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Window regulator cleaning and lubrication (Manual)
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djkeev
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 29, 2016 11:06 am    Post subject: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication (Manual) Reply with quote

I have my door apart, I've installed new window channel seals and tightened the Wing Window.

I was ready to button it up and thought
"Oh Crap!!...... That's just short sighted, I've got half the job done, it's been 30 years I'm sure since it's last lubrication...... Pull it out!"

So I did.....



Door with plastic removed.....

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Removing the foam wind seal around the door latch release and the window crank gear.......

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Remove the two 10mm hex bolts holding the window lift assembly to the window bottom channel, there is a hole in the door to let you do this easily (not like the wing window phillips screw!!!!! ) I marked where the bolts were before removing them......

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Be sure you prevent the window from falling and hurting you!!! I used a wood workers clamp, you can use wood wedges and even Duct tape will work!

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I swiched part way through for the leg of the wood workers clamp sticks a foot into the interior of the door, almost ripped my scalp open!
I Switched to non invasive spring type clamps!....

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Remove the door latch release (2 10mm hex bolts) and let hang....

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Remove the window crank gear box (2 10mm hex bolts)

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Unbend the mount tab for the plastic regulators guide tube tab in the speaker hole....

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Remove the upper vertical guide channel bolt (10mm hex) and ...... look under the door...... The lower vertical guide channel bolt (10mm hex).


Embarassed No photo...... Embarassed Embarassed


One last thing, the speaker wire is Zip Tied to the regulator next to the crank gear box! The lift assembly will NOT come out until you cut that Zip Tie!!!
(Ask me how I know....... )

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WITHOUT BENDING ANYTHING!!!!! (For you heavy handed brutes) wiggle the assembly

Get it so the top of the vertical guide rail can be removed........

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That is followed by more wiggling and maneuvering until the lower part of the guide and the tube are able to be withdrawn.



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The hard part is over........Now just gently guide out the gear box and plastic tube.


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It is a greasy mess!!!

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The empty door......

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The lift bar removes from the assembly by gently dropping it down and rotating it 90*
DO NOT BREAK THE SQUARE PLASTIC GUIDE!!!!!!

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I cleaned everything well in my solvent tank (Younhave one right? Not needed, you can clean using a degreaser, it's just slower and messier)

I let it soak to remove the hardened grease.
I brushed it all well and removed the assembly from the tank and dried it off
I sprayed carb cleaner in the gear box and blew it out with compressed air, huge "snots" of grease were ejected.

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I slipped on the window crank and fully cranked it both ways cleaning the spring wound cable fully. I used more Carburetor Spray to dissolve stubborn hard grease build up.....

Now it sits drying as I figure out the proper lubricant to use........


Dave
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Last edited by djkeev on Wed Mar 02, 2016 5:07 am; edited 8 times in total
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GreenMachineVW
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 29, 2016 11:09 am    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication Reply with quote

Now that it's out would be a good time to pull out the wing window frame and tighten that pivot bolt ...
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 29, 2016 12:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication Reply with quote

clear grease won't show (Wurth HHS); white grease won't show much - EP greases will work but are overkill and will stain if they escape their lodgings

it looks like we will be treated to some pics, so this is a good time to ask what camera you use?
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Terry Kay
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 29, 2016 1:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication Reply with quote

Can we get it in Panavision, and in Technicolor too?
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djkeev
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 29, 2016 2:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication Reply with quote

Terry Kay wrote:
Can we get it in Panavision, and in Technicolor too?


Color for sure........ Technicolor.... You're showing your age! (Though Technicolor is now into digital films)

Mostly an iPad Air...... This door? an old iPhone 5 ...... I do try to "dumb down" the pixels so they download decently.


So very many photos to post! 44 to be exact...... But I may edit that down... Smile

Heavy Sigh.......

GreenMachineVW wrote:
Now that it's out would be a good time to pull out the wing window frame and tighten that pivot bolt ...


No, I already tightened it up, more of a frustration that a problem. If I ever pull the vent wondow for a new rubber, I'll take care of that screwy screw!

Dave
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Last edited by djkeev on Tue Mar 01, 2016 5:56 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Chuey
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 29, 2016 11:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication Reply with quote

Before I (recently) put my door panels on, I added some tri-flow to all points it seemed possible or logical to add it to. Recently, the passenger door started making a pretty loud clicking (ratcheting) type sound at the top of the travel. That is, when the window is being raised or lowered, near the top.

If anyone knows what makes that sound, please let me know.

Dave, if by "square thing" you mean the little white nylon guide looking dealie, my Doka's were broken. Is that a part that is available?

