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BFB Samba Member

Joined: November 03, 2014 Posts: 2520
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 8:33 am Post subject: Lightening any and everything … |
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There’s a lot of threads on lightened flywheels and a few on lightening reciprocating parts but those seem mostly to be about balance things out. So i thought a thread on what you’ve done or seen done to lighten parts n pieces might be interesting, whether it worked or didn’t or even good or bad ideas.
I’ll start with a couple pics i found, i know i have pics of other stuff but not on this device..
3297 grams is about 7.25lbs
_________________ "how am i supposed to torque the rear wheel nut to 250 ft lbs??? " - clonebug
An interesting thing happens in forums where everyone starts parroting the same thing and "common knowledge" takes over.
Most experts aren't. |
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vwinnovator Samba Member
Joined: July 11, 2005 Posts: 1555 Location: Still doing it in the back of your VW
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 8:41 am Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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cool stuff, but when is too light TOO light?? |
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FarmerBill Samba Member

Joined: July 25, 2017 Posts: 852 Location: New England
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 9:03 am Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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vwinnovator wrote: |
cool stuff, but when is too light TOO light?? |
When it breaks before the race ends.  |
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vwracerdave Samba Member

Joined: November 11, 2004 Posts: 15598 Location: Deep in the 405
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 9:17 am Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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richardcranium is back.
Is has been determined by many VW engine builders the last 40 years that a 12 1/2 Lb. flywheel works the best for a street driven VW engine. Anything less doesn't allow the engine to be driven smoothly on the streets. It also has an effect on shifting as the synchro's have a difficult time keeping up, and will cause them to wear out sooner. If you remove too much PP material, it will overheat and warp with aggressive clutch use.
Those lightened flywheels were an old school Formula Vee trick back when they raced stock 1200cc. _________________ 2017 Street Comp Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble, OK
2010 Sportsman ET Champion - Mid-America Dragway - Arkansas City, KS
1997 Sportsman ET Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble ,OK
Last edited by vwracerdave on Sat Jul 09, 2022 9:31 am; edited 2 times in total |
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QRP Samba Member

Joined: April 27, 2008 Posts: 1886 Location: NORTH HOLLYWOOD,CA
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 9:22 am Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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vwracerdave wrote: |
richardcranium is back. |
LMAO !!! |
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BFB Samba Member

Joined: November 03, 2014 Posts: 2520
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 11:12 am Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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QRP wrote: |
vwracerdave wrote: |
richardcranium is back. |
LMAO !!! |
What the fuck makes you think he left?
Anymore , vwracerdave, i look forward to your negative - naysayer comments as i am in awe of your ability to rain on anyone’s parade on any subject. _________________ "how am i supposed to torque the rear wheel nut to 250 ft lbs??? " - clonebug
An interesting thing happens in forums where everyone starts parroting the same thing and "common knowledge" takes over.
Most experts aren't. |
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Vanapplebomb Samba Member

Joined: November 03, 2010 Posts: 5571 Location: Holland, MI
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 11:41 am Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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Richard, don’t be surprised that a lot of people have a negative reaction to your posts.
Also, why did you change your forum name? _________________ 1800 Type 4 Berrien 295
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=487021 |
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vwracerdave Samba Member

Joined: November 11, 2004 Posts: 15598 Location: Deep in the 405
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 11:50 am Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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BFB wrote: |
QRP wrote: |
vwracerdave wrote: |
richardcranium is back. |
LMAO !!! |
What the fuck makes you think he left?
Anymore , vwracerdave, i look forward to your negative - naysayer comments as i am in awe of your ability to rain on anyone’s parade on any subject.
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I gave you a serious response to your inquiry about a lightened flywheel. _________________ 2017 Street Comp Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble, OK
2010 Sportsman ET Champion - Mid-America Dragway - Arkansas City, KS
1997 Sportsman ET Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble ,OK |
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BFB Samba Member

