Alternator bearings

[runamoc]

[Wiskow]

I noticed today after starting up (note: I have a steep driveway and like to push start, don't know if that causes anything) that the alternator seemed to be making more noise. In the youtube video you can see it appears wobbly.
https://youtu.be/-tj7Q42_Aao

I removed the belt and can just barely feel some play in the alternator when I try to move it side to side.

Is my bearing bad?

[Cadaver]

Late to supper.

the 30 minute gen pull ( a new record?)

http://ac-vw-remove.com/At_Wits_End/Gen-Pull/index.html


the brushes park, by moving the spring up the back and park them
on the sides of the holders. the spring coil side (fat) now you can
push in the armature with no grief.

i added the 2 videos. for bench testing the gen.

http://ac-vw-remove.com/How_to_fix_it/electrics/index.html

look, ma, no car.

sorry i posted to dead link ,just wanted to add 1 link to a gen video
this has all the conditions stated. none on youtube do.
_________________
for sale now.
in Samba classifieds....1968 T1.

[schadenfreude]

the brushes, push on perfectly smooth slip rings. how can they make noise?
new alt, new brushes, etc..?
i use and electronic stethoscope to listen to all bearing

id take it apart and put in real bearing , the kind not made in china.

here are the steps.
koyo, FAG, Timken, NSK, National, etc. the top brands,
if you never heard of the brand, then pitch them.

go here, and click the top link, on page, Alternator.
http://ac-vw-remove.com/How_to_fix_it/electrics/generator/gen.html

[GLHTurbo]

It's a new (maybe 50 miles?) Chinese alternator. It has a welded fan on it also. It's from Chico (CPR), came on his turn-key engine.

When I spun it by hand strapped to the stand and bolted on the engine it makes the same sound has when I remove the alt/fan assembly and spin it in my hand. It seems like it's coming from the fan side. Think it's just the brushes?
_________________
1957 Beetle
1966 Bus

[schadenfreude]

gen in hand or at bench
or on car, with belt dropped only?

on gen, the brushes do that,
but a gen, no,it has smooth slip rings and the brushes are silent
you could have debris in the fan. or its loose or same with front
pulley and its washers floating around loose.

[GLHTurbo]

When spinning the alternator shaft by hand, should the bearings make any noise? Mine has a fairly audible whir. The shaft does not wobble.
_________________
1957 Beetle
1966 Bus

[schadenfreude]

go to harbor fright(pun name) see the section of pullers.
buy the 3 size kit and put it in you tool box.
now you are ready for bear.
all mechs have gear pullers. all. the generic set. if not
beg,barrow ,steal or rent them. (joking about steal)


if you have a gen, or alt.
consider the bearings. if they are bad it will vibrate
put in new bearings. (if you dont have the feel , then buy new ones)
inspect them
inspect the rotor /armature for damage.

no missing parts
fan not loose.
damage to fan shaft
damage to pulley shaft
forgot to set belt tension by the book, GOT BOOK?
fan not cracked or bent?
someone put wrong size fan in stock fan housing.
armature bent?
segments loose in armature.
bearings gone.

all this is obvious to an experienced mech. (DAMAGE)
the only thing not obvious is missing parts. that is why books are so amazing with the nice blow up drawing showing all those lil pieces.

bent. ?
i put the armature across 2 V-notch blocks and spin it, see wobble.
or chuck it in a drill press and spin it. wobble.


this subject and part is the most important part on the car
not the generator function
the FAN DRIVE.
do not gloss over it, make it all 100% perfect end to end with
new bearing and not burn up the engine. and a new Gates belt.

[bcampagnolo]

[Ian Epperson]

[bcampagnolo]

[schadenfreude]

just look, but not all gens have them.
some have springs that park,
on old 68 you lift the spring and set over to side parking it.

or have no way at all to get them retracted.
so many years and makes, who knows? till you look.

in some cases, you can used rods and bailing wire to hole them back.
some you must remove the brushes, but will be obvious.
ive tied them back with string.


if the brushes seem long and still good, i just run them. (and protect them during install of armature.)

the new brushes may spark a lot , until they break in. (not ALTS)
really on mine here, the hard parts is getting all the grime out..
what a lil piggy mine is. done.
http://ac-vw-remove.com/How_to_fix_it/electrics/generator/gen.html


now if i can only find all my starter parts (guts)
pinion clutch and a new solenoid, for less that $100
hard to find parts for vw starts and mine is OG, id like to keep it.

[Ian Epperson]

[schadenfreude]

yes, any good auto electric shop can do this.
just be careful not to damage the brush holders, going back in.
find a way to retract the brushes, many models of gen/alt
have magic hole that allows a paper clip or a tooth pick to lock them back.
some alts, the elect. reg,is in the front section and needs unsoldering first.
not this one, it's the friendly type.
use a puller and avoid the pry bar.
cheers !

[dazzac1965]

Hi Guys,
Thanks for a great thread - I think my bearings are shot too & thinking about getting them changed. (grumbling when engine is hot after a few miles TBH, I've got checked it out properly.
Alternator is off a 70's Jeans bug which I got many years ago so its been idle for many years (15ish!). I was going to give it too a auto electrician to do, but I think I'll give it a go myself after reading this thread!

[schadenfreude]

super Alternator page, so i add the book end , MR. GEN.
my 68 gen (actual)
http://ac-vw-remove.com/How_to_fix_it/electrics/generator/gen.html

do not buy or use China no name bearings.
Use Timken, NSK, FAG, or National or NSK
not SOM TING WONG

i see odd parts here too, shims, cool.
http://vwparts.aircooled.net/VW-Alternator-Volkswagen-Generator-s/339.htm

[schadenfreude]

MY Stock 12v gen has two, 6202z bearings. NSK maker (2 metal shields)
i found some nice Timken 202SS

202 is no seals
202-FF is 2 rubber seals.
202S is one side metal shield.
202SS two side metal shields and crosses in the Timken cat

these are pre greased bearings, and will last until the grease goes bad
which will not be forever,, no sealed bearing lasts for ever.
50k ? design life. there are charts in the timken eng. section showing this.
heat/load/temp.
the timkens are not cheap but or real high quality and usa made.


http://www.summitracing.com/parts/TMK-202FF/

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/TMK-202SS/

http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/catalog.php?catalo...EN%2B202FF

rock has both for $9.00

[kangaboy]

no, no noise at all...the only reason i ever noticed it was wobbly is because i had to take off my crank pulley, and in doing so i was taking off and putting on the alt pulley to get the belt on, and off. While i was putting the belt back on i noticed that the alt was a little wobbly.
Its funny what candy mustang said cause its true. I had 50,000 miles on that alt, and it was fine. It was only when i drove straight through from St. Louis Mo, to Los Angels that it got fried (32hrs, 1800miles).
_________________
-74 Standard - "CaliBug" 2084T, MS3X w/FI and Crank Fire
-76 Westy - "Gandalf"
-18 GTI SE

[Ian Epperson]

Ack, can't edit anymore:

[kangaboy]

I am having bearing problems line mentioned above, but instead of the bearing being bad, the back cover (fan side) where the bearing sits is wallered out a little bit, causing a loose fit, and a wobbly fan. Any ideas on what to do here? Try and get a core to fix it or what?
_________________
-74 Standard - "CaliBug" 2084T, MS3X w/FI and Crank Fire
-76 Westy - "Gandalf"
-18 GTI SE