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alaskadan
Samba Member
Joined: January 09, 2013
Posts: 1971
Location: anchor pt. alaska
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 Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:03 pm Post subject: 83 diesel camper with bad engine - what would you do? |
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| Pretty much says it all. There's an 83 diesel camper nearby for sale with a "bad piston". I gather that an original diesel is a slug. The bell housing and fuel tank are specific. Is the bell housing needed for any specific conversion? Asking 4k I'd try and kick em to 3500. Like I need another van, but visiting friends or family would dig it. Thoughts? |
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valvecovergasket
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Joined: October 10, 2018
Posts: 1514
Location: pnw
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| Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:07 pm Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper bad engine what would you do |
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theres quite a few worthwhile parts on that for a potential swap.
the fuel tank isnt unique to the diesels.
that seems like crazy money for a non running van though. unless its really really clean otherwise... |
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Vanagon Nut
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Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10524
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2020 11:13 pm Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper bad engine what would you do |
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Is there any chance this '83 has a 5 speed?
Neil.
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1981 Westy DIY 15ยบ ABA
(VW Gas I4)
1988 Westy DIY 50ยบ ABA
VE7TBN |
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Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 52763
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| Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2020 11:47 pm Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper with bad engine - what would you do? |
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| Most 37 year old non runners were long ago winched up onto a trailer and hauled off and crushed. Yes it would have to be dang nice to merit that kind of price. |
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Abscate
Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014
Posts: 24498
Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 3:30 am Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper bad engine what would you do |
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| Vanagon Nut wrote: |
Is there any chance this '83 has a 5 speed?
Neil. |
I never realized it but my 1983 diesel had a 4 speed with granny gear.
The first was so low it was unusable on flat ground
On edit - fake news, it didnโt have a granny gear per experts below
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Last edited by Abscate on Sun Feb 07, 2021 8:35 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Gnarlodious 
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Joined: September 28, 2013
Posts: 2413
Location: Adobe Jungle USA
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 7:53 am Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper with bad engine - what would you do? |
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Either they donโt really want to sell it or they are fantasizing at the high value of Vanagons recently. It might be worth $3,500 if it is nice condition.
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Vanagon โ83 diesel AAZ w/Giles injection, 5spd 4.57R&P+TBD and a '78 diesel Rabbit |
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4Gears4Tires
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Joined: October 08, 2018
Posts: 4441
Location: MD
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 7:57 am Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper with bad engine - what would you do? |
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I'm getting to the point where I would feel bad if anyone paid me for my van. "Oh no, what are you doing to yourself? Do you even realize?" 
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'87 Syncro Ferric Oxyhydroxide Superleggera Edition
'85 Westy Sciuridae Domus Edition |
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Escorial Syncro
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Joined: May 02, 2004
Posts: 449
Location: Manitou Springs, CO
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 8:22 am Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper with bad engine - what would you do? |
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I won't comment on the value, Dan knows what he's looking at and while I'm sure there's cheaper diesel westies with bad motors sitting around, there's probably not many sitting around in Homer Alaska!
I think that van (if clean, rust-wise) would be great if you ever wanted to put an early TDI (AHU or 1Z) in as the oil pan and most of the mounting hardware bolt up. A mechanical pump could make it easy if you don't like electronics. Or an AAZ with mechanical pump.
It would be great if it's a 5 speed as those had somewhat nicer mounting engine hardware in my opinion.
Sounds fun!
Joel
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Joel Lane
1985 Vanagon converted to syncro, ALH TDI w/GTB2056 turbo, Reimo clone top with Westy interior
2002 Toyota Tundra 4x4 |
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?Waldo?
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Joined: February 22, 2006
Posts: 10156
Location: Where?
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 8:27 am Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper bad engine what would you do |
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| Abscate wrote: |
I never realized it but my 1983 diesel had a 4 speed with granny gear.
The first was so low it was unusable on flat ground |
The '83 diesel 5-speed is not a 4-speed with a low 'granny gear'. With a significantly more powerful engine than the stock 1.6 it is possible to start in second but even still requires riding the clutch. Starting an '83 5-speed 1.6 non-turbo in second gear was not intended by the factory and is a markedly unwise thing to do.
The stock '83 diesel DX 1st gear ratio is 4.11 and second is 2.33. The stock 4-speed 1st gear ratio is 3.78. Yes, the 5-speed first gear is lower than the 4-speed ratio as all of the ratios are closer together, but it is not a granny gear. For perspective, the syncro granny gear ratio is 6.03 and 1st is 3.78.
All of the 5-speeds in other markets had the same 4.11 1st gear but with taller R+P ratios. All five gears are useful and necessary for all normal driving. |
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alaskadan
Samba Member
Joined: January 09, 2013
Posts: 1971
Location: anchor pt. alaska
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 8:36 am Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper with bad engine - what would you do? |
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| Hmm, kinda surprised here. Seems a full camper in ok condition that runs would be worth 10k. I guessed that I couldn't get hurt too bad after fixing it or doing a suby conversion on it. It looks to be a riviera. It just peaked my interest because it is a diesel and wasn't sure if thats what you want for a TDI conversion. Not sure about the 5 speed. There are fewer cheap full campers to pick from up here. |
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?Waldo?
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Joined: February 22, 2006
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 8:36 am Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper with bad engine - what would you do? |
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| Escorial Syncro wrote: |
| A mechanical pump could make it easy if you don't like electronics. |
...Or even if you DO like electronics, but prefer added reliability over added unnecessary complication that doesn't give any real benefit. A proper mechanical pump will also give easier tuning without sacrificing any performance. |
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dobryan
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Location: Brookeville, MD
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?Waldo?
