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Rob Combs
Samba Member
Joined: December 30, 2020
Posts: 918
Location: South Bay LA, California
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 Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2025 3:52 pm Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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| You guys have created a monster. I love it. |
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Rob Combs
Samba Member
Joined: December 30, 2020
Posts: 918
Location: South Bay LA, California
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| Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2025 3:53 pm Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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| Brian_e wrote: |
Super easy setup in a lathe.
Since nobody around you can do simple machine work, its even more reason to get your own lathe. Not just for VW stuff, but everything. I walked out to the garage the other night and spent 5min making a simple stepped driver tool to put the drum back together in my wife's washing machine.
A 9" lathe will get you a LONG ways. Stay away from the tiny little mini lathes.
Brian |
Hey Brian, I have always wondered - when you trim these off do you start with the cylinder base on the case, then cut off the bottom where it drops into the case the same amount? Or do you just leave the bottom alone? |
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Murt
Samba Member
Joined: October 01, 2017
Posts: 679
Location: Kent, England
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| Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2025 3:54 pm Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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This is brilliant stuff 
My head is spinning now with ideas 
Thank you Brian/Rob/RickS/Zed for chiming in, and I am quite looking forward to seeing where this takes me.
Just had a message from the seller. It's his Father's old stuff that he's selling off. His Dad is quite deaf, so he's going to have a chat with him tomorrow, so we can arrange collection this week
_________________
1966 VW Beetle ‘Jules’
1967 Kombi Splitscreen ‘Barney’
2018 VW Caddy Maxi R Line
2017 Golf GTD saloon
2008 VW EOS 2.0 TFSi |
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RickS
Samba Member
Joined: May 05, 2005
Posts: 651
Location: Speonk, NY
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| Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2025 4:12 pm Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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| Zed999 wrote: |
Birmingham was the centre of industry in the UK. As big manufacturers went out of business, the machinery and tools and micrometers nad all either went for scrap or were snapped up my the machinists themselves for business or pleasure. These guys have largely now died off so I'm guessing there is an over supply of even this old machinery.
1976 |
I live on a big island that is "The Cradle of Aviation." Used machinery from the defense giants that are no longer here is everywhere. The trick is getting it into the basement! |
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Brian_e 
Samba Member
Joined: July 28, 2009
Posts: 4293
Location: Rapid City, South Dakota
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| Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2025 4:12 pm Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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| Rob Combs wrote: |
Hey Brian, I have always wondered - when you trim these off do you start with the cylinder base on the case, then cut off the bottom where it drops into the case the same amount? Or do you just leave the bottom alone? |
It all depends on how deep the person boring the case cut the counter bore. They are usually at least .05-.100" PAST the length of the cylinder register. So rarely does the very bottom of the cylinder need to be cut. Just the sealing surface.
Brian
_________________
So more or less the lazier and stupider you want to be, the nicer quality parts you need to buy.
-Modok
Narrowed beams, Drop adjustable spring plates, Bus disk brake and IRS kits.
www.type-emotorsports.com
Type E Engine Parts and Supplies
https://type-emotorsports.com/collections/engine-parts |
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Brian_e
Samba Member
Joined: July 28, 2009
Posts: 4293
Location: Rapid City, South Dakota
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| Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2025 4:18 pm Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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| RickS wrote: |
| Zed999 wrote: |
Birmingham was the centre of industry in the UK. As big manufacturers went out of business, the machinery and tools and micrometers nad all either went for scrap or were snapped up my the machinists themselves for business or pleasure. These guys have largely now died off so I'm guessing there is an over supply of even this old machinery.
1976 |
I live on a big island that is "The Cradle of Aviation." Used machinery from the defense giants that are no longer here is everywhere. The trick is getting it into the basement! |
Rick,
Your 13" SB is killer. Nice options also. We have the same thing here at the shop. My grandpa bought it new in Los Angles in 1971 for building rifles and making parts. It will never leave the family.
I wish we had machinery everywhere. I am in the middle of tourist trap, nothing commercial USA!!!
Brian
_________________
So more or less the lazier and stupider you want to be, the nicer quality parts you need to buy.
