1968 Squareback - The Keep-ening

[busman78]

Carb top needs to come off, needle seat stuck open, float stuck, something but the bowl is full and fuel will flow from every possible path available. Check your oil for fuel has no doubt run down the intake and past the rings.

[Bobnotch]

Sorry I can't help you on the carb questions as I don't have a single carb on anything but my lawn tractor. You might want to ask the 1500 club guys, as they have more knowledge about those carbs than anyone, as they came stock on the early cars.
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Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120

[Adoom]

Ok,
The new fuel pump rod arrived on Friday, unfortunately I was away (in West Virginia) for the weekend, so I just got to tinkering again today.

I'm ready to set this thing alight soon.

So, new fuel pump rod, I know it's pumping gas into the carb.

Still very slow to start. So I think to myself "clean up the carb a bit". Unfortunately I can't get the bottom carb mount nut off, so I cleaned what I could on the car.

1. is it normal for gas to be sitting in the rubber elbow that connects the carb to the oil bath?

2. Is is normal for the carb to shoot gas out this area by the butterfly and essentially drown itself.

I am attaching a video. For the record yes I had a fire extinguisher right beside me. And yes I now smell like a gas station.


Link


I'm pulling my hair out. I have 2 weeks to get this running so that I can drive it an hour to my storage location.

It does gas shower this everytime I start it.
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1968 Squareback

[Bobnotch]

[Tram]

[Erik G]

Make sure your trans ground strap is good and connected the right way too

[busman78]

A quick test is after running the vehicle and you get home, after about thirty minutes pull the #2 spark plug (easiest to get to), if it is wet and soaked with fuel you are either boiling the fuel in the bowl or the needle valve is not seating completely and the residual pressure in the mechanical pump floods the carb(s), or both. Both scenarios will leave the cylinders charged with excess fuel and starting right off difficult.

Things to try, penolic spacer between the intake and carb, electric fuel pump with cut off so fuel will not flow when not running and idle solenoid shut off valves, any and all will aid in the T3 Carb Cook-off Syndrome.

edit - Another quick test is after the vehicle has been turned off for 20-30 minutes wrap the palm of your hand around the fuel bowl of the carb, a good way to test how hot it has gotten.

[Adoom]

Call it mild frustration infused obsession, I pulled the mechanical fuel pump.
When I first tried manipulating it manually it was barely moving, and there was a bunch of crud built up in and around the actuating foot.

I sprayed some carb cleaner in the foot area and some chunks of i dunno what, came out. Then I sprayed some cleaner into the inlet and outlets and tried manipulating it by hand and boom it broke free and shot gas/cleaner a good 3 feet across the yard (uh, whoops). Now it pushes, a lot.

Then I measured the rod, on which the tip has slight mushrooming. It comes in at just 106mm, maybe 106.5mm, which is only 1.5-2mm shorter than it should be...but that is still shorter than I expected.

So I think, maybe, it was thirsty. I'm going to order a new $4 rod and see if that was the issue all along.
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1968 Squareback

[Adoom]

[Zwitterkafer]

The fuel tank screen filter is clean beyond suspicion? Sometimes the fuel pump is still OK but can't compensate for reduced flow from the tank.
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"Criticism comes easier than Craftsmanship"
- Zeuxius, 400 BC

[Adoom]

It's a good thing my hair falls out on its own, otherwise I would be pulling it out.

New day, new parts. Installed a new cap, wires, and condenser. Also a new coil.

Same sh!77y routine. Fires right up.. when cold. Moment it's been running for a bit it has no interest in firing.

I'm really scratching my head here. I've replaced all the "sparky stuff". Adjusted the valves, timing is on point. Changed the oil in the bath.

[Bobnotch]

Sounds like you've been busy. I've had several condensers fail from sitting. but they've also been non Bosch units. Jim Adney says the older Bosch ones last the longest, and since you're getting bit by the plug wires, I'd say they're working just fine. Maybe you need to replace the plug wire boots at the cap instead.
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Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120

[Adoom]

I hate "throwing parts" for the sake of throwing parts, but a lot of this car is "pre-me" so I don't know the actual age or condition of a lot of it. SO, I just ordered a new cap, wires, condensor, and coil.

Coil: the spark is super weak when it IS in the points. I've had this coil for a long time as a spare for my old bus, so I think grabbing a new might be a nice-to-have.

Cap: when I was turning the distributor for timing, I was initially getting mostly shocked by #3 & 4. The cap *looks* ok, but for $15 its peace of mind.

Wires: see photo, also I don't know if the shocks are coming from wires or cap. Actually, now that I think of it, I replaced the wires 4 (ish) years ago with a set from Rock Auto. You'd think they would last longer than this.

Consdensor: the weak spark thing got me wondering. I know there's been a production issue in the past with condensers, AND I know the condenser I have won't seat in the distributor hole properly or securely. I'm willing to try a new one in hopes of getting some blue or white spark instead of orange.

Hoping everything will be in by the weekend (wishful thinking) so I can get this thing running properly.

I will say that when it's running on all 4 and *NOT shorting out, it sounds pretty nice. I put the new fresh air hoses on, changed the oil and adjusted the valves.

Now I just need it to...run properly.

Oh I also upgraded the seat belts.
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1968 Squareback

[Erik G]

there you go, I thought it was distributor related

I do check my cars in the pitch black every once in a while.

[Adoom]

I keep getting shocked by this distributor! Which I *think* is a major factor in it's poor running/starting.

When I was 16 I had a '79 rabbit that was misfiring, occasionally, but not always. Drove me nuts. One night my dad suggested spraying a mist of water over the ignition and to look for arcs. My plug leads lit up like Christmas.

So last night I did the same. By ouchy feel cylinder #3 is live to the touch, but by misty eye, cylinder 2 is also arcing.

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1968 Squareback

[Bobnotch]

[Mike Fisher]

[Bobnotch]

It's amazing how well these engines run with a little attention paid to them. It seems like they just need a little love thrown at them and they'll respond in kind. You're gaining on it, and all it's costing is a little time.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120

[Adoom]

Turns out is was just beginners luck. This morning I was back to the same old starting routine. Took 4 tries to fire. I will need to address the timing tonight. Then I will need to wait for a cool morning to adjust the valves. (might as well change the oil then too).

Getting there.
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1968 Squareback

[Adoom]

It's actually not a 009 (thankfully, I did have one of those in my bus for a couple of flat spotactular years), but noted on checking the timing. Looks like I need to dig out my timing light.
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1968 Squareback