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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 23531
Location: Kimball, Mi
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 Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2024 12:40 pm Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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| highwheelerboy22 wrote: |
| What are the current recommendations for pumps? I’m in the same boat with an original and need to replace it but I haven’t seen any Airtex e2000’s in a bit. I’m in Knoxville, TN |
The Airtex pump is usually sold at Autozone for an 86 to 90 Ford Ranger frame rail pump replacement. If you use that as what you're asking for (application), you'll get something that'll work. I've even used the Precision brand pump from O'Reilly's # 020160, and it works just fine.
Like Tram said there are other pumps that can be used. Ray even posted up a full page list of pumps, but that was a while ago.
Myself, I like to get the pump local in case I have a problem with it. Yes, I've had that happen before when the pump body started leaking, and I went to the parts store and replaced it (versus shipping it back and waiting for a replacement).
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 23022
Location: Northwest of Normal
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| Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 5:15 pm Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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These are an excellent substitute for both D-Jet and MFI pumps. Some plumbing wizardry is required:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/204321862654
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Немає виправдання для війни! Я з Україною.
| Bryan67 wrote: |
| Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
Those who can- do.
Those who can't? Subaru. |
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FastyOrange
Samba Member
Joined: November 15, 2012
Posts: 137
Location: Greenville, SC
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| Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 5:14 pm Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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I'm using the Carquest E319609 (Airtex E2000 equivalent) sold at advance auto parts. It sells for about $50, but you can order online for in store pick-up and apply promo codes for a better price. That pump has been installed in my car for about 2yrs now and is doing great.
Jon
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72 FI Fastback |
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highwheelerboy22
Samba Member
Joined: July 10, 2010
Posts: 33
Location: Rockford TN
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| Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 4:40 pm Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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| What are the current recommendations for pumps? I’m in the same boat with an original and need to replace it but I haven’t seen any Airtex e2000’s in a bit. I’m in Knoxville, TN |
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VenturaRichard
Samba Member
Joined: March 12, 2023
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Sun Apr 02, 2023 7:48 am Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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| Thanks, I'll reset it to 29 psi. |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 23531
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Sat Apr 01, 2023 9:25 am Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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| VenturaRichard wrote: |
Success. I installed a replacement fuel pump in my '71 FI T3 Automatic! It took 10 cycles of the on switch to get pressure to build to 5 psi in the drained lines. That was enough pressure to get it to start. No leaks and it holds 26psi, right where I had it set before. I had to modify a quick connect nylon clip to get the inlet fitting to push in far enough so it would click and hold. I am so happy and feel a great sense of accomplishment.
Thanks all you "blankity blank" Samba participants.
Ventura Richard |
Now you might want to reset the fuel pressure regulator and bump the pressure up to 28-30 psi, as that's where it should be set. The 26 psi will cause the engine to run rich.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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VenturaRichard
Samba Member
Joined: March 12, 2023
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 3:54 pm Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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Success. I installed a replacement fuel pump in my '71 FI T3 Automatic! It took 10 cycles of the on switch to get pressure to build to 5 psi in the drained lines. That was enough pressure to get it to start. No leaks and it holds 26psi, right where I had it set before. I had to modify a quick connect nylon clip to get the inlet fitting to push in far enough so it would click and hold. I am so happy and feel a great sense of accomplishment.
Thanks all you "blankity blank" Samba participants.
Ventura Richard |
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VenturaRichard
Samba Member
Joined: March 12, 2023
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2023 11:04 am Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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| Sodo wrote: |
| Donnie strickland wrote: |
This is what I used, except it was brass; it came with the pump:
I cut off the tip, so that the ring was left at the very tip of the barb. Been on there two years this November, with no problems. |
FYI.... this Bundy connector ($6.99)
......clips onto that brass fitting that you cut. Just FYI.
Fuel Line Quick Connector Ford 5/16" Barb to 5/16" Bundy Female
by Dynapex
Link: http://a.co/d/bTmGS2Y |
Sodo, Did the pump inlet fitting click into this Bundy connector like they were meant to? Is it still working without leaks?
Thanks, Ventura Richard |
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VenturaRichard
Samba Member
Joined: March 12, 2023
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2023 5:41 pm Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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| The brass inlet fitting that screws into the pump will not work with any female quick connect 5/16" hose fitting that I can find. I contacted the seller but they are no help. |
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VenturaRichard
Samba Member
Joined: March 12, 2023
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Thu Mar 23, 2023 4:49 pm Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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| After checking further and looking at detailed drawings, I confirmed with a seller that I can order a pump with a check valve included. So that's the one I ordered from seller #2 listed above, in Kansas. |
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VenturaRichard
Samba Member
Joined: March 12, 2023
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2023 7:20 pm Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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Ray,
Yes, I can see that we should want a check valve on the pump discharge to hold fuel pressure or the engine would be hard to start and we couldn't check for leak down. I didn't see any pumps in my online "E2000 replacement" searches that said they had check valves on them. A barbed hose fitting with a check valve sounds like a good idea. Guess I'll do some more searching.
