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FlowerPowered
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Joined: December 22, 2005
Posts: 389
Location: Montana
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 Posted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 1:08 pm Post subject: Best 2.0 engine upgrade? |
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| I need some advice on our recently purchased 76 Westy with a blown stock 2.0 FI engine. I am located in the far reaches of Montana, so I can't just take it to a shop, so it's either a shipped in rebuilt or rebuild it myself. I've never done a rebuild, but I'm not new to ACVWs, having owned a '71 Super since '95 and a '73 Thing since '04, so I'm not adverse to diving in. We plan on really loading this baby up for some long and intense travels, so any recommendations for an engine performance upgrade? For example, GEX advertises a "high performance" long block for about $2300. Another company aircooledtechnology.com offered me a super duper rebuild kit (I actually talked on the phone with them) for about $5000, which they claim is the best on the market with a 35% increase in horse power over stock, or a turn-key for $10,000, but kinda pricey I'd say. Or is there just a known good rebuild combination of jugs, heads, cam, crank I could shop around for? Ofcourse, oil pump and exhaust upgrades are a consideration too. |
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BUSBOSS
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Joined: January 21, 2009
Posts: 2161
Location: Northern California
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| Posted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 1:10 pm Post subject: |
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Have you done a search for GEX? 
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mdkeranen
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Joined: July 31, 2008
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Location: West TN
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| Posted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 1:15 pm Post subject: |
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GEX does not have a good reputation. On the other hand, you can't go wrong with R.A.T.
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Randy in Maine
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SGKent 
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Joined: October 30, 2007
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Location: at the beach
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| Posted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 1:39 pm Post subject: |
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Jake Raby at air cooled technology is good. There is also Scott at German Supply in Toronto and Suburban in Boston that is the old Boston Bob's after he died. There are also some builders in Washington State.
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aeromech
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Joined: January 24, 2006
Posts: 17628
Location: San Diego, California
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| Posted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 1:42 pm Post subject: |
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You're making the right move by coming here for advice before jumping into this head first. Read the threads via the search feature. Do a few PM's with people who sound like they know what they are talking about. Lastly, plan on spending more than you want to and realize that you'll be doing the smart thing in the long run.
Since you live on another planet I suggest sending your engine off and getting it or another back as a turn key that you just will have to install. It will be much easier in the long run. Type 4 engines are a lot different than what you have been used to. Good luck.
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FlowerPowered
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Joined: December 22, 2005
Posts: 389
Location: Montana
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| Posted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 2:13 pm Post subject: |
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| BUSBOSS wrote: |
| Have you done a search for GEX? |
Wow, just did, eye opener. Yes, I had heard of the bad GEX rap years ago, but because I used to live in SoCal, there was always a local ACVW shop to tap for all my engine work. Guess I thought that the GEX folks might have matured by now, but not worth taking a chance, thanks for the advice.
I'd really like to go with RAT, if I didn't think my wife would try to send them my testicles in payment. I'll keep researching... |
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rainierdeklark
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Joined: December 04, 2007
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Location: Stockholm, Sweden
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| Posted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 4:09 pm Post subject: |
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Remeber that the stock FI system will not work on a non stock engine. You'll have to adapt the FI system or switch to carbs.
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Randy in Maine
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Joined: August 03, 2003
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| Posted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 4:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Actually a stock L-jet FI system will work well on a Camper Special. It takes some tuning, but is do-able. |
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VWMIKE76
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Joined: February 21, 2006
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| Posted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 11:13 pm Post subject: |
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jerry at northwest connecting rod here in the seattle area is great! I think his shortblock 2.0's are about 1500. you can research him and see his rep!
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Mike
77 westy Mac n cheese aka "Mac"
71 crew cab "Damien" sold and missed lots!
78 westy "Doc". in very good hands of a fellow samba member!
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raygreenwood
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Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Wed Mar 03, 2010 2:01 pm Post subject: |
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| rainierdeklark wrote: |
| Remeber that the stock FI system will not work on a non stock engine. You'll have to adapt the FI system or switch to carbs. |
Yes...it will. It simply depends on what parts are non-stock. As long as higher compresssion is good for your application....both D and L jet actually tune better with higher than stock compression (to a limit). There are numerous FI friendly aftermarket cams you can use with L-jet and a couple of specific ones that work with L-jet but are just for D-jet. Just watch the lobe center on both and teh intake valve timing on D-jet.
Both of these injection systems do much better without the heavily restrictive factory exhaust mufflers. Good aftermarket exhausts.
L-jet on busses and digijet on vanagons can both use aftermarket ignitions to good effect. Factory L-jet with mods can handle up to about 2.2L. Before runner manifolds become an issue. Ray |
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Nica
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Joined: November 11, 2005
Posts: 618
Location: Bogotá, Colombia
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| Posted: Thu Mar 04, 2010 9:52 am Post subject: |
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| ricroz wrote: |
I'd really like to go with RAT, if I didn't think my wife would try to send them my testicles in payment. I'll keep researching... |
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Amskeptic
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Joined: October 18, 2002
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Location: All Across The Country
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| Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 10:26 pm Post subject: |
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| raygreenwood wrote: |
Both of these injection systems do much better without the heavily restrictive factory exhaust mufflers. Good aftermarket exhausts.
