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sunroof
Samba Member
Joined: October 06, 2006
Posts: 1989
Location: Winnipeg
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 Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2025 5:26 am Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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Going off the "gas weld" somebody was already in there before you. Wouldn't be the first time that's happened, as that's a common place for rust.
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The other side is gas welded as well, definitely factory.
The whole section cut away
That was easier than expected
I made a tool to bend the lip over
Worked a treat
Initial fit and actually how it is supposed to fit but I didn't care for it so I trimmed a little
Après trim
Don
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sunroof
Samba Member
Joined: October 06, 2006
Posts: 1989
Location: Winnipeg
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| Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2025 4:05 pm Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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That went well
This should be interesting, getting the new to meet up with the old
A welding instructor friend of mine once said "If you can jump across it, you can weld across it" I wish I could remember some of the other stuff he said. Could come in real handy. Measure once cut twice? Anyways...
Actually pretty happy with it.
Don
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sunroof
Samba Member
Joined: October 06, 2006
Posts: 1989
Location: Winnipeg
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| Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2025 5:07 am Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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So I took a little break from the type 3, I had some family business to take care of then spring came and the out doors began calling.....
Anyways got to get back to it
Super annoyed with myself, made a total rookie mistake. I welded two pieces together and realized there was no way to weld the new bit in place the way it was so had to drill out the spot welds.
Of course this meant filling the holes
New piece welded in place
In order to weld in the other half I have to locate the chassis bolt
This means bolting the chassis back up to the body. But first...
I want to do a couple of things so the chassis can stay bolted to the body for the summer. I want to put the wheels on so I can move it around the shop as I have work to do on the beetle.
I have to finish welding all this up
Then I have to weld these holes in the pan
Can you see them? One on either side of the subframe mount. So odd.
I'm also putting a nice thick layer of POR15 on the front bean before I assemble it .
Then comes the fun stuff, figuring out how all the suspension goes together so I can put the car on its wheels
Don
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 23270
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2025 1:45 pm Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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You might want to scroll thru the pics of the late model Russian Squareback that's being completely rebuilt. He's got a ton of good pics that show how the car is, and how things go back together. The suspensions (Front and rear) are covered in the Brown Bentley too, complete with torque specs. The big key will be getting the right rubber bushing combos in the right places.
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Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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Type3Todd
Samba Member
Joined: April 18, 2025
Posts: 21
Location: Richmond, BC, Canada
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| Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2025 10:52 am Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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| Quote: |
Man I love this product. Good to the last drop. None of this failing to spray with half the can left.
Don |
Hi Don,
Where did you get the weld through primer? I've never seen it before around here.
Also love the work you are doing.
Thanks |
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sunroof
Samba Member
Joined: October 06, 2006
Posts: 1989
Location: Winnipeg
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| Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2025 4:39 pm Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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Weld thru primer
https://www.grainger.ca/en/product/COPPER-WELD-THR...NLSAA_NA-1
So there were a couple of very strange rust holes in the pan that the DPO did not bother to fix before painting it
Before I can proceed with the body these holes have to be patched
There was also a hole torn in the back of the pan that I took care of as well. Again, don't know what happened there.
That will have to do
Next up this mess:
Don
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sunroof
Samba Member
Joined: October 06, 2006
Posts: 1989
Location: Winnipeg
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| Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2025 7:32 pm Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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As per Bobnotch's recommendation I scrolled the Russian squareback and found these two very useful pictures
Just the information I needed.
Don
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sunroof
Samba Member
Joined: October 06, 2006
Posts: 1989
Location: Winnipeg
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| Posted: Fri May 02, 2025 8:59 am Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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Now that the paint is all dry on this bit
I can turn to this pile of parts.
I think trying to figure out how this all goes together is going to be a fun challenge. I've always enjoyed taking stuff apart and figuring out how to put it back together. My older brother tells me I used to take his toys apart. I don't remember that but it certainly sounds like something I would do.