-Modok
Narrowed beams, Drop adjustable spring plates, Bus disk brake and IRS kits.
www.type-emotorsports.com
Type E Engine Parts and Supplies
https://type-emotorsports.com/collections/engine-parts |
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Glenn
Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001
Posts: 80596
Location: Sneaking up behind you
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| Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2025 4:28 pm Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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| RickS wrote: |
| I live on a big island that is "The Cradle of Aviation." Used machinery from the defense giants that are no longer here is everywhere. The trick is getting it into the basement! |
It's a LONG Island.
Fairchild, Republic,Grumman and many others.
I think Joe Aragona got most of his large machines from closed factories.
I grew up 2 miles from abandoned Curtis Wright hangers.
_________________
Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
#BlueSquare
עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי |
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dunk
Samba Member
Joined: April 02, 2006
Posts: 200
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| Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2025 4:42 am Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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| Murt wrote: |
Hi @sled
Yes, thank you. I did read Brian's response very carefully, and understood what he was saying, and it was the other points he raised that have peaked my interest as well. Particularly
trim cylinders, trim main bearing thrusts, add oil grooves to bearings, polish cranks, cams, dist drives, cut push rods to length, o-ring oil pumps, deck pistons, build special tools, etc.. on and on......
For me, remembering I am still an absolute beginner, and I agree with you with regards to the statement 'a general machinist should be able to perform this operation' stands true.
My problem is that
1. General machinists in the UK and especially ones willing to work on VW stuff are like Rocking Horse Doo Doo. When the guy I contacted today gets back to me  I will ask if he is also willing/able to trim the cylinders 0.10" instead, which as you say is more than likely the best/easiest option. I have read on here numerous times that you should be able to get a Motorcycle shop to do this sort of work, but there is a Honda dealership/workshop 4 miles from me, and they're not 'able' to help. Sometimes I think this country of mine is just doomed  , but if anyone from the UK on here who is reading this ? please feel free to give me some pointers if you know of somewhere ?
2. I have never seen Cylinders trimmed down in a lathe, but have watched a number of videos on decking a case, so at least I can picture it, so if anyone has a link to a cylinder being trimmed in a lathe I would love to see one out of interest.
3. When I do get a lathe, I will be having to learn and teach myself a whole new skillset, and although I do have a number of old 85.5 cylinders, it will still take a long time to practice and discover any skills I may or may not have ?
Dave |
That escalated quickly!...
Good luck with rebuilding that lathe... should be pretty good when done...
For the near future...
Try "reichspeed aircooled" if you haven't already... he does many vw machining operations. |
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Murt
Samba Member
Joined: October 01, 2017
Posts: 679
Location: Kent, England
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| Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2025 5:23 am Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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Hi dunk
Yes, it did escalate quite quickly last night
I am now the proud owner of the Atlas 10F-28 Lathe, and collecting it tomorrow. I am getting myself the manual, and hopefully can start practicing soon.
In the meanwhile though, and this is SPOOKY, Zed999 alluded to hearing from a friend of a friend or being in the right place right time ? Well chatting to a mate down the road in our village, and he said he knew of an old guy who used to race and build motorcycles, anyway, I rang him, and just went to see him. He knew exactly what I needed, and is going to do these cylinders for me, he said that he's done this loads of times and is 100% confident that he can take the 0.010" off as needed for all 4. He's a real old character, and a pleasure to talk to. He even said he could show me some of the basics
_________________
1966 VW Beetle ‘Jules’
1967 Kombi Splitscreen ‘Barney’
2018 VW Caddy Maxi R Line
2017 Golf GTD saloon
2008 VW EOS 2.0 TFSi |
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richparker
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2011
Posts: 7811
Location: Durango, CO
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Zed999
Samba Member
Joined: March 04, 2018
Posts: 1461
Location: UK
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| Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2025 8:37 am Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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| Excellent! All the old boy types I've ever met have been very keen to pass on their knowledge to folk that show an interest. Before we know it the only lathe operators out there will only understand computerised tools which is sad to think of. |
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Murt
Samba Member
Joined: October 01, 2017
Posts: 679
Location: Kent, England
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| Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2025 8:54 am Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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That's an interesting question @richparker.
