Rear wheel remains stiff after handbrake adjustment

[Brucie_Lee]

Hi,

I’m in the process of making some adjustments to my handbrake on my 71 Bay as it doesn’t fully engage until about 10 clicks. I’ve had new brake shoes and pads fitted in the past year and the handbrake cables were replaced at the same time as well. I also don’t leave it in the garage with the handbrake on so it shouldn’t be that it’s seized in place anywhere. The van hasn’t driven much in that time as it was winter and I had other house commitments to prioritize over getting it roadworthy.

I thought that since the garage said they did the brake adjustment at the rear I’d be OK to just make adjustments to the handbrake cables in the cab. I got it so that it starts to engage and be difficult to turn the wheels at 6 clicks and it fully engaged and not moveable (without a lot of pushing!) at 8 clicks which seemed like the goal but I’m now finding that after making the adjustment one of the rear wheels remains very stiff and hard to turn once I’ve let off the handbrake.

This doesn’t feel right at all so I loosened off the cable some more until the wheel turned same as the other side but then of course when I pull on the handbrake again the problematic wheel doesn’t lock like the other side does.

I then tried loosening both cables to once again check the wheel resistance and I can turn them both but they’re not spinning freely and will stop almost immediately once I stop trying to spin them. I can’t tell if the brake pads are maybe a tad close to the shoes when no brakes are applied and so I’m just overdoing it when making handbrake adjustments.

Finally, when I do let off some of the tension on the problematic side there is a light “clunk” in what feels like the cable itself, almost as though it’s catching somewhere. After the “clunk” I’ve noticed that the wheel turns easier again but it’s still kind of tight in my opinion.

I’m at a bit of a loss on what to do now. I could remove the wheels and make adjustments to the star adjuster(s) but this was supposed to have been done at the garage I took the van to already so I’d not planned on doing this. Although I do understand that you are supposed to make adjustments to the brakes at this point before doing anything with the handbrake cables. I just don’t want anything to be too tight and burn away the brake pads but I also can’t seem to adjust the cables so they lock on equally!

So I guess my question(s) are:

Is there anything that could be causing the brake pad to not disengage from the shoe on one side straight away?

Is there something that could be causing the handbrake cable to “catch” inside the channel/pipe that it’s threaded through, stopping it from disengaging properly?

Do I need to look for anything else to adjust besides the star adjusters and the nuts at the handbrake in the cab?

These are the main videos I’ve been using for reference in addition to my Bentley and Haynes manuals:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LSbsPrGS0Os

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xUOMc2gD2qk

Cheers.

PS - I’m not the most mechanically minded person but I’m trying!
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[SGKent]

a handbrake job starts with rear brake adjustment first because that affects the number of clicks.
_________________
George Carlin:
"Most people don't know what they're doing, and a lot of them are really good at it."

Skills@EuroCarsPlus:
"never time to do it right but always time to do it twice"

[Abscate]

Back wheels up, drums off , confirm workmanship of brakes.

Don’t forget to undo all the park8ng brake adjustment first.
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[lil-jinx]

the book says to pull the brake lever out 6 clicks ,then adjust the cables until the wheels start to drag and can still be turned by hand,
the shoes could be starting to rust in position from lack of use ,after adjustment you may have to drive the bus and do a few brake applications to get them to fully release.
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https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=620186
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=668799
1974 Bay Westfalia. she likes to be called Ethel.
1968 Dune Buggy sold dec 2024

1974 parts bus
A smart man learns from his mistakes,a very smart man learns from other's mistakes.

[Brucie_Lee]

[Abscate]

You dont touch the parking brake cables or lever adjustment until you know the service brake shoes are:

Good lining
Radiussed to the drum
Adjusted to within 3 clicks of drum not turning by hand

Taking on faith that your garage did the above correctly is about a 9% odds.
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[lil-jinx]

i suppose you could do a cable adjustment with the lever in ,and test it at 6 clicks,then readjust as required to get the 6 click resistance.
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https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=620186
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=668799
1974 Bay Westfalia. she likes to be called Ethel.
1968 Dune Buggy sold dec 2024

1974 parts bus
A smart man learns from his mistakes,a very smart man learns from other's mistakes.

[kreemoweet]

Whatever the reason for the wheel hangup, it will be necessary to open up wheel/brake assembly for investigation, unless you can spot something obvious by eyeballing the cable conduit under the bus. Which entails de-adjusting brake shoes and then putting them right again afterward. Since you have so much trust in the work of your "garage", I suggest you leave it all to them.
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'67 bug: seized by the authorities
'68 bug: seized by the authorities
'71 kombi: not yet seized by the authorities

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[Brucie_Lee]

[Brucie_Lee]

[SGKent]

these are FIFTY year old cars. Someone who worked on them as daily drivers when they were a young person at age 25 - 30 is now 75 - 80 years old. You better learn how to care for your car or have a lot of money to pay a restoration specialist, if they can find one. Rear brakes either went disc or self-adjusting drum some 40 years ago so it is hard to find people who have ever serviced manually adjusted brakes.
_________________
George Carlin:
"Most people don't know what they're doing, and a lot of them are really good at it."

