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KOMBI NIKO
Samba Member
Joined: February 03, 2013
Posts: 278
Location: Australia
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esde
Samba Member
Joined: October 20, 2007
Posts: 5969
Location: central rust belt
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 Posted: Thu Feb 01, 2024 3:41 pm Post subject: Re: Any one know the 26 VFIS in and outs? |
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Is the float working? If the float doesn't "float" or the valve doesn't close completely, the bowl will overflow into the carburetor throat, and cause it to idle high and run rich
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KOMBI NIKO
Samba Member
Joined: February 03, 2013
Posts: 278
Location: Australia
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wagen19
Samba Member
Joined: November 16, 2007
Posts: 23
Location: germany
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| Posted: Fri Feb 02, 2024 12:49 am Post subject: Re: Any one know the 26 VFIS in and outs? |
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| KOMBI NIKO wrote: |
| The float needle is new and set to 3.1mm. On opening up the float is floating and fuels in the bowl. |
Since when have you that kind of problem? It could be, your intake manifold-system has a (invisible?) rather big leak or connection to pre heating hose. Fuel pressure OK? Check the Surface of carb and flange of manifold to be straight. Have you tried another carb? If nothing helps, replace the manifold and all gaskets. |
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KOMBI NIKO
Samba Member
Joined: February 03, 2013
Posts: 278
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Fri Feb 02, 2024 2:39 am Post subject: Re: Any one know the 26 VFIS in and outs? |
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| wagen19 wrote: |
| KOMBI NIKO wrote: |
| The float needle is new and set to 3.1mm. On opening up the float is floating and fuels in the bowl. |
Since when have you that kind of problem? It could be, your intake manifold-system has a (invisible?) rather big leak or connection to pre heating hose. Fuel pressure OK? Check the Surface of carb and flange of manifold to be straight. Have you tried another carb? If nothing helps, replace the manifold and all gaskets. |
Motor is brand new (zero miles), was idling fine on the first start up apart from weeping shaft, I put a new gasket kit in and new shaft and the problem began. There's no leaks from the manifold. I did put the gopro in the top and can see fuel dribbling coming out the main jet (this right?)
watch here, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CW_W1agig28
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wagen19
Samba Member
Joined: November 16, 2007
Posts: 23
Location: germany
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| Posted: Fri Feb 02, 2024 3:39 am Post subject: Re: Any one know the 26 VFIS in and outs? |
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| KOMBI NIKO wrote: |
| wagen19 wrote: |
| KOMBI NIKO wrote: |
| The float needle is new and set to 3.1mm. On opening up the float is floating and fuels in the bowl. |
Since when have you that kind of problem? It could be, your intake manifold-system has a (invisible?) rather big leak or connection to pre heating hose. Fuel pressure OK? Check the Surface of carb and flange of manifold to be straight. Have you tried another carb? If nothing helps, replace the manifold and all gaskets. |
Motor is brand new (zero miles), was idling fine on the first start up apart from weeping shaft, I put a new gasket kit in and new shaft and the problem began. There's no leaks from the manifold. I did put the gopro in the top and can see fuel dribbling coming out the main jet (this right?)
watch here, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CW_W1agig28 |
Fuel coming out of the air correction jet when idling is not correct. If float is OK and not too havey, fuel pressure not too high, dust or dirt can disturb the needle valve and cause the problem. |
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esde
Samba Member
Joined: October 20, 2007
Posts: 5969
Location: central rust belt
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| Posted: Fri Feb 02, 2024 6:21 am Post subject: Re: Any one know the 26 VFIS in and outs? |
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I'd try swapping the old needle valve back in.
_________________
modok wrote:
Bent cranks are silent but gather no moss. I mean, ah, something like that. |
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KOMBI NIKO
Samba Member
Joined: February 03, 2013
Posts: 278
Location: Australia
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esde
Samba Member
Joined: October 20, 2007
Posts: 5969
Location: central rust belt
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| Posted: Fri Feb 02, 2024 3:44 pm Post subject: Re: Any one know the 26 VFIS in and outs? |
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Have you also recently rebuilt the fuel pump? Do you know what pressure is at the carburetor inlet?
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modok wrote:
Bent cranks are silent but gather no moss. I mean, ah, something like that. |
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KOMBI NIKO
Samba Member
Joined: February 03, 2013
Posts: 278
Location: Australia
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jborregoy2k
Samba Member
Joined: October 16, 2016
Posts: 32
Location: El Carmen de Viboral, Colombia
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| Posted: Tue Feb 06, 2024 2:35 am Post subject: Re: Any one know the 26 VFIS in and outs? |
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Hi, first I want to thank you for your youtube videos, they have been quite useful for our Barndoor resto.