When I built the 1800cc, I had bought the Improved Racing Full Flow with Cooler Thermostat Filter Mount along with an Autometer Temp Sensor 1/8” NPTF Male Shallow Depth (installed into AN08 filter return Line), and the Autometer Oil Temp Gauge 2639 (140-300F) Z Series Electric. Note : All from the USA
I have fitted these already on the Bus, and will just pull the flow and return from the engine and couple into the 2007cc when I install that. I have been pretty impressed with the Autometer gear, and actually prefer it over the VDO stuff in my Bug
I as usual, have another 2639 Autometer Gauge and sender in my stash that I could in theory also install into the block off plate thus monitoring engine oil directly at the case, but along with planning to look at CHT and AFR later, I'm worried about having too many gauges
Yes, @Zed999, he was amazing, just as you'd expect, a sort of old grateful dead hippy type with a big baggy comfortable woolly jumper and a big woollen beanie hat with the beard and the long grey hair, and a sort of air about him. God know what we will do with all that old knowledge gone ? sad in some ways, but as you also said, yesterday I didn't know he existed, and a chance conversation this morning with my neighbour led to meeting ? Weird
_________________
1966 VW Beetle ‘Jules’
1967 Kombi Splitscreen ‘Barney’
2018 VW Caddy Maxi R Line
2017 Golf GTD saloon
2008 VW EOS 2.0 TFSi |
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Brian_e
Samba Member
Joined: July 28, 2009
Posts: 4293
Location: Rapid City, South Dakota
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| Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2025 9:26 am Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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Good plan on the cylinders. Hang around the old dude and ask him every question you can think of. Watch him do the cylinders, and you will learn a ton in 15min. Then go home and do the same on your lathe and a old junk cylinder just for practice.
Brian
_________________
So more or less the lazier and stupider you want to be, the nicer quality parts you need to buy.
-Modok
Narrowed beams, Drop adjustable spring plates, Bus disk brake and IRS kits.
www.type-emotorsports.com
Type E Engine Parts and Supplies
https://type-emotorsports.com/collections/engine-parts |
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Zed999
Samba Member
Joined: March 04, 2018
Posts: 1461
Location: UK
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| Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2025 9:41 am Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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| Murt wrote: |
Yes, @Zed999, he was amazing, just as you'd expect, a sort of old grateful dead hippy type with a big baggy comfortable woolly jumper and a big woollen beanie hat with the beard and the long grey hair, and a sort of air about him. God know what we will do with all that old knowledge gone ? sad in some ways, but as you also said, yesterday I didn't know he existed, and a chance conversation this morning with my neighbour led to meeting ? Weird |
Uncanny, except that you're asking around and talking about it just as I was. That was a spooky fast result though!
Pick his brains, he'll love it as Brian suggests. When I met the old boy that built my present engine I just went for a quick chat and was there for about 6 hours until it started to get dark, but we were still going. Really interesting guy! |
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Glenn
Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001
Posts: 80596
Location: Sneaking up behind you
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| Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2025 6:58 pm Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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| Murt wrote: |
Hi dunk
Yes, it did escalate quite quickly last night
I am now the proud owner of the Atlas 10F-28 Lathe, and collecting it tomorrow. I am getting myself the manual, and hopefully can start practicing soon.
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Get a manly lathe 
Link
_________________
Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
#BlueSquare
עַם יִשְׂרָאֵל חַי |
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Murt
Samba Member
Joined: October 01, 2017
Posts: 679
Location: Kent, England
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| Posted: Tue Nov 25, 2025 10:12 am Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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That was very good Glenn LMAO
I have a question please ?
I am looking at doing ring gaps. I have done them before (on the 1800cc build) and I'm pretty sure I understand the process, but looking back, I did not do anything with the Oil Rings ?
These are AA 90.5 B Pistons, Obviously not a turbo but a Bus Street Engine. I will be using Grant Rings
So let's say for Minimum Top Ring 3.562" x 0.0045" = 0.016". Minimum for the second ring 3.562" x 0.0050" = 0.0178". ? These are the recommended minimum gaps ? what do you guys generally run ?
With regards to the 3 piece oil rings, do you set the gap on the top and bottom rings of these 3 piece oil rings ?? if so what do you set the gaps at ?
