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TinyPickle
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Joined: December 15, 2021
Posts: 190
Location: Slovenia, Europe
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 Posted: Sat Jun 17, 2023 11:33 am Post subject: Syncro rear diff/trans mounting holes in body [solved] |
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I need help again, as i have again some steel profiles that were changed in rust repairs and i think that i am again lacking some mounting holes.
Can somebody shine some light on how is the syncro trans mounted to the body, in the front of the trans, see pics for parts in question:
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Last edited by TinyPickle on Mon Jul 03, 2023 11:36 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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ALIKA T3
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MarkWard
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Joined: February 09, 2005
Posts: 18813
Location: Retired South Florida
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| Posted: Sat Jun 17, 2023 12:25 pm Post subject: Re: Syncro rear diff mounting holes in body - help |
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I did a 2wd to syncro conversion. I was posting my progress, but at the time, no one seemed really interested. So, I eased off on the documentation.
Because it was a 2wd, it did not have the syncro transmission mounts. I spent a lot of time figuring it out. Others had suggested cutting the floor above to have access. Other's suggested cutting the subframe. I ended up fabricating nut plates and was able to get them into position through the factory cutouts. Once in place, I welded them in place from below. Worked out quite nice.
At the time I was thinking, a bolt up jig to the 2wd transmission mounting holes for marking the position of the syncro holes would be helpful for the next one. I cut the subframe section out of the donor to make the jig, but have zero interest in doing another one. I pitched it, but I did take a picture and post it of the backside for the syncro cross member.
The tab you are asking about, doesn't look like factory welds and it apears you have the mounting holes for the syncro transaxle brackets. You'll need to drop the coolant pipes. Probably need to discard that bracket on the LS. Possibly someone was using it for a modified clutch hose or maybe a hand brake cable. I don't think it belongs there. |
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dobryan
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Location: Brookeville, MD
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MsTaboo 
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Joined: June 02, 2006
Posts: 4569
Location: East Kootenay, British Columbia
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| Posted: Sat Jun 17, 2023 1:29 pm Post subject: Re: Syncro rear diff mounting holes in body - help |
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Remember "Project Crunchie '87 Syncro..." has loads of detailed pictures of the undercarriage.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/1209166.jpg
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...p;start=40
On my Syncro I had one of those mounting holes get stripped out, fortunately there's enough meat in the welded capture nuts to carefully retap to a slightly larger size bolt.
Here's a couple pics showing the brackets in white and the transmission mount cradles in green.
Hope that helps.
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Currently:
'90 Syncro Westy 3 knob w/Zetec
The information age has morphed into the age of disinformation and willful ignorance. Agnotology!
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TinyPickle
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Joined: December 15, 2021
Posts: 190
Location: Slovenia, Europe
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| Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2023 10:32 am Post subject: Re: Syncro rear diff mounting holes in body - help |
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well i feel kind of ridicoulos, after some proding with screwdriver i discovered that the right side is actually ok with threads and everything, so i mounted the right mount.
Question regarding the left side (which doesn't have the threaded holes, it just have two holes and i'm missing the third) is this position correct? Just want to double check before i go drilling.
Regarding the strange bracket on the left, the van is from '91, so it's not an early bracket and it seems that it doesn't get in way of the mount.
I will probably do as i did for the front axle carrier, i'll fabricate a threaded metal strip that i'll insert into the profile, like this:
_________________
God of rust, have mercy.
WIP - Offroad Spec Syncro - 1.9 TDI AFN - Build Thread
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0
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MarkWard
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Joined: February 09, 2005
Posts: 18813
Location: Retired South Florida
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| Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2023 5:47 pm Post subject: Re: Syncro rear diff mounting holes in body - help |
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I would not go drilling holes yet. With the engine and trans mated, you can mount them in the chassis with the engine mount and the one transmission mount. Then locate your one remaining mount.
From your one picture above, is it possible the unknown bracket was welded over the missing hole?
You can see from the picture I linked above all the transmission weld nut locations. I don’t see how a syncro could be missing them.
Probably not what you want to hear. If your hole and weld nut are missing, you’re going to need to get inventive. Perhaps drilling and welding a bolt to a plate that you can fish into your new hole. Then tack weld the bolt and use a nut and washer in that one location. |
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TinyPickle
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Joined: December 15, 2021
Posts: 190
Location: Slovenia, Europe
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| Posted: Sun Jun 18, 2023 10:35 pm Post subject: Re: Syncro rear diff mounting holes in body - help |
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| MarkWard wrote: |
I would not go drilling holes yet. With the engine and trans mated, you can mount them in the chassis with the engine mount and the one transmission mount. Then locate your one remaining mount.