I’ve run a few issues getting two 25 HP cars running with 26’s. Here is a review of what you may check:
1. Check the float for holes that makes then filled with gasoline, and don’t float and close the gas pass. I replaced more than 10 damaged that looked Ok outside, but were pinched/cracked. To check get them in a glass vase full of gas and dive then with something heavier. Check for air bubbles or leave them overnight and shake the float later. If damaged they can be welded back with electric soldering wire.
2. Check the gas needle for good seating/closing. Get the carb out and blow air with your mouth in the gas inlet and see if closing the needle stops your flowed air.
3. With the Ethanol gas we have here in Colombia (10-15%), I ended up using a 30 idle jet and 95 main jet (thou I live @ 2,200m 6,600 ft of altitude, you may need bigger ones of you are near sea level), so the AFR can be near the stochiometric and the spark plugs burn adequately. 40 idle jet and 120 main jet that the book recommends is far pig rich for nowadays gasoline (at our altitude so)
4. Check timing of your 383 distributor. Is giving you the almost 30 degrees in advance it should? They begin to advance at 600-700 RPM (you should set your car to 550 RPM idle as the book says), so more idle RPM, more advance, more RPM and so on. Total advance over 3,500 RPM should be 30 from the book, but some guys here in thesamba say that 32 is Ok with today’s ethanol gasoline (less burning speed).
5. Check for air intakes in manifold/gaskets/carb with a spray of carb/electric cleaner. If RPM goes up after spraying, you may have a crack/hole that lets air into the mix.
6. Check pump pressure. You may need a 0-3 psi resolution gauge to read accurately (1.6-1.9 psi should be fine). There is a huge variation in the pump springs, that lead to big difference in pressure, even thou they look the same in the outside. Did you pre-stressed the membrane with the stool-steimmer tool when re-assembled the pump? Did you change the membrane/spring with a new repro kit?
7. Check the fuel pump rod length if you are getting high pressure readings. You can deall this with more/less fuel pump gaskets, or filing/filling the rod to desired length.
Try other carbs you may have in hand, a 28 may be pretty close, and if your 25HP car runs good, the carb may be the problem.
Jorge Borrego
Last edited by jborregoy2k on Tue Feb 06, 2024 4:21 am; edited 2 times in total |
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wagen19
Samba Member
Joined: November 16, 2007
Posts: 23
Location: germany
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| Posted: Tue Feb 06, 2024 2:54 am Post subject: Re: Any one know the 26 VFIS in and outs? |
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| KOMBI NIKO wrote: |
| esde wrote: |
| Have you also recently rebuilt the fuel pump? Do you know what pressure is at the carburetor inlet? |
Yes but the motor was running at normal idle after the fuel pump rebuild, I did just double check the closing of the butterfly and its good. Idle mix screw changed as well and it doesn't do anything when screwed all the way in. |
It seems, because of a tricky unknown reason, there goes too much fuel inside the carb, or at least comes directly down to the butterfly. (Too much fuel, or too less air?) Can there be a crack around the needle-valve, around the main-jet, (loose or missing?), or in the lower carb-housing? What size of main-jet is installed? Check also the air inlet to the air-correction-jet and the idle-jet. Is there a piece of dirt on top? Are all the jets screwed the right way? In the video it seems, there comes much too much fuel when reving up. Has the floatchamber eventually a leak in direction butterfly? |
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KTPhil 
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 34023
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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| Posted: Tue Feb 06, 2024 8:49 am Post subject: Re: Any one know the 26 VFIS in and outs? |
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| For decades, replacement float valves have been junk. Try your original. |
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KOMBI NIKO
Samba Member
Joined: February 03, 2013
Posts: 278
Location: Australia
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KOMBI NIKO
Samba Member
Joined: February 03, 2013
Posts: 278
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Wed Feb 07, 2024 12:51 am Post subject: Re: Any one know the 26 VFIS in and outs? |
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| wagen19 wrote: |
| KOMBI NIKO wrote: |
| esde wrote: |
| Have you also recently rebuilt the fuel pump? Do you know what pressure is at the carburetor inlet? |
Yes but the motor was running at normal idle after the fuel pump rebuild, I did just double check the closing of the butterfly and its good. Idle mix screw changed as well and it doesn't do anything when screwed all the way in. |
It seems, because of a tricky unknown reason, there goes too much fuel inside the carb, or at least comes directly down to the butterfly. (Too much fuel, or too less air?) Can there be a crack around the needle-valve, around the main-jet, (loose or missing?), or in the lower carb-housing? What size of main-jet is installed? Check also the air inlet to the air-correction-jet and the idle-jet. Is there a piece of dirt on top? Are all the jets screwed the right way? In the video it seems, there comes much too much fuel when reving up. Has the floatchamber eventually a leak in direction butterfly? |
Definitely no cracks that I could see, the main jet is a 120, and remember the motor was running fine before the carb rebuild. All I can think is the needle seat is damaged letting air in. I will do a fuel pressure test once my kit arrives.