I hope it's OK to tag on to your thread here.

Chuey
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 01, 2016 12:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication Reply with quote

Looking forward to the photos. I'm considering converting my windows to power and want to make sure that they're freshly lubed up and in good working order before doing so. This is a great tutorial for me to get myself in trouble with. Thanks!
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djkeev
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 01, 2016 1:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication Reply with quote

You can see the squareish plastic in this photo.

It does break...... To replace it requires pinching the tabs together that retain it on the shaft.

If a new one is not available you will need to source a used one or make one.

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The grinding noise is the assembly telling you that it is tired and needs renewal.
The system operates by a spring wound cable being fed into a gear box that engages the coils of the Spring.
The coils wear, especially if not lubricated, if the window moves hard or it has been forced past it's stopping points.... Up or Down.

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Dave

BTW photos will be forth coming..... Smile
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Last edited by djkeev on Tue Mar 01, 2016 6:02 pm; edited 2 times in total
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 01, 2016 5:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication Reply with quote

One of the biggest surprises was the amount of crap in the bottom of my doors!

The glass must have been broken at some point in time gone by for there were shards of it everywhere! It had gotten embedded into the drain crevise at the bottom of the door and then acted as an attractant for soil build up!

It is really quite amazing that the door didn't simply rust away with the build up holding moisture.

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To remove it I used a dental tyoe pick. Scratching out the soil and glass bits. I used my vacuum to suck up what I could and my compressed air to push it all down to the lower recesses of the door.

It was quite a process and it took me HOURS to ckean this door!
Imused a flashlight and my phone to view the interior locating any glass jams or rusty bits that needed attention.
I Worked and worked and worked at getting the glass out. Any left behind would be a water dam preventing complete drainage.

A few in the door photos......

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The lower drain hole with no,light inside the door..... Just a little slot in the door, it is at the rear of the footwell .....

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The outside view of the door drain.... I got a LOT of glass and dirt out of this hole......

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I wish I had looked in the deepest part before vacuuming out the debris!
It sound like I was vacuuming a gravel driveway!

I do believe the drain hole was plugged which would explain my door card damage.

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Eventually the glass was gone and using a small wire brush I cleaned it up inside......

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After cleaning it the best I could, my only rust was minimal in the very lower part of the door BIG SURPRISE!!!!
I, while not a big POR 15 fan, used the product here.
I poured some in a paper cup and ever so carefully and neatly poured it into the door.
I took a long handled artist brush and worked it into where it needed to go.
Not fun, not horrible either.
A fair amount poured out the drain hole coating that area well....

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Dave
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Last edited by djkeev on Tue Mar 01, 2016 6:06 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Merian
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 01, 2016 6:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication Reply with quote

thread title change "Inside the doors"

you can add a pad of DynaXorb (or DynaZorb?) right behind each speaker to help with sound

add some dampening material to the door skin (cover about 1/4 of each panel)

Rustoleum primer and then any color top coat will take care of those scratches from your dental pic

seal the door opening with a product made for sound quality

good time to mark where the glove box opens and then add that helpful map pocket

good time to add remote locking !!
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 01, 2016 6:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication Reply with quote

Merian wrote:
thread title change "Inside the doors"

you can add a pad of DynaXorb (or DynaZorb?) right behind each speaker to help with sound

add some dampening material to the door skin (cover about 1/4 of each panel)

Rustoleum primer and then any color top coat will take care of those scratches from your dental pic

seal the door opening with a product made for sound quality

good time to mark where the glove box opens and then add that helpful map pocket

good time to add remote locking !!


Thanks for the suggestions but OH! ...... So very many suggestions that I have no interest in pursuing..... Shocked

I am Partly Deaf and sound quality is lost on me. I did pick uo some foam liners for the speakers, I was thinking more moisture related than sound related.

The other suggestions while good, are beyond my interest or effort level.

The POR 15 covered the scratches.... Funny I usually use the Rusty Metal Primer...... Go figure!

I will Fluid Film the doors before I button them up. Not a big fan of stuff like that but in the door it makes sense.

I can reapply via the drain hole and the cabin ventilation vents for the lower foot well portion.

I think that I'll drill a tiny hole for a spray tube extension below the door lock just above the drain channel, but inside the weatherstrip. This way I can insert the nozzle into the small hole and flood the water channel all the way down to the drain hole once a year or so.

Dave
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Last edited by djkeev on Wed Mar 02, 2016 4:55 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 01, 2016 6:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication Reply with quote

After cleaning the lift assembly and drying it off, blowing it clean it was time to reassemble and lubricate.