Joined: November 03, 2014 Posts: 2520
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 2:47 pm Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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Vanapplebomb wrote: |
Also, why did you change your forum name? |
Just a change in life. And 19 years ago i started my bodyshop as Ben’s Fabrication & Bodywork’s ( BFB ) i changed the name pretty soon on but BFB was brought up as a joke as Ben’s F#*@cking Buggy’s, so i decided recently to recreate BFB as such and have some fun with it. _________________ "how am i supposed to torque the rear wheel nut to 250 ft lbs??? " - clonebug
An interesting thing happens in forums where everyone starts parroting the same thing and "common knowledge" takes over.
Most experts aren't. |
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Glenn  Mr. 010

Joined: December 25, 2001 Posts: 79240 Location: Sneaking up behind you
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 4:17 pm Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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Moderators Note: "DON'T post personal attacks"
Remember it's easier for me to simply delete the entire topic than clean it up. _________________ Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
#BlueSquare
עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי |
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BFB Samba Member

Joined: November 03, 2014 Posts: 2520
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 6:11 pm Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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Here’s something cool. and some of you will probably remember seeing this in a thread a “few” years ago…
_________________ "how am i supposed to torque the rear wheel nut to 250 ft lbs??? " - clonebug
An interesting thing happens in forums where everyone starts parroting the same thing and "common knowledge" takes over.
Most experts aren't. |
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Glenn  Mr. 010

Joined: December 25, 2001 Posts: 79240 Location: Sneaking up behind you
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 6:16 pm Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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Stupid questions:
Is any of this practical? Meaning does it last more than 1 rpm?
What are the application for this extreme machine work?
Porsche 917 key
_________________ Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
#BlueSquare
עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי |
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Chickensoup Samba Member

Joined: January 06, 2018 Posts: 5395 Location: Good Hope, GA
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 7:26 pm Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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Bad chemistries brah simple math.
Example 1: Dude 1 insults dude 2 for no real reason expecting himself to be crowd surfed and worshiped = bad outcome
Example 2: Dude 1 gives dude 2 helpful criticism from the heart based off words of knowelege hoping to better the life of a brother = good outcome.
Choose your master. _________________ -'85 c10 5.3 LS, cam, heads, long tubes, x pipe, 3 inch spin tech's
-'01 e46 325ci *tree modded
-'05 B5.5 TDI Wagon 17in sport rims ;EGR + BSM + ASV Delete, Stage-2 Tune, straight pipe
'65 Tourist Delivery Build
'66 RIP |
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Vanapplebomb Samba Member

Joined: November 03, 2010 Posts: 5571 Location: Holland, MI
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 8:15 pm Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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Lately, my focus has been on valve train. My next build I am looking at hollow stem 8mm valves, or solid 7mm valves. Also light pushrods (aluminum) and valve springs. Currently looking at a set of Comp Cams beehive springs. I would love to find a light conical spring, but those are harder to come by. Several out there, but haven’t quite found one that fits the bill. A bit harder to fit without cutting the guide boss…which I refer not to remove material from unless I absolutely have to. I am pretty confident I can run an 86B cam up to 7k rpm with a beehive spring that actually has the same or less seat load than the stock springs. With conical springs, I could probably go as low as 90Lbs on the seat and easy rev to 7k rpm with no issues. _________________ 1800 Type 4 Berrien 295
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=487021 |
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Chickensoup Samba Member

