Rear alignment? Really?

[Tim Donahoe]

After I get my new front end stuff installed, new wheel, etc., the new alignment shop I'm going to wants to do a "rear" alignment, as well as the front alignment.

Is this just up-selling? My tires have shown no unusual tire wear in the rear, so is this really necessary? I've never had the rear of any of my bugs aligned at the rear.

Tim
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Let's do the Time Warp again!

Richard O'Brien

[Bruce]

Do you think your rear suspension has sagged a bit in the last 40 years? If so, the rear wheels are not aligned to the same specs as what VW did when they first built the car.

Given the amount of trouble you've had with your car's suspension, getting the rear aligned is a good idea. For your own information, maybe you should mark the relationship between the spring plates and the trailing arms so see how much they get adjusted.

Here's a tip. When you get the car aligned, tell them you would like to sit in the car while they do the job. Your weight affects the wheel alignment. Bring a big newspaper.

If the shop is really good, they will also measure the ride heights of all 4 corners and correct that during the alignment.
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[DeathTrap]

I think it's up selling.

I doubt you can get $1000 of labor for the $89.95, errr $109.95 4 wheel job. Chances are they will set the toe, of course it will be off with human weight added.

[KAmes]

I recently ran into this with my Thing after replacing tie rods. I asked the alignment shop to set my toe in, and they came back like this wasn't possible unless they did a full four wheel laser alignment. It's not that I minded the idea of it and I wasn't concerned about the cost, what bothered me was I'm not ready to tear into the rear suspension at this time when things break due to corrosion or cannot be properly set due to being 43 years old. My rear tires are wearing normally and I feal more comfortable leaving well enough alone until I'm ready. I ended up doing it myself with a tape measure for now.

[VWCOOL]

well yeah it's impossible to align a car - properly - without referencing off the rear axle...

[thechief86]

I've done 120k miles in my car with just tape measure alignment since 2005, and my tires dry rot before they wear out. I'm more or less of the idea that the car is so light that tires seem to just last longer...
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"A poor workman always blames his parts... Ya gotta have skillz to hang junk." -johnnypan

[60ragtop]

yes, you need to do it now cause it's in your head
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Rick
Certified Mechanic by the State of Michigan in 1977
ASA certified in 1987
Certified Hunter Wheel Alignment Master Technician 1986

[Tim Donahoe]

What's in my head is that I don't need a four-wheel alignment. The front end alignment is all I need.

Tim
_________________
Let's do the Time Warp again!

Richard O'Brien

[Volks Wagen]

[miller0358]

I've also been told that on a super you should have a full tank of gas and add your weight under the front hood if you can't sit in the car for the alignment. It makes a big difference in the stance of the car for adjustment. I put a couple of bags of cement in the front and full tank. I don't know how it would handle not doing this, but handles pretty good doing it.m Jeff

[Multi69s]

When I do an alignment, I always do a four wheel, in my case, it doesn't cost much more. The tricky part is finding a shop that can do our old cars.
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69 road Bug 2110
73 Squareback - 2L, T4, Automatic W/ AC
Gone, but many fond memories 69 Baja Bug 2010 - 5 Rib Bus Transaxle
Gone but not forgotten 72 Baja Bug 2010
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AC in Squareback https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...highlight=

[air-h2o-air]

4 wheel, if not your (pardon the french) your half azzing it....rear is adjustable, and rear can create a tendency to drive the car left or right...google "thrust angle"...read what it does and how it can effect the driving/handling and you will see why you need it.

If all the past alignments did not include rear adjustment, or even rear readings...you did NOT get a proper alignment (IMO)

[Mr.Duncan]

Tim-

I normally get the "life-time alignment" (for as long as you own the car) from Firestone for $130, it pays for itself after 2 alignments.

And, I do sit there, and watch them.

Last time, they almost aligned it as a Standard Beetle, with front torsion bars (not the super beetle)

Also, they had trouble seeing the adjusting slots on the rear spring plates (they were covered up by the bolts)

You kinda have to sit, and tell them what to do with these older cars sometimes.
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[VWCOOL]

[VWCOOL]

post delete

[VWCOOL]

[mark tucker]

I have a friend whoose bug dog tracks about 4" or more. Ive seen cars out of wack that dontn wear the tires.these are light and may not wear the skiny tires so you can tell it's off. but yes it should be checked ad adjusted if they can properly do it. the wider the tire the more importaint it is. what you dont need to happen is it to drive just fine then hit the breaks in the rain and WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE. you can also look at it with you eyes and possiably see it's out.(if you know what your looking at it's eazy to see in most cases) you probably should inspect the bushings first and replace them if needed(rubber or poly torsion/ swing plate bushings) the outers are eazy to change, inners a bit more diffacult.

[Danwvw]

It's not like anyone here knows what to do and spelled it out for us is it?
I was wanting to get my new to me 1960 VW beetle handling right and have yet to do some pretty basic things like new tie rod ends and rear end bushings but after setting my front toe-in I measured the distance between the front and rear axles after trying to drive it as straight as possible before stopping and just jacking up the side I wanted to loosen those 3 big axle tube nuts on and kicking the axle housing forward to match the other side. But it's going to take another try because it's still about 3/16" longer on the passenger side. Was 3/8" though.
But what else can be done?
On a early bug the torsion bar suspension tucks the rear wheels in anytime the car goes over a dip in the road surface even at highway speeds. Sometimes it feels like the car takes a new heading coming out of a dip or bump if the lay of road on a curve is weird.

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1960 Beetle And 1679cc DP W-100 & Dual Zeniths!

[Volks Wagen]

[Buggeee]

From Bentley Orange, 12. Rear Wheel Alignment: Rear wheel alignment must be performed whenever you replace parts that directly affect the adjustment. These parts include the diagonal arm, diagonal arm bushings, spring plates, and torsion bar. Rear wheel alignment should also be carefully checked following accident damage to the rear or side of the car.

Based on that, my motivation for a rear alignment would be a lack of knowledge of prior owner work and maintenance, as well as the wear of bushings and sag of torsion bars over a 40 year period.

From Bentley Orange, 4 Strut Front Suspension 3. Front Wheel Alignment: The following preparatory steps are essential to accurate alignment measurements:... (2) Inflate the tires to specifications and unload the car except for the spare wheel and full fuel tank. Then jounce the car several times and let it settle into it's normal position.

It seems the specified numbers already contemplate the unladen vehicle.

Happy jouncing.
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Big Time 1988 Vanagon Westy
Release the Krankenwagen! 1966 Sportsmobile Camper
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