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Will somebody please explain to me, real nice and slow, what the hell "heavily restrictive factory exhaust mufflers" are? As I remember it, the D-Jet and the L-Jet were DESIGNED around the parameters of the factory engine!
Did you know, for example, that the airflow flapper deal is completely open at 4,000 rpm? The ECU goes on to full throttle enrichment program AND THAT IS IT! That is all that little engine is getting for fuel. That is below the horsepower peak. So, what happens when you get higher in the rev band? Wait! I'll tell you. You get a Designed-In Loss Of Volumetric Efficiency, so that you do NOT burn up your precious baby. As the revs climb past 4,000 rpm, the increasing strangulation of the engine allows the mixture to remain at a safe burn like an "automatic EGR" if you will. If you give the engine better breathing, you will also give it a LEANER high rpm mixture that kills your valves dead. And then you get to say like so many others already do, These Cars Suck On The Highway.
But in fact, they are utterly bullet-proof if you either remain within the intelligent factory engineering parameters or actually think it ALL THE WAY through like Jake Raby who would go insane in a single afternoon if he had to enjoy sensible factory engineering. To set people free of the designed-in strangulation of the engine by telling them that a freer flowing exhaust would help, is not to to grasp the reasons behind why VW had these buses so unbelievably under-powered, under-carbureted, under-exhausted, under-stressed, over-geared.
It is almost like crack cocaine, the cheap-n-easy quik-powerpikker-upper tricks. People advance the timing of their VW engine and say, "it shore is peppier now!" and it is. It is. But it is deadly over the long run.
My personal recommendation is that the factory fuel injection should enjoy factory exhaust back-pressure, which, by the way, is not that bad.
Let your friggen engine run out breath at 4,500 rpm or so (you should have shifted by now! or you are going 82 mph, time to chill!).
IMO YMMV,
Colin
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mikewire
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Joined: March 22, 2010
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Location: San Antonio, TX
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Bleyseng
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Joined: July 03, 2005
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Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 3:17 am Post subject: |
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| VWMIKE76 wrote: |
| jerry at northwest connecting rod here in the seattle area is great! I think his shortblock 2.0's are about 1500. you can research him and see his rep! |
I still prefer someone else to rebuild my heads, but the rest of Jerry's work is fine.
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70 Ghia Black convert-9/69 build date-stock w/133k 1600 SP-barn find now with a rebuilt tranny and engine
77 Westy 2.0L w/Ljet, Camper Special engine-95hp and with LSD!(sold)
76 Porsche 914 2.1L L20c, 120hp Djet (sold)
87 Syncro Westy Titan Red 2.1L 2 knob 100k miles |
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Emeritusx
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| Posted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 8:24 am Post subject: |
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I am kinda in the same boat now... I like those camper specials.. I wonder how long the build time on an engine is.
Keep us informed on what you do, I may follow your steps...
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Bleyseng
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Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 11:03 am Post subject: |
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if you can follow instructions and a video you can do it. Look for Solex's Camper Special engine build of a year or so ago.
Building an engine isn't that tough esp when its a complete kit and you don't have to keep talking parts in to have machined or other problems.
A Raby kit is worth the money...
Wish I could have my bus here to drive.....
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70 Ghia Black convert-9/69 build date-stock w/133k 1600 SP-barn find now with a rebuilt tranny and engine
77 Westy 2.0L w/Ljet, Camper Special engine-95hp and with LSD!(sold)
76 Porsche 914 2.1L L20c, 120hp Djet (sold)
87 Syncro Westy Titan Red 2.1L 2 knob 100k miles |
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VWMIKE76
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Joined: February 21, 2006
Posts: 669
Location: lynnwood, washington
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| Posted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 4:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Bleyseng wrote: |
| VWMIKE76 wrote: |
| jerry at northwest connecting rod here in the seattle area is great! I think his shortblock 2.0's are about 1500. you can research him and see his rep! |
I still prefer someone else to rebuild my heads, but the rest of Jerry's work is fine. |
Who does your heads?
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Mike
77 westy Mac n cheese aka "Mac"
71 crew cab "Damien" sold and missed lots!
78 westy "Doc". in very good hands of a fellow samba member!
79 hardtop landmark "Shaggy II" |
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Randy in Maine
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| Posted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 5:41 pm Post subject: |
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Jerry built the engine in my bus when I got it, but the heads are basic AMC heads. It has always run well ~ 20K miles and hopefully will continue in the bus it is going into.
Raby and Len Hoffman did the heads on my CS and they are a work of art. Fine hardware, excellent machinework. You really do get what you pay for sometimes. |
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FlowerPowered
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Joined: December 22, 2005
Posts: 389
Location: Montana
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| Posted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 6:53 pm Post subject: |
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| mikewire wrote: |
| Hey Flower, where are you located? I'm in Billings and can recommend someone near Billings who is a great ACVW engine builder and had been doing VW/Audi for 25+ years. Post or send me a PM and I will pass on the info. |
Plentywood, so far from everything, I AM probably the most experienced ACVW man in 1000 square miles  , what a joke! Hey, Billings, ONLY 6 hours away, sounds great. Post or PM me the shop, I'll contact them lickety split. I need this baby running for summer!
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