_________________
1966 VW Beetle ‘Jules’
1967 Kombi Splitscreen ‘Barney’
2018 VW Caddy Maxi R Line
2017 Golf GTD saloon
2008 VW EOS 2.0 TFSi |
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Rob Combs
Samba Member
Joined: December 30, 2020
Posts: 918
Location: South Bay LA, California
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| Posted: Tue Nov 25, 2025 11:18 am Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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I ground my top rings to .018, second to .020, oil scrapers came out of the box a consistent .023 so I ran it that way. These were Grant rings I sourced from Scat.
AA branded 90.5 B pistons. Make sure you check your piston to cylinder clearance - mine were tight. One was WAY tight (< .001"). An extra $200 for LA Sleeve to hone them to size and soften up the finish. |
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Murt
Samba Member
Joined: October 01, 2017
Posts: 679
Location: Kent, England
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| Posted: Fri Dec 05, 2025 8:03 am Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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Good morning Gentlemen
I have had a few days off from the workshop, and back today
I have my lathe and just waiting for the Quick Change Tool Post and other stuff to arrive. Looking forward to trying to learn some new skills I have managed to find a T nut that fits almost perfectly, but need to trim it down a touch
I have been carrying on with the mock up, and DH is 0.040” on all 4.
I have put on the head on the #1 and #2 side to look at the length of the new studs, and popped on the Rocker arm just to have a look at it, it’s new CB solid shaft, stock rockers that I have back cut and TP Adjusters. I need to torque the head, and do the final rocker adjustment.
As I say this is all just mock up, I’m miles away from this engine seeing any Glue
_________________
1966 VW Beetle ‘Jules’
1967 Kombi Splitscreen ‘Barney’
2018 VW Caddy Maxi R Line
2017 Golf GTD saloon
2008 VW EOS 2.0 TFSi |
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Murt
Samba Member
Joined: October 01, 2017
Posts: 679
Location: Kent, England
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| Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2025 6:17 am Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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Some thoughts/advice today please
So, when I originally measured DH, I was at ~0.050” on all 4. The Cylinders went in for 0.010” to be removed.
Today I am still mocking up, and still looking at things like stud lengths, rocker assembly etc and decided to measure the D/H again and I have got the following
Not sure what has gone on here, but I have been over an hour confirming this and I have
#1 = 0.040”
#2 = 0.041”
#3 = 0.039”
#4 = 0.038”
Averaged out to 0.04025”
I’m pretty disappointed with the 3/4 side, but I guess it is what it is ? What is the consensus on this? Am I overthinking this one again ? If I am perfectly honest I may have had a tiny deviance in my first measurement when I was at the 0.050”, and assuming that the machinist did remove EXACTLY 0.010” off each cylinder, it just brought that deviance with it.
Anyway, I’m thinking that I am OK to continue ?
_________________
1966 VW Beetle ‘Jules’
1967 Kombi Splitscreen ‘Barney’
2018 VW Caddy Maxi R Line
2017 Golf GTD saloon
2008 VW EOS 2.0 TFSi |
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dunk
Samba Member
Joined: April 02, 2006
Posts: 200
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| Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2025 7:25 am Post subject: Re: My 2007cc Bus Engine Build |
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Nothing ever comes out exactly, to the thousandth all round, first time...
Everything has a " machining tolerance".. it's one of the first big hurdles you start to understand when you build engines.. it's not going to fit together like lego... you have to make it fit together, with tolerances you believe will work... different applications, and different people!!  Have different tolerances they'd like to see...
You never stop learning about this..
The skill... is knowing when you're at a close enough tolerance "for your application", that the extra work won't make a difference...
Where were the parts made? To what quality standard?
Did you move barrels, pistons, rods around?
What temperature was it when you measured originally?
What torque on the hold down plates?
How accurate/expensive is your torque wrench?
How good are your measuring abilities/eyesight?
All the above and more can cause error in your new measurements..
You are 4 thou out over all the holes.. importantly only 1 thou difference on each side though.. heads should seal, deck will do the squish thing very nicely, and if using good components and building carefully nothing will hit...
I would be pretty happy with that... I've seen far far worse over the years!..
You could take a wisp off the case on the 1/2 side if after perfection, very doable, but can be a dangerous game to play.. or indeed the barrels, but I don't think you're set up for that quite yet..
Imo yes, you're fine to continue..
Also... as an aside.. do you really want a consensus?! You think theres a way to get most people on here to agree?! ... |
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