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Clutch pedal sticking
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FloAK
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2024 4:32 pm    Post subject: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

87 tin top syncro…

We have been enjoying versatile driving in Alaska winter and summer.

Other day we had the clutch pedal stick 1/2 way after letting off the clutch pedal. If we push back in or pull out manually it works. While sticking the clutch does not engage.

where to start…Appreciate any tips!

Spring in AK is a great van season for skiing-camping:)
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E1
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2024 4:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

Never experienced this, but until someone who has shows up…

Is the master cylinder full up?

Any signs of leaks at the slave cylinder?

Old brake fluid in the lines accumulates moisture. In a climate like yours, I imagine that the odds of any water in the lines actually freezing goes up.

How’s brake pedal pressure? A little soft?
_________________
1984 Westfailure/2.1 Digijet/5.43 Ring & Pinion/Peloquin/D-rated BFG KO2s
AI has spoken to further illiteracy, to steal, to cheat, and to replace humans

"Adding power makes you faster on the straights.
Subtracting weight makes you faster everywhere."
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Last edited by E1 on Sat Mar 02, 2024 4:43 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Sodo
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2024 4:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

How much 'slop" does the pedal have when you pull/push it (at the top)?
New is "appx zero" slop.
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'90 Westy EJ25, NEW oil rings (!) 2Peloquins, 3knobs, SyncroShop pressure-oiled pinion-bearing & GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox.
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered original gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb
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skills@eurocarsplus
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2024 9:22 am    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

I just went thru a pedal cluster for a member here

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


basically, 100 year old grease could be the issue.

but the pin everyone says should "slide right out" didn't

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


what was wild was in the bronze bushings was basically 'metal dust' and it needed to get cleaned out and lubed up...you can see the blackish grey smudges in the bushing

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


this was 1/2 way thru cleaning it out. you can see it's turning 'gold' again

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


any of what I posed may or may not be your issue. is your return spring broken?

Either way, not a bad idea to just take it out and service it
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gprudenciop wrote:

my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese.......
[email protected] wrote:
most VW enthusiasts are stuck in 80's price land.

Jake Raby wrote:
Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public.

Brian wrote:
Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history
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davideric9
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2024 9:33 am    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

This! (not my photo)
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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1986 Syncro Westfalia SVX, 3 knob (bought 2008)
1987 Westfalia (bought 2010)
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E1
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2024 9:36 am    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

Wonderful info Skills, Thanks for posting it!
(and for the confirming post above)

I’d wondered about that after posting but have never worked with the parts you’ve detailed.

Now it makes sense and I realize that pedal “spring-back” has nothing to do with the hydraulics. Embarassed

I try to not speculate here, but this time, I did. Apologies to the OP.
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1984 Westfailure/2.1 Digijet/5.43 Ring & Pinion/Peloquin/D-rated BFG KO2s
AI has spoken to further illiteracy, to steal, to cheat, and to replace humans

"Adding power makes you faster on the straights.
Subtracting weight makes you faster everywhere."
— Colin Chapman
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Sodo
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2024 10:54 am    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

skills@eurocarsplus wrote:
just take it out and service it
"just"....he writes Laughing Laughing
So skills ..... I will speculate that "just" seems valid if the whole dash has been removed for other reasons.
Pedal cluster just hangin' out in front of God & everyone. Shocked

Some members say the dash can be removed in a few minutes.
Maybe a partial dash removal is valid?

==========================

If you have to remove the pedal from below the steering column.... this task can be daunting.
It's not so bad the 2nd or 3rd time you do it.
But the first time...... daunting.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
My first time was a knock-down-drag-out-fight.
The gravel-scuffle looks like Captain Kirk had a giant alien monster in his signature choke-hold. (for you old farts).

The 2nd time it took something like 1/2 hour, but I had the van much higher and I knew a few things about the job.
The main problem is visibility. You can't see what you're doing.

See this thread - it's 10 pages and has lots of success & horror stories.Clutch pedal replacement in 1/2 hour! (Pics)

Some highlights are
1) raise the front of the van so its easier to work under the steering column
2) Alaskadan chamfered the pedal bore - its easier to "feel the condition" where the pin is ready to slide into the bore.
3) cut off the un-used arm for easier re-assembly (looks like a leftover from a cable-pull pedal)
Some stuff near this post on page 6 https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=9895096#9895096

====================

I have talked to other pro mechanics who say they remove the speedometer, disconnect all the brake and clutch hydraulics, unbolt the pedal cluster and pull the whole pedal cluster out thru the speedo area.
Sounds pretty straightforward, but lots of work that way too.
_________________


'90 Westy EJ25, NEW oil rings (!) 2Peloquins, 3knobs, SyncroShop pressure-oiled pinion-bearing & GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox.
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered original gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb


Last edited by Sodo on Sun Mar 03, 2024 6:55 pm; edited 2 times in total
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do.dah
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2024 11:19 am    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

Yeah,, the "JUST" on my screen seemed to be flashing in BIG, BRIGHT FLASHING NEON lights.

