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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 26109
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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 Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2025 6:22 pm Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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| oakman wrote: |
Just to confirm, I have a very original 1965 (August 64') bus with it's confirmed original 1500cc engine and it has the spring on the cable only. |
Nice to see the old RF suppression parts on the generator and coil!!
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matthew henricks
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Joined: January 02, 2002
Posts: 1369
Location: So. Cal
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2025 4:29 pm Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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Been out of town. Good to see some information being share.
I have added to my list my nylon nuts. Thank you.
I have learned that there are two different versions of the 30 PICT-1 carburetor. One with the compression spring and one with the extension spring. The later is far more common IMO. I have both and they are slightly different and a study in frustration.
I had assumed that the 1500 would have jumped to the 30mm carburetor simply for better flow but now i am not sure.
According to Bentley (below) VW fitted a "modified" 30 PICT-1 in Aug 65. Does that mean they already had the 30 PICT-1 on there and did a upgrade or this is when that carburetor was introduced?
I have not found anything that links the 28 PICT to the 1500 engine yet and it seems strange to increase the motor CC, add a governor and not also increase the carburetor.
Again according to Bentley (below) and also indicated be Everett in an earlier post in Dec 65 VW switched from the compression spring to the extension spring.
| EverettB wrote: |
End of 1965 for Buses:
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FWIW there was a change to the fuel pump too that was used on the 1500. Not super clear in the manual what the actual change was but it was marked as shown. (VW3) I have never seen this marking before.
So... What carburetor did the 1965 1500 ship with?
Somewhere i had found a progressive refinement to Solex carburetors which i thought listed all the changes with dates (and ID stamping on the carburetor) from 28 PCI up past 34 PICT but i cannot locate that right now. That may shed some light.
Anyways... I am certain my bus would use the compression spring set-up but not clear right now if its the 28 or 30 PICT-1.
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1964 Original Owner build Thread. https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=702135&highlight=
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Eric&Barb
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Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 26109
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2025 4:40 pm Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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| matthew henricks wrote: |
| Anyways... I am certain my bus would use the compression spring set-up but not clear right now if its the 28 or 30 PICT-1. |
AUG64:
AUG65
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matthew henricks
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tasb
The Distributor Distributor
Joined: April 27, 2002
Posts: 6815
Location: Pentwater, Michigan
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| Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2025 10:14 pm Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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In what years were generator brush covers a factory thing?
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70bus
Samba Member
Joined: July 15, 2004
Posts: 1487
Location: P.O.
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| Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2025 10:40 pm Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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| Quote: |
| In what years were generator brush covers a factory thing? |
the years before VW discovered they caused generator overheating? Seriously tho, the covers always had a plastic that looked "70s" to me, but no doubt E&B know the dates. I have a few but don't use them due to airflow issues in gens. Of course, possible Bosch did something to fix that, or it is an oft-repeated myth.
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Craig K
70 Neunsitzer
65 Pritschenwagen
"If Von Dutch was alive, he'd walk in there with a pistol and shoot these people." - Robert Williams
Raul the 65 singlecab
Karl the 70 nine-seater |
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tasb
The Distributor Distributor
Joined: April 27, 2002
Posts: 6815
Location: Pentwater, Michigan
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2025 4:22 am Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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I think it’s been established that covering just the top and leaving the bottom open results in normal heat venting.
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1957 Kombi low mileage 36 hp governor equipped M 178 Slow Drag Winner 2014, 2015, 2018
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 26109
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2025 8:21 am Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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| tasb wrote: |
| In what years were generator brush covers a factory thing? |
Started with engines AB, AC, AD, AE, AF 01AUG1970 (1971 model year beginning) production.
