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Lingwendil
Samba Member
Joined: February 25, 2009
Posts: 3988
Location: Antioch, California, a block from the hood
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 Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 8:01 am Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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| Bug53 wrote: |
| Lingwendil wrote: |
| I ended up needing to turn them in so far that I needed spacers to get adequate squirt from them. I used the tips that screw onto the plug wire end of some spark plugs. Before that I wasn't able to tighten the adjustment nuts in enough. |
Wow!
Were these the Brazilian shit I have or an OG set? |
Brasilian is OG, if I'm not mistaken 
That's where they all came from originally. Anything else is basically an Empi knockoff. My set are fairly old, but have had a couple items replaced, If I'mnot mistaken the rebuild kits in them don't behave the same as far as the diphragms in the accelerator pumps, so sometimes you need to shim the adjustment nut for more stroke.
Got the tip from the Kadron manual by Frank Camper-
I'm sending you a PM too,if you don't mind 
_________________
73 super beetle thread http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=649622 Back on the Road!
Modify your Kadrons for SVDA http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=8115884#8115884
Cast iron VJU4BR8 SVDA reference thread- https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0
Need replacement filters for original Kadron aircleaners? WIX #42087 is a perfect fit, as is Napa Gold #2087! |
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Bug53
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2021
Posts: 704
Location: Pawcatuck, CT.
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| Posted: Thu Oct 21, 2021 4:31 am Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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| As far as Jetting I am basically at sea level. S0 my 130/60 setup as delivered from KS should do the trick? I think 55 would be better but that what KS seems to believe will work. |
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Bug53
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2021
Posts: 704
Location: Pawcatuck, CT.
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 8:59 pm Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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| Lingwendil wrote: |
| I ended up needing to turn them in so far that I needed spacers to get adequate squirt from them. I used the tips that screw onto the plug wire end of some spark plugs. Before that I wasn't able to tighten the adjustment nuts in enough. |
Wow!
Were these the Brazilian shit I have or an OG set? |
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Lingwendil
Samba Member
Joined: February 25, 2009
Posts: 3988
Location: Antioch, California, a block from the hood
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Bug53
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2021
Posts: 704
Location: Pawcatuck, CT.
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 5:53 pm Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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Absolutely correct. It did nothing measurable for the condition.
Cranking up the accelerator pumps did a measurable improvement prior to this which makes no sense. The the results were good.
How far in are some of the other Kadron acc. Pump adjusters on other cars?
Kaddie Shack gave me the carbs back with the plastic nuts barely touching.
I slowly turned mine in one turn at a time. Now they have a little more than 1/8” of thread showing.
I know I need to measure the actual output but one turn at a time “seat of the pants” tuning is to satisfy curiosities. |
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Alstrup
Samba Member
Joined: July 12, 2007
Posts: 7229
Location: Videbaek Denmark
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 11:35 am Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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| Bug53 wrote: |
| modok wrote: |
| 130 is normal IMO |
That's my opinion too but i went down to 127 and the cruise / light throttle popping was worse.
I think 132 is too rich but I may try |
That´s a clear indication that something else is off or wrong. You DO NOT cruise on the main circuit unless your cruise speed is above 50-60 mph dependant on the entire set up.
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https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=435993 |
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Bug53
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2021
Posts: 704
Location: Pawcatuck, CT.
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 10:30 am Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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| modok wrote: |
| 130 is normal IMO |
That's my opinion too but i went down to 127 and the cruise / light throttle popping was worse.
I think 132 is too rich but I may try |
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modok
Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2009
Posts: 26790
Location: Colorado Springs
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 1:34 am Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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| 130 is normal IMO |
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Bug53
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2021
Posts: 704
Location: Pawcatuck, CT.
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| Posted: Wed Oct 20, 2021 1:08 am Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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| is a 132 main jet in Kadrons for my 1600 unthinkable ? |
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oprn
Samba Member
Joined: November 13, 2016
Posts: 12756
Location: Western Canada
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| Posted: Thu Sep 30, 2021 4:44 am Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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| unclebilly wrote: |
I have Kadrons on my Baja.
Make sure you loctite your air cleaner wing nuts on, one of my air cleaner lids came off and my engine injested dirt.
The kadron being right beside my tire didn’t help anything. |
Common problem. My Buggy came to me in that condition, the right air cleaner was rattling around loose. The right side of the engine was burning oil badly otherwise I would still be running that 1600 DP.
Every Kadron buyer should be told up front this is a problem.
_________________
We had the stone age, the bronze age, the industrial age and now we are in the age of mass deception and mind control for corporate profit. (The mass media age) |
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modok
Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2009
Posts: 26790
Location: Colorado Springs
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| Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 9:25 pm Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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Could happen to anybody.
I use locknuts
having to safety wire your wingnuts is just ironic, and having to loctite your wingnuts is no fun, so we invent the safety wingnut.
The final evolution..... of the wingnut that looks like you could turn it with your fingers but you actually can't.
lets get a wrench 
And for maximum pleasure.... ratcheting wrench! |
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unclebilly
Samba Member
Joined: January 07, 2019
Posts: 42
Location: AB
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| Posted: Wed Sep 29, 2021 9:11 pm Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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I have Kadrons on my Baja.
Make sure you loctite your air cleaner wing nuts on, one of my air cleaner lids came off and my engine injested dirt.
The kadron being right beside my tire didn’t help anything. |
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Lingwendil
Samba Member
Joined: February 25, 2009
Posts: 3988
Location: Antioch, California, a block from the hood
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Bug53
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2021
Posts: 704
Location: Pawcatuck, CT.
