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Gordo_89
Samba Member
Joined: February 11, 2018
Posts: 89
Location: UK.
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 Posted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 4:03 pm Post subject: chassis rail rust |
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Good Evening,
The time has come to attack the front of the van. above the sub frame there is rust.
what is the best plan of attack for this area
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1989 Vanagon 2.1L |
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82westyrabbit
Samba Member
Joined: March 02, 2015
Posts: 1013
Location: Ma
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| Posted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 5:57 pm Post subject: Re: chassis rail rust |
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| Assuming you can’t sandblasted go after it with a wire wheel on a drill get it as clean as you can and repaint it. I cleaned up the bottom of my van a few years ago and repainted it. Now three more people will give a different opinion but that’s what I did. John |
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4Gears4Tires
Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2018
Posts: 4221
Location: MD
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| Posted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 6:10 pm Post subject: Re: chassis rail rust |
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^ That's basically it. Knock all the loose stuff with a wire wheel, drill or angle grinder whatever you have. Then coat everything with 2 coats of 3M Mar-Hyde. Paint it with 3M Undercoating.
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'87 Syncro Ferric Oxyhydroxide Superleggera Edition
'85 Westy Sciuridae Domus Edition
Last edited by 4Gears4Tires on Sun Nov 10, 2019 6:10 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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danfromsyr
Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15370
Location: Syracuse, NY
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| Posted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 6:10 pm Post subject: Re: chassis rail rust |
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you have to give that the screw driver test.
and not a wimpy 4way screwdriver, but a stout molded handle one
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dobryan
Samba Member
Joined: March 24, 2006
Posts: 17160
Location: Brookeville, MD
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alaskadan
Samba Member
Joined: January 09, 2013
Posts: 1937
Location: anchor pt. alaska
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| Posted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 8:52 pm Post subject: Re: chassis rail rust |
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| Thats classic syncro frame rot. Its coming from within. Ask me how I know. Its a multi layer sandwich thats full of sand and road grit. Another member is doing this very repair right now and asked me to down load my repair pics I'd mentioned before. I just downloaded a bunch of them to the samba gallery just a few days ago. Search syncro front frame repair. It involves dropping the front cradle to do. |
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jlrftype7
Samba Member
Joined: July 24, 2018
Posts: 4581
Location: Chicago
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| Posted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 8:55 pm Post subject: Re: chassis rail rust |
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| dobryan wrote: |
| Yep. Is it surface rust or more serious? Surface rust you can wire wheel then ospho then paint and you are good to go. More serious and you are figuring out how to remove the bad part and weld in new metal. |
. This.... I’ve been lucky with my undercarriage/rails and metal so far.
I scraped, wire brushed, Rust Converted, then multiple coats of Eastwood Rust Encapsulated Paint.
Only my steps in front will need the cut out and weld treatment.
They were already too far gone... holey as it wer... 
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'68 Westy- my first VW and vehicle/Bus- long gone.- sold it to a traveling Swiss couple....
'67 Type 3 Fastback, my 2nd car- gone
'69 Semi-Auto Stick Shift Beetle-gone
2017 MINI Coopers, our current DDs
‘84 Tin Top - Hilga....Auto |
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Gordo_89
Samba Member
Joined: February 11, 2018
Posts: 89
Location: UK.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2019 2:47 am Post subject: Re: chassis rail rust |
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Some good photos there alaskadan will help massively.
My understanding the build up is like below
So 3 sections of metal in total plus the floating plate.
How difficult was the cutting out in this area?
"I cleaned up the bottom of my van a few years ago and repainted it. Now three more people will give a different opinion but that’s what I did. John."
How's the underside holding up? iv started mine but not done the front yet.
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1989 Vanagon 2.1L |
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alaskadan
Samba Member
Joined: January 09, 2013
Posts: 1937
Location: anchor pt. alaska
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| Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:52 am Post subject: Re: chassis rail rust |
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Yeah thats pretty close. Since i did that repair i saw another thread somewhere of someone doing this and they had found replacement bolt plates. It might have been gowesty. When i fixed my van i used steel i had laying around. I actually used thicker steel on all the parts. The original bolt plates arent full width of the inside of the frame but mine are. You'll notice that i left 1/2" flanges sticking out on the vertical walls with rosette holes drilled through them. Thats so the inner wall layers could be rosetted in and then the outer layer goes on leaving a 3/16" gap to be welded shut. Thus staggering the ends of the layers. If you get what i mean. With the front cradle removed access is good. The cradle comes off in one unit pretty easily. When done I cavity waxed the inside of it. A drain or inspection hole with a plug might be a good idea. Also you will notice that i supported my van by the front jack points. That left all the nose weight cantilevered . I think i actually created ever so slight of a drop that shows in the front door reveals. Maybe support it under the front frame tips too? These bodies do flex a little.
Last edited by alaskadan on Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:56 am; edited 1 time in total |
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nmerrill
Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2014
Posts: 388
Location: Vermont
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vanatic
Samba Member
Joined: November 17, 2007
Posts: 82
Location: Norman, OK
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| Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:55 am Post subject: Re: chassis rail rust |
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I've been putting this off for about a year. I was initially going to cut it out and put thicker single pieces of material. I know that several other vehicles have layered frame rails like this. Is this necessary to allow for some flex?
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Gordo_89
Samba Member
Joined: February 11, 2018
Posts: 89
Location: UK.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2019 11:18 am Post subject: Re: chassis rail rust |
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What did you weld to towards the front I can work the rest out but unsure on that section
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1989 Vanagon 2.1L |
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Gordo_89
Samba Member
Joined: February 11, 2018
Posts: 89
Location: UK.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2019 11:22 am Post subject: Re: chassis rail rust |
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| vanatic wrote: |
I've been putting this off for about a year. I was initially going to cut it out and put thicker single pieces of material. I know that several other vehicles have layered frame rails like this. Is this necessary to allow for some flex?
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I was told by the tester to plate it up but don't fancy undoing a quick fix later down the road. By the look of the buildup it would need the internals replacing prior to welding in a plate. It looks like it all comes out relatively easily from the photos and research.
Alignment would be my next concern of the chassis and suspension mounting points.
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1989 Vanagon 2.1L |
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alaskadan
Samba Member
Joined: January 09, 2013
Posts: 1937
Location: anchor pt. alaska
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| Posted: Mon Nov 11, 2019 8:21 pm Post subject: Re: chassis rail rust |
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| Gordo_89 wrote: |
What did you weld to towards the front I can work the rest out but unsure on that section |
In a factory setup the bolt plate can be removed through a horizontal slot on the front end. It has a little tongue on the front that sticks out on the front when its installed. My bolt plate is full width and welded along the bottom edges to the internal vertical wall plates. The inner vertical walls fit tight inside the outer walls . They extend up above center of frame so I could rosette them to the inside of the upper half of the frame also. |
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