But..... What lube to use?
I searched, I read, and I read and I read.

In several threads people would ask..... "What grease do I use?" But no one ever answered them!

I looked in the Bentley...... No mention of lubricants......

So I started a new thread to seek the elusive answer! ...

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=649254

While Waiting for lubrication revelations I figured that the gear box should be well lubricated. I propped it up and dribbled oil down the cable into the gear box. I would crank it back and forth on occasion to work the oil in. I know that while grease will be added, the oil will seep into every nook and cranny.

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Eventually I let it sit and the oil oozed out of the plastic cable guide tube.....

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Here is the window lift arm with the plastic guides clean from the solvent tank...

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Eventually I decided to use a good grease....... I had this red grease already so.... Why not? .....

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I worked it into the cable, the cable guide has a slot along it's length so I just packed it in.

I cranked it back and forth it's full length a few times assuring that grease got everywhere.....

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I reassembled the lift arm onto the lifter assembly and lubricated it well....

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 01, 2016 6:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication Reply with quote

To reinstall the assembly feed the plastic tube and the gear box into the window cavity.....

Slip the bottom of the vertical rail in as well.....

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Tip the vertical rail back gently..... DO NOT BEND THE TUBE!!! Wiggle it, finesse it, but do NOT force it!

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Slide the assembly towards the front, get the gear box loosely bolted then posistion the vertical rail and get it loosely bolted top and bottom.....

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Hook up the lift rail to the window with the two bolts....
Make sure everything is as it should be. The plastic tube fastens in the speaker hole like this.....

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Remove the window retaining devices. Snug up the bolts on the gear box and vertical rail. Run the window up and diwn a few times adjusting the lift rail front to rear as needed until the window works smoothly.
Tighten up all the hardware! Done!
Reassemble the door.

Here is an exploded door diagram if you should need it....

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Dave
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 02, 2016 2:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication (Manual) Reply with quote

I was in the garage cleaning up from last night.

I was astounded by the amount of glass that fell out of the lower drain hole!

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Dave
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 8:03 am    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication (Manual) Reply with quote

Thanks for posting this. My driver side regulator is broken. The window hasn't been going up straight, so I would need to kinda help the forward corner up while cranking. Anyway, the little piece that rides in the track is out.

I'm going to try to reattach it. I guess I could look for a junkyard in here in Orange County, CA (visiting my dad). I may be driving to Seattle in a couple of weeks.

So it looks like you have the glass all the way up to replace the regulator, right?
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 8:39 am    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication (Manual) Reply with quote

tjet wrote:
Thanks for posting this. My driver side regulator is broken. The window hasn't been going up straight, so I would need to kinda help the forward corner up while cranking. Anyway, the little piece that rides in the track is out.

I'm going to try to reattach it. I guess I could look for a junkyard in here in Orange County, CA (visiting my dad). I may be driving to Seattle in a couple of weeks.

So it looks like you have the glass all the way up to replace the regulator, right?


Darn near fully closed.

Hold it up with a padded clamp through the open vent window and /or duct tape in many places over the door top (protect your rubber door seal with paper so the tape doesn't damage it on removal)

Dave
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 10:40 am    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication (Manual) Reply with quote

I have used this on the interior cavities. I also use the Wurth undercoating wax for the underside and seam seal. So far all of these products have performed well. I Wurth Wax on the transaxle and front diff also.

I found out about these products from owners on the east coast. Wink

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 2:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication (Manual) Reply with quote

Our passenger window is difficult to roll down and especially up, and I've had the door apart twice; once for an attempted repair to the regulator and again for soundproofing, and I worked on the regulator again that time. Looks like I need to do it the way you did and I'm not looking forward to it, but it took me a few tries to fix the odometer, too.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 3:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication (Manual) Reply with quote

campism wrote:
Our passenger window is difficult to roll down and especially up, and I've had the door apart twice; once for an attempted repair to the regulator and again for soundproofing, and I worked on the regulator again that time. Looks like I need to do it the way you did and I'm not looking forward to it, but it took me a few tries to fix the odometer, too.


Yeah, the amount of old dried and hard grease packed into that coil guide channel and gear box is stunning!

That old stuff needs to go away so fresh grease can actually lubricate the system.

Dave
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 8:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Window regulator cleaning and lubrication (Manual) Reply with quote

Wow. I thought I was doing good by lubing the track and serial wire! It did however only take about 1 minutes with of work. Get what your pay for I guess.

It did however allow a much lighter up/down of the windows.
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