The below from the "Beetle VIN / Chassis Numbers" thru the "Technical" button at top right of any of the TS webpages:
| Quote: |
Year Chassis 1600 Notes
1970
Jan 1 110 2 473 154 B6 192 533 - 1600 SP
Jan 110 2 562 429
Feb 110 2 656 704
Mar 110 2 749 553
Apr 110 2 855 740
May 110 2 949 762
Jun 110 3 050 707
July 110 3 097 085
110 3 097 086
110 3 097 087
110 3 097 088
110 3 097 089 L0 025 858 Last Engine of L series 1500 low octane M240
E0 021 603 Last Engine of E series 1300 low octane M240
B6 440 900 Last engine of B6 series 1600 SP- USA
H1 259 314 Last engine of H1 series 1500 SP
F2 140 820 Last engine of F2 series 1300 SP
Aug 1 111 2 000 001
111 2 000 002
111 2 000 003
111 2 000 008
111 2 000 009
111 2 000 010 D0 675 001 - 1200/34bhp DIN - 40HP SAE gross
AB 000 001 - 1300/44bhp DIN - 52HP SAE gross
AD 000 001 - 1600/50bhp DIN - 60HP SAE gross
AE 000 001 - 1600/50bhp DIN - 60HP SAE gross - USA
AC 000 001 - 1300/40bhP DIN (low octane)
AF 000 001 - 1600/46bhp DIN (low octane) |
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matthew henricks
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Joined: January 02, 2002
Posts: 1369
Location: So. Cal
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2025 9:50 am Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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| oakman wrote: |
Just to confirm, I have a very original 1965 (August 64') bus with it's confirmed original 1500cc engine and it has the spring on the cable only.
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Was the crank bolt cover a bus thing? Thought that was a bug thing.
Also, did all VW's have the valve clearance tag or just some? Noticed the factory image below does not appear to show one.
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1964 Original Owner build Thread. https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=702135&highlight=
Ambulance Fan's. https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=627707&highlight=
Parts i am looking for:
64 bug nice used front/rear Black LHD floor mat. |
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Eric&Barb
Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 26109
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2025 10:14 am Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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| matthew henricks wrote: |
Was the crank bolt cover a bus thing? Thought that was a bug thing. |
Bug, bus, K. Ghia, etc. all upright engines that need to cool the same. So used same tin pieces.
| matthew henricks wrote: |
Also, did all VW's have the valve clearance tag or just some? Noticed the factory image below does not appear to show one. |
After VW found out the fatal flaw of the round bossed heads of the 40 HP and very early 1500cc engines was the long rocker studs. When an engine was converted to the short stud kit, a tag was a good idea to tell the following mechanic that the valve clearance needed to be the .006" (.15mm), instead of the previous .008" (.2mm) and .012" (.3mm).
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matthew henricks
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Posts: 1369
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2025 10:47 am Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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| Eric&Barb wrote: |
After VW found out the fatal flaw of the round bossed heads of the 40 HP and very early 1500cc engines was the long rocker studs. When an engine was converted to the short stud kit, a tag was a good idea to tell the following mechanic that the valve clearance needed to be the .006" (.15mm), instead of the previous .008" (.2mm) and .012" (.3mm). |
Thank you. This sounds like a retrofit sticker then and from the factory you would not get it. Do i understand that right?
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1964 Original Owner build Thread. https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=702135&highlight=
Ambulance Fan's. https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=627707&highlight=
Parts i am looking for:
64 bug nice used front/rear Black LHD floor mat. |
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70bus
Samba Member
Joined: July 15, 2004
Posts: 1487
Location: P.O.
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2025 10:51 am Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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No, they are saying that after a certain point in 1500cc production, ALL new engines got one; what is your engine number (and did you tell us day of manu? I can't remember). Those two bits plus a quick look through Progressive Refinements should tell you whether your engine had a sticker. Off the top of my head, 1500s were made in 63, so if yours is Aug 64 it should have had one.
EDIT - go back a page to Everett and I talking about the carbs; SOME VWs had 1500s from Jan 63 and Everett speculates maybe Deluxe buses got them, and other models got them in Aug 64. So the answer to your question would lie in WHEN exactly VW changed to short rocker studs... which will be in Progressive Refinements. If in 63, your bus had a sticker. If in Aug 64, your bus might be earlier enough NOT to have one!
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Craig K
70 Neunsitzer
65 Pritschenwagen
"If Von Dutch was alive, he'd walk in there with a pistol and shoot these people." - Robert Williams
Raul the 65 singlecab
Karl the 70 nine-seater |
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Eric&Barb
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Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 26109
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2025 12:18 pm Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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| 70bus wrote: |
| No, they are saying that after a certain point in 1500cc production, ALL new engines got one; what is your engine number (and did you tell us day of manu? I can't remember). Those two bits plus a quick look through Progressive Refinements should tell you whether your engine had a sticker. Off the top of my head, 1500s were made in 63, so if yours is Aug 64 it should have had one. |
Sorry, was not totally clear. Super easy for any mechanic to see at a glance that a head in situ has round or square cast rocker bosses once the valve cover is popped off. So once the square bosses came out it was not a problem to ID those.
