Sealing case and cylinders?

[jpaull]

My first stroker that i got from someone else ruined a crank and rod bearings/journals cause someone used sealant there and the just a little sealant came out and plugged a oil passage. Is it really worth it?

Seems like trying to seal a problem that doesn't exist.

[SGKent]

[Vanapplebomb]

[67rustavenger]

[Vanapplebomb]

Pretty easy with a collet style dowel pin pulled. The shuffle pins are not pressed in hard at all. Best that they have to come out anyways to dress the case.
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1800 Type 4 Berrien 295

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=487021

[Cusser]

[SGKent]

[modok]

Anybody read this?
https://dm.henkel-dam.com/is/content/henkel/Gasketing%20Design%20Guide-Final_LR

[Nitramrebrab72]

[chrisflstf]

What type of sealant did the Factory use?

Maybe someone ask Ray greenwood what is the best, lol He does have alot of good tech advice

I read the Henkel manual, mostly, need to reread again

What does Modok say?

Found this also:
https://www.amazon.com/Permatex-85420-Permashield-Resistant-Dressing/dp/B007VIGCJW?th=1

[rayjay]

Only somewhat relevant to case sealing.... Project Farm on YT recently did a silicone sealant comparison test. I had discovered Mopar black back in the mid 80s when I worked at a Dodge dealer. In the PF tests it came in a close second iirc and first when cost was factored in. I would not use it between the case halfs but will use it at the cyl bases and other areas where silicone sealant is appropriate

[modok]

On the type-1 whatever it was, it allowed the case halves to come together all the way.

I "think" it was a non-hardeneing sealant, or at least THAT kind of sealant suits the design best.
Keep in mind every little thing the factory did was not always super smart, you know, they had great ideas and they had bad ideas. Like the sealing nuts that didn't work, what the heck, why not acorn nuts.... they had them on the oil plate LOL.

The type-4 is a bit different and so is a WBX, the late WBX bearings would be virtually fully seated right at assembly so maybe that one you would use the loctite acrilic anerobic sealant.

Not just VW but many kinds of engines that have a rear bearing cap and main seal as one piece and it has the same kind of issues and for sure the best design is just not to design it that way at all, make the seal holder separate.
That way the bearing cap can flex and move around all it wants it won't disturb the seal and the sealant won't disturb the bearing cap seating.

Ray Greenwood thin film method very neat way to do it but around the main seal and cam plug and the oil pump is just terrible design and it does not SOLVE the problem fully, still requires absolute precision fits to work that only the German designers would dare to THINK is possible.

But IMO silicone in a groove is actually a good solution to that type of problem. So PERSONALLY that's what I will be experimenting with as I get the opportunity. Like cutting a groove between the main seal and the cam plug groove, and the loctite manual does give some good hints and ideas on that including 30 degree ramp shape, actually 30 degree chamfer might make it work better with non hardeneing sealant too.
But that IS an experiment, so, I may change my mind in five years. Have before. One time thought it was smart to use different kinds of sealant on different parts of the case split, well.... didn't work out. So, no more of that.

[modok]

[SGKent]

In the past I used Curil K2 and it weeped a tiny bit after 2500 miles. I used Loctite 574 and it weeped a little too. This time I used Threebond 1184. It seems like a really solid sealer, and paints on well. I used a little Loctite 574 on the case webs where the six bolts come thru. The cases are always well prepped before applying sealer. Kuril is probably the easiest to clean up with a little acetone.

While Threebond 1184 is highly recommended, it is good from-40C to 150C (-40F to 302F) then it starts to slowly lose strength. That is about the max one should ever let the oil get to on its worst day just before the fried eggs burn I'll let everyone know how it goes. I've never found anything that didn't weep a little after awhile. Used to use Gasgacinch - the old formula and it was good for about 15,000 miles on my t1 engines.
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George Carlin:
"Most people don't know what they're doing, and a lot of them are really good at it."

Skills@EuroCarsPlus:
"never time to do it right but always time to do it twice"

[Clatter]

[onehappykombi]

This is how I did it, I'll post an update if it runs...


Link

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'56 Early Split & '69 Early Bay

Overlanding the USA
Camper special engine build

[txoval]

Always brave to post a video.

Like Alstrup has said in previous posts…apply the sealant to the other case half without the studs sticking out…so much easier

That was also too much aviation…it will be on the bearings if you were to take the case apart, especially the flywheel side cam bearing. I’ve seen it first hand

Also, please don’t rotate your crank like that and have the rod smack the cylinder openings…I promise you there are dings in the sealing surface now

[VWNate]

Just found this helpful thread, thanx you Sir .
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-Nate

One last Beetle : 1959 #113 DeLuxe survivor ~ 36HP & full synchro tranny, 6 volts etc.

[raygreenwood]

[Dougy Dee]

YAY! Another Motoseal fan! I've been preaching thaat gospel for about 12 years now...