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KOMBI NIKO
Samba Member
Joined: February 03, 2013
Posts: 278
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Wed Feb 07, 2024 12:52 am Post subject: Re: Any one know the 26 VFIS in and outs? |
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| jborregoy2k wrote: |
Hi, first I want to thank you for your youtube videos, they have been quite useful for our Barndoor resto.
I’ve run a few issues getting two 25 HP cars running with 26’s. Here is a review of what you may check:
1. Check the float for holes that makes then filled with gasoline, and don’t float and close the gas pass. I replaced more than 10 damaged that looked Ok outside, but were pinched/cracked. To check get them in a glass vase full of gas and dive then with something heavier. Check for air bubbles or leave them overnight and shake the float later. If damaged they can be welded back with electric soldering wire.
2. Check the gas needle for good seating/closing. Get the carb out and blow air with your mouth in the gas inlet and see if closing the needle stops your flowed air.
3. With the Ethanol gas we have here in Colombia (10-15%), I ended up using a 30 idle jet and 95 main jet (thou I live @ 2,200m 6,600 ft of altitude, you may need bigger ones of you are near sea level), so the AFR can be near the stochiometric and the spark plugs burn adequately. 40 idle jet and 120 main jet that the book recommends is far pig rich for nowadays gasoline (at our altitude so)
4. Check timing of your 383 distributor. Is giving you the almost 30 degrees in advance it should? They begin to advance at 600-700 RPM (you should set your car to 550 RPM idle as the book says), so more idle RPM, more advance, more RPM and so on. Total advance over 3,500 RPM should be 30 from the book, but some guys here in thesamba say that 32 is Ok with today’s ethanol gasoline (less burning speed).
5. Check for air intakes in manifold/gaskets/carb with a spray of carb/electric cleaner. If RPM goes up after spraying, you may have a crack/hole that lets air into the mix.
6. Check pump pressure. You may need a 0-3 psi resolution gauge to read accurately (1.6-1.9 psi should be fine). There is a huge variation in the pump springs, that lead to big difference in pressure, even thou they look the same in the outside. Did you pre-stressed the membrane with the stool-steimmer tool when re-assembled the pump? Did you change the membrane/spring with a new repro kit?
7. Check the fuel pump rod length if you are getting high pressure readings. You can deall this with more/less fuel pump gaskets, or filing/filling the rod to desired length.
Try other carbs you may have in hand, a 28 may be pretty close, and if your 25HP car runs good, the carb may be the problem.
Jorge Borrego |
Thanks for this info Jorge, I will do some more tests with the fuel pump. It was running ok with the pump rebuilt before the carbie rebuild so I'm not thinking its that.
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Two Glove Boxes
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Joined: March 03, 2005
Posts: 838
Location: Texas
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wagen19
Samba Member
Joined: November 16, 2007
Posts: 23
Location: germany
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| Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2024 6:04 am Post subject: Re: Any one know the 26 VFIS in and outs? |
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| KOMBI NIKO wrote: |
| jborregoy2k wrote: |
Hi, first I want to thank you for your youtube videos, they have been quite useful for our Barndoor resto.
I’ve run a few issues getting two 25 HP cars running with 26’s. Here is a review of what you may check:
1. Check the float for holes that makes then filled with gasoline, and don’t float and close the gas pass. I replaced more than 10 damaged that looked Ok outside, but were pinched/cracked. To check get them in a glass vase full of gas and dive then with something heavier. Check for air bubbles or leave them overnight and shake the float later. If damaged they can be welded back with electric soldering wire.
2. Check the gas needle for good seating/closing. Get the carb out and blow air with your mouth in the gas inlet and see if closing the needle stops your flowed air.