From your one picture above, is it possible the unknown bracket was welded over the missing hole?
You can see from the picture I linked above all the transmission weld nut locations. I don’t see how a syncro could be missing them.
Probably not what you want to hear. If your hole and weld nut are missing, you’re going to need to get inventive. Perhaps drilling and welding a bolt to a plate that you can fish into your new hole. Then tack weld the bolt and use a nut and washer in that one location. |
The steel profile that held nuts was changed for a new one by a welder, so that's why i'm lacking nuts. I think there is enugh space to get a plate with threaded holes into the profile instead of welded nuts. I'll try, if not, the welded-bolt idea might work aswell.
This is the detailed pic for the mount holes, i'm guessing that the correct hole is the right one? so the unknown bracket doesn't get in the way of trans-mount.
_________________
God of rust, have mercy.
WIP - Offroad Spec Syncro - 1.9 TDI AFN - Build Thread
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0
IG: syncro_brothers |
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MarkWard
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Location: Retired South Florida
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| Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2023 4:01 am Post subject: Re: Syncro rear diff mounting holes in body - help |
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If you look at the syncro crossmember I posted above. The bottom of the picture is the left side of the van. The bottom 3 weld nuts are the ones you are dealing with. If you look above those nuts you can make out where I removed the crash bar tabs from below.
So without measuring I’d say your drawing is close. |
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MsTaboo
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Location: East Kootenay, British Columbia
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| Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2023 11:23 am Post subject: Re: Syncro rear diff mounting holes in body - help |
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Here's a couple more of the area. This is a 1990 Syncro Westy.
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Currently:
'90 Syncro Westy 3 knob w/Zetec
The information age has morphed into the age of disinformation and willful ignorance. Agnotology!
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TinyPickle
Samba Member
Joined: December 15, 2021
Posts: 190
Location: Slovenia, Europe
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| Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2023 2:42 am Post subject: Re: Syncro rear diff mounting holes in body - help |
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Thank you all, it looks to me that the right hole is correct. I will measure the trans mount holes and see if the carrier fits the holes. I will post pictures of how i'll resolve this.
_________________
God of rust, have mercy.
WIP - Offroad Spec Syncro - 1.9 TDI AFN - Build Thread
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0
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MsTaboo
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Location: East Kootenay, British Columbia
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| Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2023 3:47 pm Post subject: Re: Syncro rear diff mounting holes in body - help |
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Amazing amount of work bringing that Syncro back to life! (interesting seeing that clutch pipe mount in the last years of production)
TinyPickel's pics:
_________________
Currently:
'90 Syncro Westy 3 knob w/Zetec
The information age has morphed into the age of disinformation and willful ignorance. Agnotology!
All that's needed for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing.
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TinyPickle
Samba Member
Joined: December 15, 2021
Posts: 190
Location: Slovenia, Europe
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| Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2023 10:38 pm Post subject: Re: Syncro rear diff mounting holes in body - help |
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| MsTaboo wrote: |
Amazing amount of work bringing that Syncro back to life! (interesting seeing that clutch pipe mount in the last years of production)
TinyPickel's pics:
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Thank you. Is this clutch pipe mount the eye-mount on the left besides the left trans mount? It's original?
_________________
God of rust, have mercy.
WIP - Offroad Spec Syncro - 1.9 TDI AFN - Build Thread
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0
IG: syncro_brothers |
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MarkWard
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Location: Retired South Florida
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| Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2023 4:56 am Post subject: Re: Syncro rear diff mounting holes in body - help |
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This is how I remember my clutch slave line.
Your tab appears to have been added at a later date. |
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MsTaboo
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| Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2023 11:23 am Post subject: Re: Syncro rear diff mounting holes in body - help |
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| TinyPickle wrote: |
| MsTaboo wrote: |
Amazing amount of work bringing that Syncro back to life! (interesting seeing that clutch pipe mount in the last years of production)
TinyPickel's pics:
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Thank you. Is this clutch pipe mount the eye-mount on the left besides the left trans mount? It's original? |
Yes, the "eye-mount" on the left that the clutch hydraulic hose is passing through.
