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ATP
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2017
Posts: 58
Location: Riverside CA
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 Posted: Wed Jun 28, 2023 11:36 pm Post subject: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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1972. No motor, transmission is present, looks to be nice enough (for the most part) from pictures. Certainly fine looking for the price.
Never owned a Type 3, but got real interested after being offered one in trade last year. Didn't pan out, but been keeping an eye out for an easy project ever since.
Anything Type-3 specific I should be worried about compared to any other older car? Things that would cost a fortune if they're missing? Metal panels that aren't reproduced and I'd hate myself for having bought a vehicle with a busted piece? Any other advice?
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'68 Sportsmobile w/'71 motor |
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Ossipon
Samba Member
Joined: May 12, 2021
Posts: 635
Location: KS
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 7:08 am Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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One word: Rust.
Type 3 can look good, but horrible with rust. The areas you need to look at beyond around the battery pan.
1. Pull back the carpet and if there is any, the sound deadening on the floor by the front inner fender (Basically the whole pan area)
2. The heater channel and rocker panel area.
3. The outside edge of the inner wheel inner fender
4. Fenders around the headlights and back by the door
5. Door skin down at the bottom: If the door sound deadening falls down, it acts as a sponge for the moisture in that area
Is it a manual or automatic? If manual, is the Transaxle supported and tied up in some manner. This is an issue for IRS manuals on Type 3, not older swing axle or Auto transaxles
How much of the interior is there is always a good question too.
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Ossipon
--Two truths in life: Volkswagens Rust and everything will die at some point --
VWs in my life:
Air
Type 1 - 59, 62, 63, 71 Super 68 KGhia/ Type 2 - 59 Single Cab / Type 3 - 64 Notch
Water
GTI 83, Jetta 81, 85, 87, 91 TDI, 98 TDI, 09 / New Beetle 99 / SportWagen 05, 13 / Tiguan 18 / T3 92 /Taos 24... And don't about me and my experiences with my Dasher and Quantum |
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KTPhil 
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 36459
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 8:04 am Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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Check for the status of the FI parts on the body; has it been downgraded to carbs in its history?
And yes, of course, RUST RUST RUST! |
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ALLWAGONS
Samba Member
Joined: June 03, 2000
Posts: 4765
Location: Pasadena CA/DTLA soon China
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 8:30 am Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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Thus one is relatively cheap and complete. Skip incomplete cars
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2615345
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I'd be UNSTOPPABLE if not for Law Enforcement and PHYSICS.
I recycle old cars and parts, other than when I rot, that's as Green as I am going to get.
Thanks to my Tesla driving neighbors, I feel more relaxed driving my SUBURBAN and old VW's.
Everything sounds good on paper! |
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KTPhil
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 36459
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 8:34 am Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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Agreed... looks like a great basis for a daily driver, or even for later restoration. |
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squaretobehip
Samba Member
Joined: August 23, 2004
Posts: 4091
Location: San Jose, CA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 8:51 am Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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| KTPhil wrote: |
Agreed... looks like a great basis for a daily driver, or even for later restoration. |
That would be a sick Class 11 style Squareback!
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1963 Notchback - Ruby Red
1963 Squareback - Pearl White
1965 Squareback - Baltic Blue
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ATP
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2017
Posts: 58
Location: Riverside CA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 9:35 am Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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| Ossipon wrote: |
One word: Rust.
Type 3 can look good, but horrible with rust. The areas you need to look at beyond around the battery pan.
1. Pull back the carpet and if there is any, the sound deadening on the floor by the front inner fender (Basically the whole pan area)
2. The heater channel and rocker panel area.
3. The outside edge of the inner wheel inner fender
4. Fenders around the headlights and back by the door
5. Door skin down at the bottom: If the door sound deadening falls down, it acts as a sponge for the moisture in that area
Is it a manual or automatic? If manual, is the Transaxle supported and tied up in some manner. This is an issue for IRS manuals on Type 3, not older swing axle or Auto transaxles
How much of the interior is there is always a good question too. |
How much of those are or are not reproduced as far as metal is concerned?
Like which of those pieces that tend to collect rust are basically irreplaceable in 2023? Given the price, if I have to do a little metal work I'm alright, but I don't want to be hunting down scrapped Type 3's and cutting pieces out etc.
One of the taillight areas is a bit beat up from what I can tell.
I don't know about manual or automatic. I suppose I'll find out while I'm there.
From the pics the front seats still have decent upholstery, the door panels look nice, headliner as well. No pics of the back interior so I won't know until I show up.
| KTPhil wrote: |
Check for the status of the FI parts on the body; has it been downgraded to carbs in its history?
And yes, of course, RUST RUST RUST! |
I'll see if I can't pull up some diagrams online to see what I should be looking for. I'd much rather have FI than carbs.