Thanks, Richard |
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 23338
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2023 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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| VenturaRichard wrote: |
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| On my old 71 Notch, I only had to cycle the key 2 or 3 times, before I would try and start it up. My wife's 70 Fastback needs 3 to 5 times, as it doesn't seem as tight. Put a fuel pressure gauge on it, and have someone cycle the key, so you know what kind of pressure you have from the 2 seconds that the relay is energized (pump on). Do this a couple of times, until you have 28 to 30 psi on the gauge. It might give you a better idea of how my times you need to cycle the key. Also, once you've got the pressure built up, stop and watch (time it) how long it takes to bleed off that pressure. VW says it should fall to 20 psi in about 15 minutes, but my 71 would hold pressure (28 psi) for hours. I'm only mentioning it, as you might have an injector leaking (from not being used in a while), and that's causing a fuel pressure drop. |
So does the replacement pump have a check valve or will it hold pressure after a couple cycles of the initial switch on?
Richard |
Some pumps have them built in. The D-jet pump has a downstream check valve that doubles as a pressure relief under that little crimped cap. I will have to look at some of the section drawings to see if there is another type of check valve within the pump, but I have had enough of them open that I do not believe so.
The upstream check valve is the fuel pressure regulator.
A lot of the aftermarket pumps either have a screw in check valve on the outlet side or some are made with it built into the pump head.
A lot of the Airtex E2000...and there are many variations of it laid out for specific applications.....do not have check valves. Really just as many do have check valves.
As I am saying, teh difference is whether you are just buying a generic Airtex E2000....not destined for any particular application...or if the pump is set up to fit a specific model of car. Many of those come with either push-loc fittings, barbed fittings, check valve, 90* fittings...the range is huge.
Use this Google search
https://www.google.com/search?sxsrf=AJOqlzUKFNgmsw...mp;dpr=1.5
This takes you to "Airtex E2000 check valve"...and pictures. You can see what you are looking for by scrolling through the pictures on Google. I am pretty sure the basic E2000 does not have an internal check valve. It is usually part of the outlet nipple. You might find pumps that already have a brass or steel barbed screwed in when you get them. Remove that barb and check for a check valve...ball check valve.
If it does not have one, check the thread size and look online for a barbed fitting of that thread size that has an integral check valve. Place like Summit or Jegs can get that for you easy. Or you can buy barbed inline check valves that function just as well.
Ray |
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VenturaRichard
Samba Member
Joined: March 12, 2023
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2023 12:00 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| On my old 71 Notch, I only had to cycle the key 2 or 3 times, before I would try and start it up. My wife's 70 Fastback needs 3 to 5 times, as it doesn't seem as tight. Put a fuel pressure gauge on it, and have someone cycle the key, so you know what kind of pressure you have from the 2 seconds that the relay is energized (pump on). Do this a couple of times, until you have 28 to 30 psi on the gauge. It might give you a better idea of how my times you need to cycle the key. Also, once you've got the pressure built up, stop and watch (time it) how long it takes to bleed off that pressure. VW says it should fall to 20 psi in about 15 minutes, but my 71 would hold pressure (28 psi) for hours. I'm only mentioning it, as you might have an injector leaking (from not being used in a while), and that's causing a fuel pressure drop. |
So does the replacement pump have a check valve or will it hold pressure after a couple cycles of the initial switch on?
Richard |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 23531
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 2:36 pm Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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Like I said, I like to buy local in case I have a problem with it. In 1 case I bought a new Precision pump from O'Reilly's and it leaked fuel from the body of the pump. Took it back and they told me where the next nearest one was in stock (14 miles away), and had them put it on hold and went and got it, so I could finish the job. The mail service while cheaper can be a a problem if you have a problem (they don't like boxes that smell of gasoline). Just my take on it. You could try Summit or Jegs, since you have an idea of the pumps capacities too.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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VenturaRichard
Samba Member
Joined: March 12, 2023
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Tue Mar 21, 2023 10:35 am Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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Here's a quick summary of online search results for a new, '87 Ford Ranger, or Airtex E2000, inline, external, fuel pump, starting with cheapest. I'm not promoting anything. It's just information on what I found.