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Joined: February 22, 2006
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 9:01 am Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper with bad engine - what would you do? |
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If the same deal popped up near me and the body was in decent shape and the trans was the 5-speed, I would buy it. The engine is easy to upgrade to Mk3 mTDI and the 5-speed is great.
I recently installed an AHU mTDI into an '83 with the DX 5-speed and had the R+P swapped from the stock 5.43 to the 4.14. IMO it is a really nice end result. Comfortable cruising above 70 with fuel economy above 30 MPG.
With stock tires the rpm @ speed in top gear is as follows:
2500 @ 58
3000 @ 70
3500 @ 81
4th gear downshifts for steep highway grades give the following:
3500 @ 61
4000 @ 70 |
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MarkWard
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Joined: February 09, 2005
Posts: 19160
Location: Retired South Florida
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 10:14 am Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper with bad engine - what would you do? |
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| The days of the $800 campers are behind us. I'd say if you want it, buy it. Any 30 plus year old vehicle is going to need eventually everything. If it were near me, I'd also buy it. Our 82 diesel camper mated to a 1.9 TDI drives like a modern vehicle. Plenty of power. |
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Jake de Villiers
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Joined: October 24, 2007
Posts: 5938
Location: Tsawwassen, BC
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 10:32 am Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper with bad engine - what would you do? |
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| dobryan wrote: |
Buy it! But perhaps I am not the best person to give advice about buying another westy....  |
Yup, your credibility as an interventionist is shot!! 
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'86 Westy Weekender Poptop/2.5 Subaru/5 Speed Posi/Audi Front Brakes/16 x 7.5 Mercedes Wheels - answers to 'Dixie'
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http://sites.google.com/site/subyjake/mydixiedarlin%27
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Vanagon Nut
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Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10524
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 11:27 am Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper with bad engine - what would you do? |
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| ?Waldo? wrote: |
If the same deal popped up near me and the body was in decent shape and the trans was the 5-speed, I would buy it. The engine is easy to upgrade to Mk3 mTDI and the 5-speed is great.
With stock tires the rpm @ speed in top gear is as follows:
2500 @ 58
3000 @ 70
3500 @ 81
4th gear downshifts for steep highway grades give the following:
3500 @ 61
4000 @ 70 |
This is what I was thinking except maybe with a gas inline engine.  Just kidding. My first thought was an AAZ.
I know the engine is "bad" but if it is non op and tranny can't be tested, [edit] the van becomes somewhat less desirable, IMO. All depends on price of course.
Neil.
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1981 Westy DIY 15ยบ ABA
(VW Gas I4)
1988 Westy DIY 50ยบ ABA
VE7TBN |
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?Waldo?
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2006
Posts: 10156
Location: Where?
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 11:45 am Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper with bad engine - what would you do? |
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| Vanagon Nut wrote: |
This is what I was thinking except maybe with a gas inline engine. Just kidding. My first thought was an AAZ.
I know the engine is "bad" but if it is non op and tranny can't be tested, [edit] the van becomes somewhat less desirable, IMO. All depends on price of course.
Neil. |
There's always a chance that a non-running engine is coupled to a ruined and non-rebuildable trans, but not all that likely. The swap to a tall R+P requires all the work of a trans rebuild anyway and if the current R+P is bad it is a non-issue if it is being replaced. Odds are good that if the engine has failed, the trans is at least rebuildable with a new R+P. |
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Abscate
Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014
Posts: 24498
Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 2:04 pm Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper bad engine what would you do |
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| ?Waldo? wrote: |
| Abscate wrote: |
I never realized it but my 1983 diesel had a 4 speed with granny gear.
The first was so low it was unusable on flat ground |
The '83 diesel 5-speed is not a 4-speed with a low 'granny gear'. With a significantly more powerful engine than the stock 1.6 it is possible to start in second but even still requires riding the clutch. Starting an '83 5-speed 1.6 non-turbo in second gear was not intended by the factory and is a markedly unwise thing to do.
The stock '83 diesel DX 1st gear ratio is 4.11 and second is 2.33. The stock 4-speed 1st gear ratio is 3.78. Yes, the 5-speed first gear is lower than the 4-speed ratio as all of the ratios are closer together, but it is not a granny gear. For perspective, the syncro granny gear ratio is 6.03 and 1st is 3.78.
All of the 5-speeds in other markets had the same 4.11 1st gear but with taller R+P ratios. All five gears are useful and necessary for all normal driving. |
Thanks fir setting me straight Waldo. It's been a few years since I sold this one but you did not need to slip 2nd to start.
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Vanagon Nut
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Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10524
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2020 3:21 pm Post subject: Re: 83 diesel camper with bad engine - what would you do? |
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| ?Waldo? wrote: |
| Vanagon Nut wrote: |
| I know the engine is "bad" but if it is non op and tranny can't be tested, .... |
There's always a chance that a non-running engine is coupled to a ruined and non-rebuildable trans, but not all that likely. The swap to a tall R+P requires all the work of a trans rebuild anyway and if the current R+P is bad it is a non-issue if it is being replaced. Odds are good that if the engine has failed, the trans is at least rebuildable with a new R+P. |
Ah, good points and pov. Well, hopefully it has a 5 speed and alaskadan will buy it and post pics!
Neil.
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1981 Westy DIY 15ยบ ABA
(VW Gas I4)
1988 Westy DIY 50ยบ ABA
VE7TBN |
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vanagonjr
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