Skills@EuroCarsPlus:
"never time to do it right but always time to do it twice"

[lil-jinx]

mechanic work is fairly easy,most of if follows logic,get a service manual and refer to it often.
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https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=620186
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=668799
1974 Bay Westfalia. she likes to be called Ethel.
1968 Dune Buggy sold dec 2024

1974 parts bus
A smart man learns from his mistakes,a very smart man learns from other's mistakes.

[Brucie_Lee]

OK so a quick update on the progress.

I removed the back wheels and drum cover plate and checked the brake pads and everything looked good there and when I had my wife test the brakes up front I could see the shoes moving and making contact the backing off when she took her foot off the pedal. I checked the star adjusters but they were set fine as far as I was concerned.

So then I went to the handbrake cables which I’d fully slackened off and proceeded to pull the level out to 6 clicks and then adjusted each cable until the drums started to be hard to move without a lot of effort on 6 clicks and then fully locked on 8 clicks. I could have it wrong but I’m pretty sure that’s what I read.

When I let off the handbrake the drivers side drum returns to normal and I can spin it without much effort. The passenger side is different though and it stays pretty stiff to turn although it will turn. This is not the same feeling as it was before any adjustment of the handbrake cables to tighten them.

If I lie down under the van I can see the shiny new handbrake cables and if I gently tug or wiggle on the passenger side one I can go back to the drum and it rotates normally with minimal resistance.

So I’m suspecting that perhaps the cable is getting caught or finding some resistance somewhere which is why it’s not fully disengaging the brake shoe. I can see that the cable is greased inside the channel but of course there could be a minor blockage or something that’s just preventing it from fully returning to the disengaged position.

I’m not sure what more I can do now other than fully disconnect the passenger side handbrake cable, somehow cleaning out the guide tube and then re-running it as everything seemed to be fitted right at the drum. Could it be possible to fit the handbrake cable the wrong way round at the drum end?

Since the cables are brand new is this something that can happen and they’ll settle in with repeated use? I haven’t driven it yet since doing the adjustments so I don’t know if that’s also something that will correct itself once I apply the brakes a few times and actually use it rather than checking it while on the jacks.

My other option is to just slacken off the cable so that it doesn’t cause the brake to bind when the handbrake is pulled for that side but then I’ll have uneven grip which isn’t ideal.

I’m just worried about driving around with the back wheel really sticking and wearing out the brake shoes unevenly. I have the equivalent of an MOT on Wednesday though so don’t really want to take everything apart in case I have problems getting it back together again in time.

Apologies for all the questions but any advice is greatly appreciated.

Thanks.
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[lil-jinx]

you could back off the passenger side cable a little and see if that works,or back off the brake at the star adjusters a little,,if you back off at the wheel ,do a road test and looks for pulling to one side,if it's just a notch or two different from the other side you probably won,t notice any pulling,
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https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=620186
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=668799
1974 Bay Westfalia. she likes to be called Ethel.
1968 Dune Buggy sold dec 2024

1974 parts bus
A smart man learns from his mistakes,a very smart man learns from other's mistakes.

[SGKent]

is your cable system the two cable system that goes to a spreader and then a single cable up to the e-brake mechanism, or the two cable system all the way to the e-brake system? I forget what year it changed.

If it is the two into one system, I would look at the spreader bar when the brake is pulled to see if it is pulling equally on both sides. If not, you may think you are evenly applying equal force but something else may be going on.
_________________
George Carlin:
"Most people don't know what they're doing, and a lot of them are really good at it."

Skills@EuroCarsPlus:
"never time to do it right but always time to do it twice"

[kreemoweet]

Seems like the old cable has worn a groove somewhere along its path, and the new one is getting wedged into the groove when tightened. I'd be looking for any damage or bends in the cable conduit, especially where the cable enters or leaves the conduit. If the groove is in the flexible bowden tube, maybe just giving it a half-turn will keep the cable from running in the groove.
_________________
'67 bug: seized by the authorities
'68 bug: seized by the authorities
'71 kombi: not yet seized by the authorities

Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!

[Brucie_Lee]

[Brucie_Lee]

[SGKent]

I think the most exposed spot is the welded steel tubes they go into that go under the rear torsion tube. Sometimes someone will put a jack under one and crush it. I don't know how someone would expand that. Maybe large channel locks on the sides to open it a little if that has happened. Follow the cables under the front floor pan and be sure they aren't rubbing on something.
_________________
George Carlin:
"Most people don't know what they're doing, and a lot of them are really good at it."

Skills@EuroCarsPlus:
"never time to do it right but always time to do it twice"

[Abscate]

You can’t check the star wheels with the drum off. Usually, if you can pull the drum without backing off the stars, they aren’t right
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