Rust under windsheild=advice

[Mulcheese]

Pulled the windshield tonight to replace ( it was cracked) and I was anticipating some rust. This is what I found.

I have a stick welder. Im not that experienced at it though. Is this a candidate for filler? What would you do?
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82 Westy: Air is cool!

[DAIZEE]

ok, I'd like to take a shot at this to see if I'm learning. If I am incorrect, tell me so.

As a newbie to Vanagons I think you'll have to cut all the rust out being careful re the washer hose below and then weld a piece on and then do the detailing/finishing.

[WestyBob]

There are many ways to tackle this and most of them are not wrong. It depends on your own skills and/or those who have them whom you pay to do. It depends on the amount of time you want to spend doing it versus turning it all over to someone else. It depends on how much money you want to or can spend.

If you can afford, you might want to turn this over to a good body shop and get er done fast.

All the metal that has been weakened (pitted) needs to be carefully cut out. The remaining surface rust around it can be lightly grinded or sanded off.

If the hole turns out to be much larger you may need some welding using other donor metal.

I like using a fiberglass epoxy on smaller holes - like bondo but much stronger with fiberglass strands.

Need to attach a mesh screen (like a door/window screen) underneath and bigger than the hole using the epoxy along the edges - attach as flush as possible from the botom with the sill and let dry for a day.

Mix up some more and start filling the hole from the top gently over the screen and surrounding area. Get this first coating approx. level with the rest of the sill, then let dry.

Hand or small block sand this down close to the sill level, then add some more stuff to fill in pitting and uneveness, let dry and sand again, this time more carefully and as even as possible to the level of the sill contours as possible.

Repeat as necessary to fill in any pits that occur - the ultimate goal is to get the sill contour perfect.

Wipe all the dust away, tape off area with blue painter's tape and newspaper, spray three coats of gray primer on it.

Get some good quality spray paint of like color and put two coats on.

If the primer and paint raise the sill height then you'll need to lightly sand again and then repeat the paint thing. It's a feel-your-way job.

Install windshield with a new seal and urthane - lots of it. You may want to get a pro to come over and do this for you.

[stevey88]

Mine is worse then yours. The lower lip is all rusted and there are two holes. Obviously the wind shield was replaced before and no sealant was used. I cut out the whole reinforcement 'tube" behind the windshield lip and cut out the good part from my parts van. Made a flange on the part of metal at the front of the wind shield opening lip and weld in the good metal. It was actually easier than I first thought. I welded up the holes by placing a brass plate behind them and weld it shut using my MIG with C25 gas.

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Steve

87 Westfalia full camper 4 speed

[Mulcheese]

I think I will cut out the metal, weld in donor metal, grind smooth, prime and paint. If I dont do it correct I dont want this guy on my case!

Found this on Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=di_OpQjaDnI&feature=related

Better do it right the first time.
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82 Westy: Air is cool!

[r39o]

Those holes are NOT bad enough to have to cut out!

You need to STOP the rust.

Clean and apply metal prep.

Now use body lead to fill it up.

Smooth out.

Neutralize the flux.

Metal prep again

Now apply anti rust paint like POR15.

Top coat.

It looks like you have some spot welds that did not get enough paint.

Those are the "spots" that rust.

"Usually," you end up removing all the paint in the channel and metal prep and seal before top coating again.

Oddly my rust free 85 is rusting under there after only 5 years after painting.....

My 90 has never been painted, windshield replaced and is NOT rusting....
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"Use the SEARCH, Luke" But first visit the Vanagon FAQ!

1990 Multivan EJ 22, Rancho trans 0.82 4th, Small Car front AC, CLKs w/ 215/65-16, homemade big brakes 303mm, Konis, Recaros, etc....

Click to see my ads for Cup holders, Subaru clutch fix and CLK wheels (no wheels currently)

[Mulcheese]

[JPrato]

[Mulcheese]

I was thinking that welding is the best method but I have an arc welder and everyone talks about using TIG. Will arc work? My fear is that I will burn through and make things worse.
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82 Westy: Air is cool!