It's also over 5x the price and from pics alone at least the interior does not look as nice.
Thank you all so far. I'm not looking to kick tires given the price, but I'm sure not wanting to end up with another project that's going to take 12x longer than expected because I missed some key things on purchase.
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'68 Sportsmobile w/'71 motor
Last edited by ATP on Thu Jun 29, 2023 1:37 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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KTPhil
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 36459
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 9:44 am Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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| ATP, what car/ad are you referring to? It sounds like it's not the one posted. |
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ATP
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2017
Posts: 58
Location: Riverside CA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 9:47 am Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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| KTPhil wrote: |
| ATP, what car/ad are you referring to? It sounds like it's not the one posted. |
The one posted here is a 71, green, and $5500.
The one I'm going to look at is under 1000, blue, and not on thesamba.
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squaretobehip
Samba Member
Joined: August 23, 2004
Posts: 4091
Location: San Jose, CA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 9:50 am Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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| ATP wrote: |
It's also over 5x the price and from pics alone does not look as nice in most regards unfortunately. |
Keep in mind that most of the time, cheap cars end up costing more than just spending the money up front on a better car. These cars will nickel and dime you to death and it's very easy end up underwater with a car that only a few people, relatively speaking, are into. Ask me how I know! 
Good luck with the purchase! Feel free to post up pics and we can help you out from there.
_________________
1963 Notchback - Ruby Red
1963 Squareback - Pearl White
1965 Squareback - Baltic Blue
Follow ISP West on:
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Erik G
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Joined: October 16, 2002
Posts: 13593
Location: Tejas!
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KTPhil
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 36459
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 9:57 am Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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| ATP wrote: |
| KTPhil wrote: |
| ATP, what car/ad are you referring to? It sounds like it's not the one posted. |
The one posted here is a 71, green, and $5500.
The one I'm going to look at is under 1000, blue, and not on thesamba. |
\
Thanks, that's what I thought! Got a link or photos?
I agree... cheap turns out expensive, especially with these cars!
Best advice: "Buy the most complete, rust-free car you can afford."
Second best: "Regardless of appearances, budget $1K for hidden faults you WILL need to address." |
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gt1953
Samba Member
Joined: May 08, 2002
Posts: 13960
Location: White Mountains Arizona
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 12:29 pm Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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Rust is a big no no....find the most rust free car you can and complete car. I found this one in 2018 complete non running and needed to be brought back to life. It cost was $850.00. Now it is a solid daily driver. Do not ask what I have into it now, I will get my $$$ back when I an done enjoying it.
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Numbers Matching VW's are getting harder to find. Source out the most Stock vehicle and keep that way. You will be glad you did.
72 type 1
72 Squareback
({59 Euro bug, 62, 63, 67, 68, 69, 73 type ones 68 & 69 type two, 68 Ghia all sold}) |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 23611
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 12:49 pm Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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| gt1953 wrote: |
Rust is a big no no....find the most rust free car you can and complete car. I found this one in 2018 complete non running and needed to be brought back to life. It cost was $850.00. Now it is a solid daily driver. Do not ask what I have into it now, I will get my $$$ back when I an done enjoying it.
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Yup rust is a big no no. If you're looking for a flipper, buy a Toyota or a Honda. Type 3s are a niche market, and everybody wants a bug or a bus. Or sometimes a Ghia. Even the Vintage VW club of America isn't interested in them, as they push us off to the side since we're the unwanted step child of the air cooled community. Sometimes I think the type 4 (411/412) has a better standing than us.
As for metal, Gerson offers floor pans, and CIP or ISP offer rocker skins. That's it about new metal. That's why it's so expensive to restore a type 3, nobody is offering replacement metal. You can't catalog shop for a type 3 either, as most places will tell you a part will fit, and it won't. Exhaust systems are like this too. Bug/bus parts won't work here, unless you put a type 4 engine in, then there's some tweeking to get it all to work.
I've been dealing with type 3s since the mid 80's, and nothing has changed in all those years except good parts are getting harder to find. Yes the internet has made finding stuff easier, but it hasn't opened up huge stashes of hidden parts. I hope this helps.
I'm not trying to be an a-hole, but rather just telling you like it is.
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Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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ATP
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2017
Posts: 58
Location: Riverside CA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 1:33 pm Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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| squaretobehip wrote: |
Keep in mind that most of the time, cheap cars end up costing more than just spending the money up front on a better car. These cars will nickel and dime you to death and it's very easy end up underwater with a car that only a few people, relatively speaking, are into. Ask me how I know!
Good luck with the purchase! Feel free to post up pics and we can help you out from there. |
Pics now! My bus has turned into one of those stories, so I'm familiar with the concept. I'm nowhere near underwater really, but it's going to cost much more than expected as the seller basically lied, and I'd had it shipped... Think I've got a new plan of attack on that one, so not too worried about it now, but it was a rough start.