I thought it might be factory based on it being as rusty as the rest of the body, but you never know what may have been added to these Syncros over the years.
I've always seen a one piece plastic pre-formed pipe running from the metal hydraulic pipe to the clutch slave. Yours appears to be rubber?
Replaced my plastic pipe with one of the S.S. hoses like this:
https://burleymotorsports.net/product/syncro-hydraulic-clutch-slave-cylinder-hose/
(edit)
Just noticed in the Burley diagram part #38A and showing a two part hydraulic hose #34 and #35. So maybe an older (or alternate) style.
Hadn't seen that before.
_________________
Currently:
'90 Syncro Westy 3 knob w/Zetec
The information age has morphed into the age of disinformation and willful ignorance. Agnotology!
All that's needed for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing.
Resist Kleptocratic Oligarchy (and Idiocracy)! |
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TinyPickle
Samba Member
Joined: December 15, 2021
Posts: 190
Location: Slovenia, Europe
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| Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2023 11:06 pm Post subject: Re: Syncro rear diff mounting holes in body - help |
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| MsTaboo wrote: |
| TinyPickle wrote: |
| MsTaboo wrote: |
Amazing amount of work bringing that Syncro back to life! (interesting seeing that clutch pipe mount in the last years of production)
TinyPickel's pics:
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Thank you. Is this clutch pipe mount the eye-mount on the left besides the left trans mount? It's original? |
Yes, the "eye-mount" on the left that the clutch hydraulic hose is passing through.
I thought it might be factory based on it being as rusty as the rest of the body, but you never know what may have been added to these Syncros over the years.
I've always seen a one piece plastic pre-formed pipe running from the metal hydraulic pipe to the clutch slave. Yours appears to be rubber?
Replaced my plastic pipe with one of the S.S. hoses like this:
https://burleymotorsports.net/product/syncro-hydraulic-clutch-slave-cylinder-hose/
(edit)
Just noticed in the Burley diagram part #38A and showing a two part hydraulic hose #34 and #35. So maybe an older (or alternate) style.
Hadn't seen that before. |
Interesting, could also be some kind of european thing, vanagons meant for export to USA could be different i imagine.
I can't answer you regarding the clutch pipe, i have everything in a jumble right now and can't discern what is what 
I'll keep the eye-mount though 
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God of rust, have mercy.
WIP - Offroad Spec Syncro - 1.9 TDI AFN - Build Thread
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IG: syncro_brothers |
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TinyPickle
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Joined: December 15, 2021
Posts: 190
Location: Slovenia, Europe
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| Posted: Thu Jun 22, 2023 10:53 pm Post subject: Re: Syncro rear diff mounting holes in body - help [solved] |
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I employed my sick welding skills to fabricate a stainless steel thread strip, so that i can put it inside the beam. I am 98% that it will fit inside and not catch to anything
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God of rust, have mercy.
WIP - Offroad Spec Syncro - 1.9 TDI AFN - Build Thread
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0
IG: syncro_brothers |
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MarkWard
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Joined: February 09, 2005
Posts: 18813
Location: Retired South Florida
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| Posted: Fri Jun 23, 2023 9:35 am Post subject: Re: Syncro rear diff mounting holes in body - help |
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Drill a 3/8 hole in the frame where it would intersect your plate. Bolt your plate and rosette weld the hole you drilled. This will keep the bracket in place if for some reason the trans needs to come out.
Two thoughts. There is an oval cutout on the r/s of the frame that I was able to fish that bracket through into place. I used one of my bolt hole to pull it over into position.
Other thought was the stock member backside was not flush. It kept my bracket from sitting flat. I was able to notch my plate to get it to sit flat. But required fishing it back out and in. Stainless safety wire works well. |
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ALIKA T3
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TinyPickle
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Joined: December 15, 2021
Posts: 190
Location: Slovenia, Europe
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| Posted: Fri Jun 23, 2023 11:43 am Post subject: Re: Syncro rear diff mounting holes in body - help |
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Thanks guys for the idea, i would just throw the piece into the beam and than curse the hell out of it when i couldn't find it. Will post how it goes!
Regarding welding, it can't be welded, steel to stainless steel.. i could glue it potentially, but i'll probably just leave it to future me
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WIP - Offroad Spec Syncro - 1.9 TDI AFN - Build Thread
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