1. Wholesaler 1 (Torrence CA), Drivemotive, item #231848283749 with molding, 2 prong electrical connector, 37 gph, and what looks like the 2 quick connectors for $37.88, shipped in 4 days. (Couldn't tell me if it is neg. ground or psi rating).
2. Seller 2 (Gardner KS), looks the same, 72-125 psi, shipped 4 days, $37.89.
3. Auto Zone, TruGrade Spectra Premium universal, part # A1155EP, 12 v, neg. ground, 45-65 psi, 35gph, 4 hose clamps, 2 mounting straps, 4 bolts, 2 male brass hose connectors, $126.99, shipped.
4. O'Reilly, Precision, part # E16098, 40-70psi, 2 straps, 1 electrical fitting, $134.99 shipped to store in 1 day, must buy filter too.
Haven't decided yet. Richard
Last edited by VenturaRichard on Tue Mar 21, 2023 5:09 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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VenturaRichard
Samba Member
Joined: March 12, 2023
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Mon Mar 20, 2023 1:10 pm Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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Hi Bob, Yeah I've been doing searches on ebay and at Auto Zone, Napa and O'Reillys with mixed results. There's even a seller here with a Bosch.
Thanks for your help.
Richard |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 23531
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Mon Mar 20, 2023 12:20 pm Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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| VenturaRichard wrote: |
This is a great thread. Thanks for all the help and advice. I'm off to find a pump with good hose connectors at a reasonable price for my '71 F.I. Squareback.
Richard |
Either do a search, or ask Ray Greenwood for a list of ALL the pumps that can be used with the FI system on our cars. I know Ray's posted it before, and is over 20 pumps long.
I do know the Airtex E2000 pump works, as does the E16020 Precision brand pump. I only say that, as I've used both, and the Precision pump (from O'Reilly's) is cheaper, and I prefer to buy local in case I have a problem with it leaking (yes I did get one that leaked).
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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VenturaRichard
Samba Member
Joined: March 12, 2023
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Sun Mar 19, 2023 1:42 pm Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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This is a great thread. Thanks for all the help and advice. I'm off to find a pump with good hose connectors at a reasonable price for my '71 F.I. Squareback.
Richard |
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blues90
Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2009
Posts: 1912
Location: Hollywood ,CA
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| Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2022 2:41 pm Post subject: Re: Blankity blankin' fuel pump. |
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2 years ago I replaced all the engine fuel hose with Gates Barricade FI hose and from the engine to the pressure and return metal pipes at the rear for the tunnel. I used the proper FI clamps. When I replaced the fuel pump at the end of 2017 I only replaced the return line because the original pump had the Y fitting. Then I replaced the fuel filter and a new hose from the filter to the pump inlet. Also the pump outlet to the damper. The rest are old. I have enough Gates hose and FL clamps and a new Wix plastic 5/16" barb filter.
( I have a new auto zone plastic like the one on the car now yet it has all sorts of flash on the in and out and even where the white out top is fitted & a Carquest brand I got from O'reilly & a metal auto zone one which is well made outside but inside the filter media is only half the filters length and the element is way off center.) Point is the Wix brand is by far the best made one. Auto zone Duralast quality has dropped way down.
I found a plastic 5 gallon gas can looks like new someone placed where our trash cans are, Midwest brand , don't like the new no vent and odd spout, yet it will work to drain my tank. Also got a siphon pump with a check valve and it's clear 5/16" line so if it works I can use this to drain the tank without sucking on a hose and since the siphon pump line is 5/16" I can use one of the cheap fuel filters to drain ir fill the tanks ,as long as the tank is less than 1/2 full to gas can is large enough.
I also got these. https://www.dormanproducts.com/p-101552-800-783.aspx?origin=keyword#mz-expanded-view-1019937110909. so I can make the Gates hose and fuel hose routing more compact also in because the Gates FI hose does not slide over barb fittings like the regular Goodyear 5/16" ID hose does , I doubt it will slide over the 2 port pump quick disconnect rings.
I had the engine running and see no fuel leaks under the tank or lines and I checked and the fuel pump check valve is holding and have a new FPR on it which helped a lot. I don't need to prime the system nearly as long or cycle the key and pump the gas 2 to 3 times and still half the time it would quit running. It sat a week and I just used the prime switch for 30 seconds and it fired right up . if I let it sit for a day it takes 10 seconds to get the air out. The FPR is less than a month old. Nothing worst than getting a gas bath trying to replace the tank lines , it always runs down the arms.
I had them leak decades ago found fuel all over the garage floor yet at that time I still worked for Ford and had a hoist and one of those crank operated gas buggies to empty the tank was very easy. |
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Adriel Rowley
Samba Member
Joined: October 12, 2006
Posts: 4876
Location: Mesa, Arizona
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