I'm sure someone or other's already seen this in person, or at least the ad. So I'm sure there's a reason it hasn't been bought yet. BUT there's no reason not to spend a bit of time checking it out. If nothing else it'll be a nice drive.
Oh and I missed it in the ad: it's an automatic.
| Erik G wrote: |
| how much metal is reproduced? almost none. Don't buy a rusty car, you will be chasing parts cars to cut the metal to use forever. |
Oh good. Leave it to me to pick that sort of vehicle... Got spoiled with the bus I guess.
| KTPhil wrote: |
I agree... cheap turns out expensive, especially with these cars!
Best advice: "Buy the most complete, rust-free car you can afford."
Second best: "Regardless of appearances, budget $1K for hidden faults you WILL need to address." |
I passed and/or barely missed out on 3 different running ones in decent shape in the 15-2500 range earlier this year and have regretted it. 2 had rough interior, one was in need of a transmission rebuild. Not sure I want to throw 5k at a car that seemingly regularly pops up for half that, but this one may be a bust for sure.
| Bobnotch wrote: |
Yup rust is a big no no. If you're looking for a flipper, buy a Toyota or a Honda. Type 3s are a niche market, and everybody wants a bug or a bus. Or sometimes a Ghia. Even the Vintage VW club of America isn't interested in them, as they push us off to the side since we're the unwanted step child of the air cooled community. Sometimes I think the type 4 (411/412) has a better standing than us.
As for metal, Gerson offers floor pans, and CIP or ISP offer rocker skins. That's it about new metal. That's why it's so expensive to restore a type 3, nobody is offering replacement metal. You can't catalog shop for a type 3 either, as most places will tell you a part will fit, and it won't. Exhaust systems are like this too. Bug/bus parts won't work here, unless you put a type 4 engine in, then there's some tweeking to get it all to work.
I've been dealing with type 3s since the mid 80's, and nothing has changed in all those years except good parts are getting harder to find. Yes the internet has made finding stuff easier, but it hasn't opened up huge stashes of hidden parts. I hope this helps.
I'm not trying to be an a-hole, but rather just telling you like it is. |
I'm not really looking for anything to flip. More an older project I can complete inside the year and bounce around in for a while. And I do really like the squareback after seeing that other one in person last year. Funny enough I did peek at a 72 Honda a couple days ago, but it was missing way too much and I'm not sure how I'd find any of it.
I drove a VW cabriolet for ages, so I know all about being the bastard child of a community, lol. No one appreciates the late 80s cabbies except cabby owners.
What a bummer about the parts situation. I'll check it for rust pretty extensively. It's in the desert, so I may do alright in that regard assuming it wasn't a beach car in a prior life. Sitting where it is doesn't exactly inspire confidence, but the desert's real dry.
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 23022
Location: Northwest of Normal
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 1:43 pm Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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Based on the photos I'd give it a pass. I am seeing the front end as crunched also. Looks like the hood is folded.
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Немає виправдання для війни! Я з Україною.
| Bryan67 wrote: |
| Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
Those who can- do.
Those who can't? Subaru. |
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ATP
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2017
Posts: 58
Location: Riverside CA
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 1:44 pm Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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| Tram wrote: |
| Based on the photos I'd give it a pass. I am seeing the front end as crunched also. Looks like the hood is folded. |
I see that now and had not before. What a bummer.
Regardless, all excellent information for the next one to pop up worth going out to see!
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'68 Sportsmobile w/'71 motor |
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 23022
Location: Northwest of Normal
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 1:48 pm Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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| ATP wrote: |
| Tram wrote: |
| Based on the photos I'd give it a pass. I am seeing the front end as crunched also. Looks like the hood is folded. |
I see that now and had not before. What a bummer.
Regardless, all excellent information for the next one to pop up worth going out to see! |
Yes, the right car will come along. Be patient. If one gets away, it's not the right car!
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Немає виправдання для війни! Я з Україною.
| Bryan67 wrote: |
| Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
Those who can- do.
Those who can't? Subaru. |
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heimlich
VWNOS.com
Joined: November 20, 2016
Posts: 7587
Location: Houston, Texas
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2023 6:33 pm Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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Watch the classifieds here on TheSamba. I see them come across pretty regularly for a good price. The two words that come to mind when I see them are BUY and IT.
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LowThrum
Samba Member
Joined: May 16, 2022
Posts: 61
Location: Las Vegas
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| Posted: Fri Jun 30, 2023 10:49 am Post subject: Re: Checking out a Type 3, any advice? |
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| I would also skip on the automatic if I were you. They are getting harder and harder to repair/find parts/find a shop to work on them and converting to manual isn't at all straightforward. |
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