Turn signal oddity

[aquifer]

My turn signals quit working suddenly. The lights all work, including the park lights. The emergency flashers still work, but the bulb itself, inside the flasher switch, only flashes when I put the turn signal stalk in an up or down position.

The wiring looks right according to Bentley. Bit of a head scratcher here. I suppose the relay must be bad? The blinkers worked fine a few minutes earlier, and I wasn't working on anything related to wiring, but the next time I turned on the blinker, nothing happened. The battery is fully charged.

Any suggestions? Thank you!
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Parts needed:
Front & rear NOS or used OEM door panels for a '67 in the original Gazelle color (dark tan/light brown).

[67rustavenger]

How are your fuses looking?
One of my 67's did this. I remedied it by rotating the fuse closest to the steering column.
The fuses get a little corroded and rotating them makes a decent temporary connection.
I got fed up with the above and changed the fuse block to a more modern blade fuse deal.
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I have learned over the years.
Cheap parts are gonna disappoint you.
Buy Once, Cry Once!

There's never enough time to do it right the first time. But there's always enough time to do it thrice.
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo!

[OldSchoolVW's]

[scrivyscriv]

The relay box and wiring are a little goofy but not too hard to troubleshoot.
I’d start with a printed color wiring diagram and check each connection.. i don’t remember if you’ve put a new harness in or not but the old terminals will crack and get loose causing different weird gremlins.
Maybe try tightening the screw in for the relay. That’s the ground for it
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Robert in Memphis
Dünkelgrügen 1967 Java Green bug thread
Engine rebuild thread
If you're ever in the Memphis area, you are welcome to stop by for advice and help.

[aquifer]

[aquifer]

<deleted>
_________________
Parts needed:
Front & rear NOS or used OEM door panels for a '67 in the original Gazelle color (dark tan/light brown).

[aquifer]

[EVfun]

[OldSchoolVW's]

[aquifer]

[MrGoodtunes]

@ aquifer, your symtoms are almost exactly what happens with my buggy's blinkers after not being used for several days; except for one thing, when my turn signals are failing, hazard flashers work (including red knob light) regardless of turn signal switch position. The fix for me (which has been doing the trick for years now, but may not work for you 'cuz I'm using a mid70s hazard switch) is to fiddle with hazard switch while turn signal stalk is either up (right turn) or down (left turn). By pulling the hazard switch only part way out and jiggling it, turn signals begin to work and will stay good (until next similar failure after long period without use).

[Zwitterkafer]

Make sure that the emergency flasher switch is tight in the dash and well grounded. That ground is essential for the emergency flasher to be activated and for the flasher switch bulb to blink. The switch must be tight in the dash and any fresh paint scraped away a bit to allow for a ground connection. IIRC there exists a version of the switch with a dedicated ground wire, in recognition of this grounding problem.

When the '66 - '67 type switch is pulled, "s" on the flasher is connected to ground, to start the flasher. At the same time, the switch connects "49a" on the flasher to the bulb in the flasher switch. If jiggling the switch in various positions influences functionality, the grounding or internal contacts are suspect.

Confirm first that both tell-tale bulbs are good, and that the flasher ground and power source are both faultless. No LED type bulbs in use, right?
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"Criticism comes easier than Craftsmanship"
- Zeuxius, 400 BC

[scrivyscriv]

I looked through the wiring diagram some more and I think it may be on the black/ white and green stripe wire circuit. It carries the pulsing 12v to the turn signal switch, where it’s directed to left side or right side lights circuits. Five bucks or a boojee coffee says the wire terminal 49a on the flasher relay came loose or fell off!

On the flasher relay, terminals VL and VR send the pulsed voltage to BOTH left and right lights circuits at a factory T splice, Only when the hazard knob is pulled. I think the light in the hazard knob is back feeding through the turn signal switch when you move the turn switch.
_________________
Robert in Memphis
Dünkelgrügen 1967 Java Green bug thread
Engine rebuild thread
If you're ever in the Memphis area, you are welcome to stop by for advice and help.

[aquifer]

[aquifer]

Well the new relay didn’t fix it. Still no turn signals. The red light in the emergency flasher knob only flashes when I move the turn signal lever lever up or down.

I think I misread what scrivy said above, and I now agree that it must be backfeeding through the turn signal switch on the steering column. I really thought the feedback was inside the relay. But nope. I’ll dig deeper into the switch itself.

Any other ideas are welcome as well.
_________________
Parts needed:
Front & rear NOS or used OEM door panels for a '67 in the original Gazelle color (dark tan/light brown).

[EVfun]

The problem is, I don't think any of us really know what is inside of the 9 pin turn signal flasher. It is likely partly solid state, and that can make for some unusual failure modes, or unexpected sensitivity to grounds or power sources.

Functionally, the 9 pin flasher is a heavy duty flasher and relay with 3 sets of normally open contacts and 1 set of double throw contacts (likely in the form of a 4PDT relay). When the emergency flasher switch is pulled it will turn the relay on and using the now closed normally open contacts send flasher power to both sides of the turn signal switch and to the bulb in the flasher knob. The double throw contact set powers the flasher and when it switches it changes the power supply to the flasher from a terminal 15 fuse (ignition switched hot) to a terminal 30 fuse (always hot). The dash turn signal indicator is handled by the flasher like on other Bugs.
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[aquifer]

[EVfun]

[aquifer]

[scrivyscriv]