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| Posted: Tue Sep 28, 2021 7:09 pm Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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Update.
Just prior to packing them up for the return trip back to Cali. I measured all the mains. So this is what we have. 61 Idles, 130 mains, H150-2 air correction. |
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modok
Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2009
Posts: 26790
Location: Colorado Springs
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Bug53
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2021
Posts: 704
Location: Pawcatuck, CT.
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| Posted: Mon Sep 27, 2021 8:35 pm Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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| esde wrote: |
| Clatter wrote: |
It's easy enough to check what size they are once you get them in-hand. |
True, but for the money spent the customer shouldn't have to measure them. It just adds another step to trouble shooting. "Well hey, that jet might be too big or too small, or maybe they aren't the same size. But we don't know what's right or wrong because we don't know what they were supposed to be"
I ordered some carbs from Blackline a few years ago. Came back with a build sheet listing every jet, throttle plate settings, and the float height. Aircooled.net drops a note in the box listing the jets when you pay him to set them up for you.
I realize I'm way O/T so I'll retreat to the corner. |
We should start a separate thread on commercial shop carburetor builds and harvest all the data we can. LOL!
Once I get back to my air cooled girl and measure the mains I will report back. |
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esde
Samba Member
Joined: October 20, 2007
Posts: 5969
Location: central rust belt
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| Posted: Mon Sep 27, 2021 7:45 pm Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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| Clatter wrote: |
It's easy enough to check what size they are once you get them in-hand. |
True, but for the money spent the customer shouldn't have to measure them. It just adds another step to trouble shooting. "Well hey, that jet might be too big or too small, or maybe they aren't the same size. But we don't know what's right or wrong because we don't know what they were supposed to be"
I ordered some carbs from Blackline a few years ago. Came back with a build sheet listing every jet, throttle plate settings, and the float height. Aircooled.net drops a note in the box listing the jets when you pay him to set them up for you.
I realize I'm way O/T so I'll retreat to the corner.
_________________
modok wrote:
Bent cranks are silent but gather no moss. I mean, ah, something like that. |
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Bug53
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2021
Posts: 704
Location: Pawcatuck, CT.
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| Posted: Mon Sep 27, 2021 5:46 pm Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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I used to work on old Mercedes Benz carbureted cars like the 250.
It had 2 big Solex 2 barrels on it. There was a huge cup that went over the top of it then the Uni-syn went on top of that.
We would mess with them until they balanced perfectly then very carefully adjust the linkage so the ball / sockets would slide together perfectly. The detention springs on the sockets (just wire) could be slid out so there was no resistance.
Whenever one of these shitboxes would show up all us mechanics would head to break, lunch, or a road test until it got assigned to another poor bastard. Lol.
Im not even thinking about jets at this point. Im giving this one last perfectly orchestrated synch. Then I’m tell KS to sent me a new throttle body to swap out.
They solder up one of the transition holes and re-drill them. There is a good chance something is plugged up in a transition circuit. |
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Lo Cash John
Samba Member
Joined: February 06, 2004
Posts: 2246
Location: Jacksonville, FL
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| Posted: Mon Sep 27, 2021 5:26 pm Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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Nope, no problems with Kads at all (left lane)
Link
Lots of mods to make them work in a blow through turbo motor. No secrets at all. I've posted all details online:
Enlarge manifold to manifold balance hose to 5/8" inside diameter
Enlarged idle-air bypass circuit
Add ported vacuum port to carb on 3-4 side
Bigger venturies
Jetting changes
Emulsion tube mods
2.0mm needle valves (float valves)
As for syncing dual carbs, there is no better tool than a 2-channel or 4-channel vacuum gauge. To use this on Kads you MUST pinch off the balance tube between the carbs. Then you measure the vacuum under each carb. When that value is equal the carbs are perfectly synced.
_________________
www.LoCashRacing.org
More brains than bucks...Believe it or not!!
If you actually drive your VW, you need www.AirMapp.com
My boss told me I need to work on my mutli-tasking. So now when I use the bathroom at work I surf The Samba on my iPhone. |
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nsracing
Samba Member
Joined: November 16, 2003
Posts: 9481
Location: NOVA
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| Posted: Mon Sep 27, 2021 4:49 pm Post subject: Re: Has anyone had trouble setting up Kadrons? |
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WTF secrets left in the VW aircooled? You are right - horseshit! People actually think they got some super-secret combo for a VW aircooled motor. 
Most the people claiming that do not even own a proper lineboring bar.
The snail- synch tool is the best there is. Best ones are from Germany. The Uni-Sync is junk- it chokes the motor too much.
You have to get some kind of adapter to go on the carbs throats. A paper cup works just fine. gEt the tall ones and cut the bottom to fit the snail snout.
Unhook one side of the linkage - I unhook the left. So the carbs are independent. Synch them the best you can..as close as you can w/ the link OFF. When you got them matched in flow - it does not matter where the numbers are on the flow as long as they are the same - when you hook the LEFT linkage...make sure the flows do not change.
Adjust the linkage to shorten or lenghten..depending on what you got on the flows. But the bottomline ---- the flows should NOT change when you hook the linkage back on. ONe side will always be dominant...I choose the Right side to be dominant. And the LEft side..not too far along in flows.
once you got both carbs matched, check the timing at idle... then check the total timing at past 2500 rpm if you are using 009 distributor.
AFter you got all that done, then you can fuck w/ the jetting size. If you have some kind of Lamba system to check A/F ratio be best. Or EGT gauges.
Hope this helps. |
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