of the way the engine is mounted in the cab it was really difficult to see the numbers where they typically would be stamped for VW so Tempo had them stamped there on top of the clutch housing.
The Tempo guy I've been working with ran the numbers and confirmed it is the original engine & transmission! He also said he doesn't know of any (tempos) that have had the original engine. I'm pretty excited! |
I'm sorry to say, but the 2 oldest known to public with pictures, is located in Sweden, and both have the original matching numbers for the car/chassiesnumbers.
There are some more 1950 tempo matador pickup's in sweden (at least 4 other than the 2 with og motor. But this other 4 cars does not (as far as I know) have og number matching engine.
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#Sawmillcollection
Kübel: 43 w Pepco
type 1: 50, 51 (kab), 51, 52(zwitt), 56, 57, 58, 60, 60, 61, 63, 63, 64, 65, 72
type 2: 51, 54 Taxi (H-O -26), 54, 56, 58, 65 (Fridge), 67(bay) 68, 68, 70, 70 (Burnt westy), 70 westy,71 westy 72, 73, 73, 75, 96, 96 Carthago, 01 Syncro , 2017
type 3 N: 62, 63 V: 62, 66, 67, 67, 68, F: 66 (Teak), 67
Type 4 2 door 71
Tempo: Matador 50(oldest)
Porsche: 356 65, 924 78
Anhänger:
Eriba Puck 65
Alfredo 59
Trailer Fickers So22, 65
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js99nielsen
Samba Member
Joined: August 12, 2002
Posts: 116
Location: Battle Ground, WA
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| Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2022 4:38 pm Post subject: Re: Engine ID help |
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Thanks for the info 50 split. Knowing there are 2 others with original engines does not dampen my excitement about mine. I'm actually glad there are others. These are awesome vehicles and the more that come to light for people to appreciate the better.
Now, do you have any spare parts? 😁
_________________
'50 Tempo Matador (VW powered)
'65 Type 34
'65 dove blue doublecab
'89 Porsche 911 Carrera Targa ROW
'67 #1 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'63 beige gray/swr 15 window deluxe...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #2 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'67 #3 SO-42 pearl white poptop walkthru...sold, shoulda kept
'64 turquoise kombi...100% original, O rust...sold, shoulda kept |
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