Don
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sunroof
Samba Member
Joined: October 06, 2006
Posts: 1989
Location: Winnipeg
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| Posted: Fri May 02, 2025 9:33 am Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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Older brother Dave:
| Quote: |
| lol… you sure did… it was real progress when you learned how to put them back together |
Don
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Mike Fisher
Samba Member
Joined: January 30, 2006
Posts: 18041
Location: Eugene, OR
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| Posted: Fri May 02, 2025 10:50 am Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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Do you need this on an early car?
I don't see it in your pile of parts.
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https://imgur.com/user/FisherSquareback/posts
69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,70,71,71,71AT,72,72AT,73 Parts
two 57 oval ragtops sold
'68 Karmann Ghia sold
Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up you end up with a lot of scum on the top! - Russ_Wolfe/Edward Abbey |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 23270
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Fri May 02, 2025 12:01 pm Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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Nope, those were used in the 68-73 cars to reduce the fuel vibration (pulses) from the electric pump.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 23270
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Fri May 02, 2025 12:17 pm Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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| sunroof wrote: |
I can turn to this pile of parts.
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Well, at least the PO didn't fully take apart the right side trailing arm and torsion bar. This will allow you to put the left side back together (mirror image of the right). Then find the upper sway bar, one end of it is tapped, that's the right side upper end. The arm in the middle of the 3 is it's mate (upper right arm) The remaining bits are for the left side. The large rubber bushings (2) are the lower beam clamp bushings, while the smaller ones are the upper beam bushings.
Are you going to install new ball joints now? It'll be easier to spread the lower spindle clamp (with bolt removed) now while you've got plenty of room to access it.
The rubber bumper with the bracket attached is the rear bump stop (2) and bolts to the spring plate, while the other rubber piece (left upper in pic) is the rear motor mount (goes on the tube) but bolts to the body and should have 5 or so red fiber shims.
That should get you started on the collection of loose parts. I hope this helps.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 23270
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Fri May 02, 2025 12:23 pm Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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| sunroof wrote: |
As per Bobnotch's recommendation I scrolled the Russian squareback and found these two very useful pictures
Just the information I needed.
Don |
I thought some of his pics might help you out. Granted his car is about 6 years newer than yours, only the front of it really changed (his is a late model).
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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sunroof
Samba Member
Joined: October 06, 2006
Posts: 1989
Location: Winnipeg
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| Posted: Fri May 02, 2025 1:51 pm Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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| Quote: |
Well, at least the PO didn't fully take apart the right side trailing arm and torsion bar. This will allow you to put the left side back together (mirror image of the right). Then find the upper sway bar, one end of it is tapped, that's the right side upper end. The arm in the middle of the 3 is it's mate (upper right arm) The remaining bits are for the left side. The large rubber bushings (2) are the lower beam clamp bushings, while the smaller ones are the upper beam bushings.
Are you going to install new ball joints now? It'll be easier to spread the lower spindle clamp (with bolt removed) now while you've got plenty of room to access it.
The rubber bumper with the bracket attached is the rear bump stop (2) and bolts to the spring plate, while the other rubber piece (left upper in pic) is the rear motor mount (goes on the tube) but bolts to the body and should have 5 or so red fiber shims.
That should get you started on the collection of loose parts. I hope this helps. |
Hmmm, let's see... The dog chew toys I know are for the rear suspension. I ordered new ball joints because these are all pooched (pooched, get it?) Anyways thanks Bobnotch, this should be interesting. Also tomorrow is the local British car clubs garage tour. They are coming to my house for some reason, i guess desperate or something, so I'll get them to help flip the pan over and I can get back to work on things.
Don
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 23270
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Sat May 03, 2025 11:32 am Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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| sunroof wrote: |
| Quote: |
Well, at least the PO didn't fully take apart the right side trailing arm and torsion bar. This will allow you to put the left side back together (mirror image of the right). Then find the upper sway bar, one end of it is tapped, that's the right side upper end. The arm in the middle of the 3 is it's mate (upper right arm) The remaining bits are for the left side. The large rubber bushings (2) are the lower beam clamp bushings, while the smaller ones are the upper beam bushings.