Joined: January 06, 2018 Posts: 5395 Location: Good Hope, GA
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 8:33 pm Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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Vanapplebomb wrote: |
Lately, my focus has been on valve train. My next build I am looking at hollow stem 8mm valves, or solid 7mm valves. Also light pushrods (aluminum) and valve springs. Currently looking at a set of Comp Cams beehive springs. I would love to find a light conical spring, but those are harder to come by. Several out there, but haven’t quite found one that fits the bill. A bit harder to fit without cutting the guide boss…which I refer not to remove material from unless I absolutely have to. I am pretty confident I can run an 86B cam up to 7k rpm with a beehive spring that actually has the same or less seat load than the stock springs. With conical springs, I could probably go as low as 90Lbs on the seat and easy rev to 7k rpm with no issues. |
I once said what you said but then I got mobbed up on and recieved some pretty rude and harsh PM's
I'm sure you know this. I think. But in case you don't, Dan Ruddock sells beehive kits for t1 and t4. Idk where/hoe he makes them, but folks seem to love them. _________________ -'85 c10 5.3 LS, cam, heads, long tubes, x pipe, 3 inch spin tech's
-'01 e46 325ci *tree modded
-'05 B5.5 TDI Wagon 17in sport rims ;EGR + BSM + ASV Delete, Stage-2 Tune, straight pipe
'65 Tourist Delivery Build
'66 RIP |
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DerrickfromNC1 Samba Member
Joined: October 24, 2008 Posts: 1394 Location: North Carolina
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 9:14 pm Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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Vanapplebomb wrote: |
Lately, my focus has been on valve train. My next build I am looking at hollow stem 8mm valves, or solid 7mm valves. Also light pushrods (aluminum) and valve springs. Currently looking at a set of Comp Cams beehive springs. I would love to find a light conical spring, but those are harder to come by. Several out there, but haven’t quite found one that fits the bill. A bit harder to fit without cutting the guide boss…which I refer not to remove material from unless I absolutely have to. I am pretty confident I can run an 86B cam up to 7k rpm with a beehive spring that actually has the same or less seat load than the stock springs. With conical springs, I could probably go as low as 90Lbs on the seat and easy rev to 7k rpm with no issues. |
Here’s a recent thread discussing the use of single valve spring with a lightweight valve train.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=766305 |
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vwracerdave Samba Member

Joined: November 11, 2004 Posts: 15598 Location: Deep in the 405
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Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 10:02 pm Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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Glenn wrote: |
Stupid questions:
Is any of this practical? Meaning does it last more than 1 rpm?
What are the application for this extreme machine work? |
Those swiss cheese rods and flywheel are probably from a 40 horse 1200cc Formula Vee engine that might have 57 HP.
Probably wouldn't make it around the block on a typical 2276cc 170 HP street engine. _________________ 2017 Street Comp Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble, OK
2010 Sportsman ET Champion - Mid-America Dragway - Arkansas City, KS
1997 Sportsman ET Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble ,OK |
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Howard 111 Samba Member
Joined: July 09, 2005 Posts: 1827 Location: Virginia
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2022 1:05 am Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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One modification that's overlooked most of the time is lightening the wrist pins. It's a cheap and easy modification that takes weight off of a place that really matters, yet doesn't take away from the durability. I've always run them in all drag, and hot street cars, and run them in my current turbo street Ghia.
There are venders, or any machine shop can do it. _________________ 1973 Karmann Ghia
Turbocharged, Fuel Injected
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=531270 |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 23011 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2022 5:00 am Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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Probably the most effective "lightening" I have seen......ditch the unused seats, the spare tire....and the make the driver dump 30 pounds. The effects are amazing!
Ray |
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Dan Ruddock Samba Member
Joined: October 25, 2012 Posts: 3668 Location: Sarasota, in my adopted state of Florida
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Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2022 5:26 am Post subject: Re: Lightening any and everything … |
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Chickensoup wrote: |
I once said what you said but then I got mobbed up on and recieved some pretty rude and harsh PM's
I'm sure you know this. I think. But in case you don't, Dan Ruddock sells beehive kits for t1 and t4. Idk where/hoe he makes them, but folks seem to love them. |
FYI, the only part I make or should I say have made for me is the retainers. They are made locally for me here in Florida by three different places. One shop machine's them out of 4140 chromoly, the other heat treats them and then the last coats the with black oxide. I mod the keepers myself. The other parts?? I searched high and low for the most suitable parts for our app. The retainer is the key part to make use in a Volkswagen so much more practical and easier to install and use standard length valves.
One more key point on weight reduction, with a progressively wound spring, the effective weight of the spring at max/close to max lift is reduced in about half because the majority of the coils are stacked on top of each other and are not moving at all until the lift is reduced. Some beehives on the market are not wound this way so be careful if you want to hobble together your own setup. This progressive wind is also fantastic in reducing harmonics. Stock VW springs are also progressively wound but are completely inadequate in a performance app.
Dan |
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