3. With the Ethanol gas we have here in Colombia (10-15%), I ended up using a 30 idle jet and 95 main jet (thou I live @ 2,200m 6,600 ft of altitude, you may need bigger ones of you are near sea level), so the AFR can be near the stochiometric and the spark plugs burn adequately. 40 idle jet and 120 main jet that the book recommends is far pig rich for nowadays gasoline (at our altitude so)
4. Check timing of your 383 distributor. Is giving you the almost 30 degrees in advance it should? They begin to advance at 600-700 RPM (you should set your car to 550 RPM idle as the book says), so more idle RPM, more advance, more RPM and so on. Total advance over 3,500 RPM should be 30 from the book, but some guys here in thesamba say that 32 is Ok with today’s ethanol gasoline (less burning speed).
5. Check for air intakes in manifold/gaskets/carb with a spray of carb/electric cleaner. If RPM goes up after spraying, you may have a crack/hole that lets air into the mix.
6. Check pump pressure. You may need a 0-3 psi resolution gauge to read accurately (1.6-1.9 psi should be fine). There is a huge variation in the pump springs, that lead to big difference in pressure, even thou they look the same in the outside. Did you pre-stressed the membrane with the stool-steimmer tool when re-assembled the pump? Did you change the membrane/spring with a new repro kit?
7. Check the fuel pump rod length if you are getting high pressure readings. You can deall this with more/less fuel pump gaskets, or filing/filling the rod to desired length.
Try other carbs you may have in hand, a 28 may be pretty close, and if your 25HP car runs good, the carb may be the problem.
Jorge Borrego |
Thanks for this info Jorge, I will do some more tests with the fuel pump. It was running ok with the pump rebuilt before the carbie rebuild so I'm not thinking its that. |
Reason found, problem solved? |
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KOMBI NIKO
Samba Member
Joined: February 03, 2013
Posts: 278
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2024 2:33 am Post subject: Re: Any one know the 26 VFIS in and outs? |
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| wagen19 wrote: |
| KOMBI NIKO wrote: |
| jborregoy2k wrote: |
Hi, first I want to thank you for your youtube videos, they have been quite useful for our Barndoor resto.
I’ve run a few issues getting two 25 HP cars running with 26’s. Here is a review of what you may check:
1. Check the float for holes that makes then filled with gasoline, and don’t float and close the gas pass. I replaced more than 10 damaged that looked Ok outside, but were pinched/cracked. To check get them in a glass vase full of gas and dive then with something heavier. Check for air bubbles or leave them overnight and shake the float later. If damaged they can be welded back with electric soldering wire.
2. Check the gas needle for good seating/closing. Get the carb out and blow air with your mouth in the gas inlet and see if closing the needle stops your flowed air.
3. With the Ethanol gas we have here in Colombia (10-15%), I ended up using a 30 idle jet and 95 main jet (thou I live @ 2,200m 6,600 ft of altitude, you may need bigger ones of you are near sea level), so the AFR can be near the stochiometric and the spark plugs burn adequately. 40 idle jet and 120 main jet that the book recommends is far pig rich for nowadays gasoline (at our altitude so)
4. Check timing of your 383 distributor. Is giving you the almost 30 degrees in advance it should? They begin to advance at 600-700 RPM (you should set your car to 550 RPM idle as the book says), so more idle RPM, more advance, more RPM and so on. Total advance over 3,500 RPM should be 30 from the book, but some guys here in thesamba say that 32 is Ok with today’s ethanol gasoline (less burning speed).
5. Check for air intakes in manifold/gaskets/carb with a spray of carb/electric cleaner. If RPM goes up after spraying, you may have a crack/hole that lets air into the mix.
6. Check pump pressure. You may need a 0-3 psi resolution gauge to read accurately (1.6-1.9 psi should be fine). There is a huge variation in the pump springs, that lead to big difference in pressure, even thou they look the same in the outside. Did you pre-stressed the membrane with the stool-steimmer tool when re-assembled the pump? Did you change the membrane/spring with a new repro kit?
7. Check the fuel pump rod length if you are getting high pressure readings. You can deall this with more/less fuel pump gaskets, or filing/filling the rod to desired length.
Try other carbs you may have in hand, a 28 may be pretty close, and if your 25HP car runs good, the carb may be the problem.
Jorge Borrego |
Thanks for this info Jorge, I will do some more tests with the fuel pump. It was running ok with the pump rebuilt before the carbie rebuild so I'm not thinking its that. |
Reason found, problem solved? |
No, never got it sorted, just bought another carby and its running perfect. So I'm thinking it was internal.
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