Are you going to install new ball joints now? It'll be easier to spread the lower spindle clamp (with bolt removed) now while you've got plenty of room to access it.
The rubber bumper with the bracket attached is the rear bump stop (2) and bolts to the spring plate, while the other rubber piece (left upper in pic) is the rear motor mount (goes on the tube) but bolts to the body and should have 5 or so red fiber shims.
That should get you started on the collection of loose parts. I hope this helps. |
Hmmm, let's see... The dog chew toys I know are for the rear suspension. I ordered new ball joints because these are all pooched (pooched, get it?) Anyways thanks Bobnotch, this should be interesting. Also tomorrow is the local British car clubs garage tour. They are coming to my house for some reason, i guess desperate or something, so I'll get them to help flip the pan over and I can get back to work on things.
Don |
If you have 4 milk crates handy, they would make a nice platform to set the pan on. Just a thought.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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sunroof
Samba Member
Joined: October 06, 2006
Posts: 1989
Location: Winnipeg
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| Posted: Mon May 12, 2025 8:41 pm Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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Started assembling the beam tonight. I am discovering that it is all trash. All the bearing surfaces on the control arms are destroyed and the DPO dosassembled the front end then stuck it outside for a few years so the bearings are full of schmutz and need to come out. But... I just need the car to move around the shop for now and I have a line on a better front end when the time comes.
Destroyed control arm
Trying to get the grub screw out. Man it is in there. Supposed to be 22 ft-lbs.
Would be nice to find bolt and washer. DPO strikes again, threw out ball joint with nut and washer.
Might be wasting a lot of time cleaning and painting parts
Something else the DPO took apart and stuck outside
Don
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Max Welton
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Joined: May 19, 2003
Posts: 10971
Location: Black Forest, CO
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 23270
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Tue May 13, 2025 1:46 pm Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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| Max Welton wrote: |
| sunroof wrote: |
| Might be wasting a lot of time cleaning and painting parts |
No such thing as time wasted in this way. 
Max |
I agree 100%, as it'll help you figure out how it goes together when you change the beam later on. And by cleaning up the parts you can inspect them, as it's always good to have some spare parts around.
The transaxle you might want to spend some extra time cleaning it up. Look for water damage in the case, as water seems to eat the metal away (kind of like rust on steel).
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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sunroof
Samba Member
Joined: October 06, 2006
Posts: 1989
Location: Winnipeg
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| Posted: Tue May 13, 2025 4:08 pm Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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I think that's hot.
Welcome to the new climate, climate 2.0
Don
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Last edited by sunroof on Thu May 15, 2025 4:13 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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sunroof
Samba Member
Joined: October 06, 2006
Posts: 1989
Location: Winnipeg
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| Posted: Thu May 15, 2025 4:00 pm Post subject: Re: Square back resurrection |
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I tells ya....
If someone had showed up with a trailer yesterday I would have gladly given them the car. It is fighting me the whole way. On Monday I brought the steering knuckles out to inspect and determine what needed to be done with them. Also I went through the control arms and inspected them. Well it turned out I had one control arm with the grub screw permanently attached which I still have to figure out what I'm going to do with that. Also I discovered that I only had one grub screw between the three remaining control arms
Of course the elephant in the room is the bearing surfaces on the control arms. I will deal with that when I have an idea how to, for now, like the people who want to go to Mars I will pretend the Big Problem is not there.
I also found out why one ball joint was cut off: busted pinch bolt.
I spent an hour drilling that out
Now I think I will attempt a helicoil repair.
I should be able to get an M10 version of the kit. While I'm at the bolt store I will see if I can get an M14 tap to clean up the grub screw threads as well.
I went to the nut and bolt store today and bought some bolts to substitute for grub screws
Including some pretty ham fisted grinding
In order to drill out the pinch bolt I had to dismantle the steering knuckle so into the blasting cabinet and a layer of paint befor I attempt to reassemble it and find other nasty surprises.
Don
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