[MarkWard]

Actually, most hobbiests would have access to a MIG welder not a TIG. Ideally it is connected to a gas bottle rather than flux core wire. The MIG utilizes a gun with wire feed. It is very difficult to weld rusty thin sheet metal period. Windshield frames are also important to get correct. While your rust looks bad to you and you are a beginner body man, I would be inclinded to follow the advice of stopping the rust and then filling the holes. Welding overheats the metal and if not properly done, can actually accelerate the rusting where the patch is welded to the existing sheet metal. It does not look that bad to me. mark

[r39o]

Cutting and welding introduces issues on the other side of the metal.

I never stated that you were not going to not remove rust nor not seal it, too.

There are other processes out there.

In this case I believe leading would seal the wounds.

Flame spray metal can be done too, but this is not hobbyist.

You can gas weld that area too with a very fine tip.

I have fixed these areas in the past using several methods.

As stated at the top somewhere most methods will work.

The factory had a sealer in there that most glass shops don't put back and it seems to cause this issue.

You MUST stop the rust and seal well is the primary idea.
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"Use the SEARCH, Luke" But first visit the Vanagon FAQ!

1990 Multivan EJ 22, Rancho trans 0.82 4th, Small Car front AC, CLKs w/ 215/65-16, homemade big brakes 303mm, Konis, Recaros, etc....

Click to see my ads for Cup holders, Subaru clutch fix and CLK wheels (no wheels currently)

[stevey88]

The hole will be much bigger once you clean out the rust. I think replacing the metal is the way to go. Buy a GOOD MIG welder and it will serve you for years to come, if you like to work on your own auto and do your own repair that is.
Replace only the rusted part since the lips seems to be OK. However, no matter which way you choose to go, you have to remove the dash and the wiper mechanism. So might as well do a blower lube and change out the foam seals of the blower unit. It is the " might as well " thing that always cast me time and money.
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Steve

87 Westfalia full camper 4 speed

[r39o]

While it is Summer, you could always prep things and take it to a pro to do the real work. Once all the stuff is removed and clear for the pro to work, it is only a matter of an hour or two for that person. Then the job is right.

I am about to have the nose on my 1990 painted and will remove all the stuff so the pro just has to do the paint work. I put it all back again. That way I have lots of control over the job.
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"Use the SEARCH, Luke" But first visit the Vanagon FAQ!

1990 Multivan EJ 22, Rancho trans 0.82 4th, Small Car front AC, CLKs w/ 215/65-16, homemade big brakes 303mm, Konis, Recaros, etc....

Click to see my ads for Cup holders, Subaru clutch fix and CLK wheels (no wheels currently)

[dobryan]

I don't understand why it has to be repaired by welding. It is not a structural area so the strength of metal is not needed. Any repair will require that the underside is treated to prevent rust. Welding in new metal still requires the underside to be treated after the welding is done. What is wrong with cleaning out the rust, treating the underside, and repairing using fiberglass and epoxy? This type of repair is eazy peazy compared to welding (for me at least).
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Dave O
'87 Westy w/ 2010 Subaru EJ25 (Vanaru) and Peloquin TBD

"To travel hopefully is a better thing than to arrive." Robert Louis Stevenson

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[PDXWesty]

I've seen gas welding and even brazing done on a small area like that with good success. Brazing is easy enough for anyone to do.
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89 Westy 2.1 Auto

[kevtherev]

cut the cancer out then fiberglass it.
Take a profile and sand it down to it.

easy like dobryan says

[MarkWard]

I think it depends on skill set and budget. I have used Devcon with good success after stopping the rust. POR 15 is often recommended here for rust control. I like to use Rust Encapsulator sold by Eastwood. Here is a link to the Devcon metal repair. It will appear to be more for making parts, but can be used as a filler and sanded. http://www.devcon.com/products/products.cfm?market=Maintenance%20%26%20Repair&cat=Metal%20Repair

[Zero419]

This thread scares me.









I can see a hole forming with the glass in!
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1987 Westy Auto Bostig 2.0 Ztec

[MarkWard]

[chimivee]

I have also had long-term success patching with fiberglass (along w/ grinding out rust, POR-15, etc).

4 years later:

A straight-forward job with the hardest part being removing/installing the windshield. I'm a lot more a'feered of the looming seam/camper rust on my current van.
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-James
86 Syncro Westy, etc