On the other hand the round bosses were a major pain for mechanics to see if the early heads in situ had been changed from long to short studs. So a sticker was issued at the dealerships to give the mechanics the heads up of the change at a glance.
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70bus
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2025 12:41 pm Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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So only the motors with round bosses should have the sticker? I see them everywhere :) I guess we'll have to dig through the factory pics and see if motors had them after the switch to square bosses. If not, likely a service add-on.
Next Matthew gets to find out what stamps - if any - were on the BACK of the fan shroud!
BTW, I really appreciate Matthew's retarting this thread, and all the replies; I intend to make my 5/65 bus motor as stock as possible from the outside (it's a 1679cc with an AL case). I just ordered a cone-top Pierburg pump to replace my square top and am making a shopping list as we go on.
FWIW, I quickly dug through some pics tagged 65 motor engine and found these
Mar 65
All-original 65
OG 65
65 1500 T1
Fuel pipe
None appear to have a spring on carb.
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Craig K
70 Neunsitzer
65 Pritschenwagen
"If Von Dutch was alive, he'd walk in there with a pistol and shoot these people." - Robert Williams
Raul the 65 singlecab
Karl the 70 nine-seater |
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Eric&Barb
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Joined: September 19, 2004
Posts: 26109
Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2025 1:37 pm Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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| 70bus wrote: |
So only the motors with round bosses should have the sticker? I see them everywhere  I guess we'll have to dig through the factory pics and see if motors had them after the switch to square bosses. If not, likely a service add-on. |
Would not be surprised if some or even a majority of VW dealers installed that sticker on ALL VWs till about 1967 model year came out. VW dealers/mechanics did what VW dealers/mechanics would do, they were not as controlled like the factory workers were by VAG.
Plus as the old formerly long stud engines died the fresh air shrouds they had were just fine for any 1600 rebuild. So the stickers just carried ever onward.
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tasb
The Distributor Distributor
Joined: April 27, 2002
Posts: 6815
Location: Pentwater, Michigan
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| Posted: Thu Aug 07, 2025 6:32 pm Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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The following engine items have month and year stamped on them. Coil, most distributors, condensers, vacuum canister, governors, generators, some voltage regulators, air filter, probably something I’ve missed. You could really go nuts with some of this! Happy hunting!
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1957 Kombi low mileage 36 hp governor equipped M 178 Slow Drag Winner 2014, 2015, 2018
1965 hardtop Deluxe Microbus owned since 1990 M 620 factory 12 v 1500cc
1961 (October)Single Cab- Road Trip Workhorse
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BarryL 
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Location: Casa de Oro, California
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| Posted: Sun Aug 10, 2025 6:28 pm Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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Another detail to look for is the fuel line holder on the left wire holder.
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70bus
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| Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2025 1:09 pm Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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Thanks for another snipe hunt BarryL! Although, is it original? The parts manual lists 113905451A as ign cable holder and it has slots just for the wires. Another parts manual lists 31190545; also 2 slots.
Fuel lines in my books just have a clamp on side of fan housing.
Love to find a part number...
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Craig K
70 Neunsitzer
65 Pritschenwagen
"If Von Dutch was alive, he'd walk in there with a pistol and shoot these people." - Robert Williams
Raul the 65 singlecab
Karl the 70 nine-seater |
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vwmerckx
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70bus
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| Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2025 1:24 pm Post subject: Re: Stock factory engine 1965 |
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Note that says 451B.
Wasn't doubting BarryL (rarely a good idea), just wondering why the parts manual I have doesn't show it and only has 451A depicted.
And thanks to Bill at Sparxwerks, a properly-stamped - and properly dated for my truck - Pierburg cone-top (tho the numbers on top flange are too faint to see anymore ).
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Craig K
70 Neunsitzer
65 Pritschenwagen
"If Von Dutch was alive, he'd walk in there with a pistol and shoot these people." - Robert Williams
Raul the 65 singlecab
Karl the 70 nine-seater |
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