I would "JUST" keep repeating the mantra, "I'm "JUST" replacing a silly little sintered bronze bushing and pin, adding a dab of grease, and hoping I don't hafta weld up the hole. Easy peazy.".

No matter what, you REALLY should "JUST" do it.

AND! Pay no heed to that "1/2 hr" statement. Good times should last MUCHO longer.
"JUST" keep telling yerself, "I am having SO MUCH fun doing this!"
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Borg
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2024 3:52 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

Sticky pedal is one possibility.

The other end of the system is a big ol' diaphragm spring that should be plenty strong enough to push the pedal back "up" to where it belongs. The friction plate slides along the transmission input shaft, is it possible it is binding up?
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Sodo
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2024 7:13 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

Friction plate does need to float on the input shaft spline but it doesn't move far enough to relate to pedal position.
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'90 Westy EJ25, NEW oil rings (!) 2Peloquins, 3knobs, SyncroShop pressure-oiled pinion-bearing & GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox.
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered original gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb
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skills@eurocarsplus
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2024 7:46 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

you can pull it right out of the speedo hole, no need for a full dash pull but the dash comes out in 7 minutes if you didn't go full asshole and wire up a ton of shit poorly
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gprudenciop wrote:

my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese.......
[email protected] wrote:
most VW enthusiasts are stuck in 80's price land.

Jake Raby wrote:
Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public.

Brian wrote:
Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history
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FloAK
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2024 1:46 am    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

The clutch pedal has ~1.5 inch of play before any resistance. When working the pedal, it feels like the source of the sticking is near the pedal.

Info above is great-I will dig further into and see what i find. Thank you!
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FloAK
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 29, 2024 10:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

I found the culprit..Thanks for all the tips!

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markswagen
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 29, 2024 10:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

that'll do it.
l cut the back of the pedal off, the top where there's an extra unused hole, opposite from the worn out end, it serves no purpose that l can see, it's removal make refitting the pedal a good bit easier.
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davideric9
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2024 7:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

Nice (I think I called this (above) on March 3)
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1986 Syncro Westfalia SVX, 3 knob (bought 2008)
1987 Westfalia (bought 2010)
1988 Wolfsburg GL (bought 2012)
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Sodo
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2024 7:42 am    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

Hey! Davideric you're stealing my fire from March2! Wink
Sodo wrote:
How much 'slop" does the pedal have when you pull/push it (at the top)?
New is "appx zero" slop.


FloAK wrote:
The clutch pedal has ~1.5 inch of play before any resistance. When working the pedal, it feels like the source of the sticking is near the pedal.


I've been watching the anecdotal evidence
and it seems like
1 inch of clutch pedal top-slop is approaching "the TOW zone".

FloAK wrote:
I found the culprit..
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


FloAK, so your clutch pedal fully-failed ?
Can we assume (for theSamba Archives) that:
    measuring 1.5" of pedal top-slop,
    and / or sticking..... Shocked
    is a clutch pedal right at the verge of failure?

_________________


'90 Westy EJ25, NEW oil rings (!) 2Peloquins, 3knobs, SyncroShop pressure-oiled pinion-bearing & GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox.
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered original gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb
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FloAK
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2024 12:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

I appreciate everyone’s help getting this sorted out, it helped a lot getting advice on where to look.

Sodo, I think it is fair to assume that 1.5” of play in the clutch pedal is near or at failure.

Thank you!
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Californio
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2024 12:43 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

Don't tell me, clutch sudden death syndrome. First the trannies now this.

Mine has a good amount of play. You can see the hole that wears out from underneath, right? Will have to check.
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Sodo
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2024 1:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

Californio wrote:
Don't tell me, clutch sudden death syndrome. First the trannies now this.

Mine has a good amount of play. You can see the hole that wears out from underneath, right? Will have to check.


Can't see nuthin'.
I'm thinking you gotta measure the "free slop at the top".

Sudden is a strange word.
We've all heard of someone who smoked cigarettes for 60 years and their death is still sudden.
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'90 Westy EJ25, NEW oil rings (!) 2Peloquins, 3knobs, SyncroShop pressure-oiled pinion-bearing & GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox.
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered original gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb
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Californio
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 01, 2024 1:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Clutch pedal sticking Reply with quote

3/4" so that should be good for another 25 years. Maybe?
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