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donovjim
Samba Member
Joined: June 27, 2014
Posts: 102
Location: NovaScotia
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 Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 2:28 pm Post subject: '70 T3 square - is there any way to over ride neutral to start? |
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| 1970 t3 square automatic. Frequently a challenge to start...gotta wiggle the shift lever so I took it apart and now I see how it functions. Had to clean all the chap off the contacts and refurbished the spring but go figure it's still not a guaranteed start in neutral. (a) are these parts replaceable and what are they called (b) can't I just tie in something; are there any recommended modifications? |
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Donnie strickland
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Joined: December 21, 2009
Posts: 2403
Location: Moody, AL
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| Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 2:38 pm Post subject: Re: '70 T3 square - is there any way to over ride neutral to start? |
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As you have seen, the system is pretty basic; there's not much to go wrong. I wonder if your ignition switch "start" contacts could be going bad, making it appear to be the shift lever? This is fairly common.
In the meantime, you could pull both red/black wires loose, and connect them together. This would allow you to start the car in any gear...
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71 Elm Green FI A/T Squareback |
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donovjim
Samba Member
Joined: June 27, 2014
Posts: 102
Location: NovaScotia
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| Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 5:48 pm Post subject: Re: '70 T3 square - is there any way to over ride neutral to start? |
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All 4. Just plug them together?? I wondered if 2 or four were necessary as I assumed in some way 2 made the reverse lites trigger). and also if there was a chance of creating a draw that would kill my battery.
Looking at it I figured plugging the two red together would do the trick and leave the two black for the traverse position and the lights (?????) |
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Bobnotch
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Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 23403
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 8:18 pm Post subject: Re: '70 T3 square - is there any way to over ride neutral to start? |
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| donovjim wrote: |
Looking at it I figured plugging the two red together would do the trick and leave the two black for the traverse position and the lights (?????) |
Yup, just the 2 reds. The 2 blacks are for the back up lights, and will be on all the time the key is on if they're connected (jumped).
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Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
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KTPhil 
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 35947
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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| Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 8:26 pm Post subject: Re: '70 T3 square - is there any way to over ride neutral to start? |
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| They can wear out. I remember getting many years of service after cleaning, deburring, and lubing mine. There may be some adjustment range, or maybe I had to shim it, I forget. but it took care of it until I no longer had the car. |
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donovjim
Samba Member
Joined: June 27, 2014
Posts: 102
Location: NovaScotia
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| Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 8:42 am Post subject: Re: '70 T3 square - is there any way to over ride neutral to start? |
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ok... thanks.
I connected by adding wires to each terminal and adding a toggle switch (mounted to underside front of driver seat).
I cleaned and lubed and added a new spring. Seems to be a bit better but cant trust it... I now have a backup if it doesn't flash up quickly.
my main concern was for leaving this arrangement and having it at the "on" position... don't wanna blow this rig up with an armature fix. Sounds however like there is no shout out against this approach.
thanks again... great to have the back up out there (again). J |
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sjbartnik
Samba Member
Joined: September 01, 2011
Posts: 6041
Location: Brooklyn
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| Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 8:51 am Post subject: Re: '70 T3 square - is there any way to over ride neutral to start? |
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| donovjim wrote: |
my main concern was for leaving this arrangement and having it at the "on" position... don't wanna blow this rig up with an armature fix. |
Wouldn't hurt anything. The only thing to be aware of from a safety standpoint if you were to connect the two wires permanently is that the starter could operate no matter what gear the car was in. That could lead to unanticipated movement of the car if you accidentally started it in reverse or one of the forward gears.
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1965 Volkswagen 1500 Variant S
2000 Kawasaki W650 |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 23403
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 12:02 pm Post subject: Re: '70 T3 square - is there any way to over ride neutral to start? |
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| sjbartnik wrote: |
| donovjim wrote: |
my main concern was for leaving this arrangement and having it at the "on" position... don't wanna blow this rig up with an armature fix. |
Wouldn't hurt anything. The only thing to be aware of from a safety standpoint if you were to connect the two wires permanently is that the starter could operate no matter what gear the car was in. That could lead to unanticipated movement of the car if you accidentally started it in reverse or one of the forward gears. |
Yup this.^^ But a side benefit is that the car WILL start in park now. 
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 23165
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 12:17 pm Post subject: Re: '70 T3 square - is there any way to over ride neutral to start? |
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| Yes.....that is one or the positives of the shifter switch that is used in the type 4 cars....which is for the most part nearly identical to type 3 and may in fact fit......is that it was set up to start in park from the factory. Ray |
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Donnie strickland
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Joined: December 21, 2009
Posts: 2403
Location: Moody, AL
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| Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 1:08 pm Post subject: Re: '70 T3 square - is there any way to over ride neutral to start? |
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| raygreenwood wrote: |
| Yes.....that is one or the positives of the shifter switch that is used in the type 4 cars....which is for the most part nearly identical to type 3 and may in fact fit......is that it was set up to start in park from the factory. Ray |
Type 3 switches allowed startup in Park beginning with the 1972 models. I suspect it's the same as the Type 4 switch.
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71 Elm Green FI A/T Squareback |
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raygreenwood
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Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 23165
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 1:33 pm Post subject: Re: '70 T3 square - is there any way to over ride neutral to start? |
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| Donnie strickland wrote: |
| raygreenwood wrote: |
| Yes.....that is one or the positives of the shifter switch that is used in the type 4 cars....which is for the most part nearly identical to type 3 and may in fact fit......is that it was set up to start in park from the factory. Ray |
Type 3 switches allowed startup in Park beginning with the 1972 models. I suspect it's the same as the Type 4 switch. |
Yes...its a type 3 part # 311 927 147 and 311 927 147 A depending on year. Ray |
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