73 rear engine mounts/ vibration?

[blues90]

This car has always had a vibration even with a rebuilt engine and auto trans both I rebuilt. The engine running I don't see it shaking and this vibration has been there since I got this car in 85.

It only does it with the auto trans in drive with my foot on the brake. As soon as it take my foot off the brake it stops. Mainly I can hear it and feel it in the right door window and also the door itself even though the door closes fully and the weather strip is in good shape. If I press on the door it continues the only way to stop the rattle is press on the lower end of the glass inside and of course the lower seal is hard . The glass fits well in the felt channel.

Even before I changed all the FI seals and all else it didn't change plus it starts out on the right side yet after I drive about 30 minutes the left side glass and door vibrates to the point I can see the entire left door vibrate mostly by the vent window yet it's all tight and the door shuts snug and the weather strip is good.

Point is lately it's worse. I know there are 5 sub frame mounts yet they are there and not cracked or loose.

I look at the rear engine hanger mounts and they have cracks and look a bit flattened . I got a set of good used ones that look much better years ago as well as a front auto trans mount.

I don't expect an answer since I can only express this in words.

I thought of just changing the rear mounts and wondered if it's possible they might be the cause since it's been getting worse. I brough this up to Jim Adney , he said he has a calif car and it does the same thing don't know what year it is . he brought up the sub frame mounts and how calif cars rubber dies and become hard and cracks.

I stuck card board between the right glass and the inner wiper and it stops the rattle that drives me nuts, can't hear the engine over it . The left side the wiper in and out no longer have the lip so the glass does not make noise yet I still hear it. I haven't changed the mounts since they look like a job the right not so much the left has the MPS right near it.

I don't care about the glass wipers it's the insane noise.

Any suggestions ? I would change the front trans mount yet you can't get it out without shifting the drive train back at least an inch or more. I thought of removing the 4 rear hanger bolts and hang the engine bar with S hooks to the old mounts then support the trans and see if I can force the drive train back just enough to get the trans mount out . I don't want to pull the entire drive train . I would need to free the heater tubes to the ex changers . The auto trans mount is not broken so I don't feel it's the cause.

There was only one time I recall it not vibrating and it was years ago with the original engine and muffler and it was a damp rainy day . It's been real humid here all summer and that does not help.

[KTPhil]

My '71 auto also vibrated, including rattling the roll-up windows.

I ignorantly fought it with parts for a while (hard since I was on a severe budget and this was pre-internet days), and never really got rid of it (and lost the car in a divorce), though a really careful tune-up helped. I may have still had some vacuum leaks, and compression was not great.

But I found that if I pinched the felt channels more closed, just in a couple of points along its length, it stopped the rattle without adding significant drag to rolling the window up or down. There is also a rattle in the door card that VW stopped with a piece of leatherette where it hooks to the door; if missing, you get more rattles.

I suspect that once you solve your mixture problems it will vibrate less and return to a tolerable level, especially with these rattle tweaks.

[Tram]

FWIW, that seems to be a common issue with Automatics. Sometimes setting the idle speed a tad higher fixes it. Do you have a gauge set with which you can test modulating pressures per Bentley? I've seen modulating pressure being too high do this as well.

For it to be a rubber mount issue you need to be squashed SO flat that you are metal on metal somewhere or the rubber is totally hard as a rock, and even if this WERE the case it would transfer noise and vibration throughout the range, not just at idle with foot on the brake.

In 44 years of dinking with these cars I have never actually SEEN a "bad" sub frame mount.
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[blues90]

The only time it was less was when I had the idle drop on it's own to 700 RPM this only happened before I adjusted the MPS or after I adjusted it and the car sat for about 30 minutes and the temp sensors would change the mix. I still haven't figured that one out. I checked both cold 70*F TS1 was 306 OHM and TS2 was 2.74K ohm checked after 30 minutes and TS1 was 67.3 and TS2 was 249 ohm so TS2 went richer and TS1 leaner.I expected TS1 to drop because or no air flow with air flow it was 120 ohm. I didn't expect TS2 to raise so much.

I can live with the short time it takes for the idle to come back, what drives me insane is the damn rattle and what's worse now both windows do this. If I push on the doors that does not change it at all.

I had the trans modulator set up with gauges by the trans fellow at ford when I worked there after I rebuilt the trans in 2002 I didn't have gauges to do this.

I was thinking of the engine mounts only because in my head it seems when it's idling in drive stepping on the brake the trans is trying to move the car and the brake is holding it back once I let off it moves the car taking that load off . I tried with one foot on the brake and raising the RPM up with my other foot on the gas and it's worse. I'm not sure how much load the trans has on it while driving like climbing a hill the trans will downshift. This is just in my mind a theory which very well may be as far off as it can get. I noticed that some times even when I take my foot off the gas that the vibration does not always go away until it's moving along for a few seconds , this was never the case before, since it's now affects both sides like it's gotten worse yet it does not do this all the time. I can also feel the vibration in the left window behind the door. Before the rubber window wiper lips fell off the left door it only made the rattle on the right.

As far as the sub frame mounts if I recall when Mulit69's installed the T-4 he made solid aluminum mounts to lower the sub frame or raise the body for carb clearance.

I always liked the 4 speed standard trans better , never cared for auto trans , of all the cars and vans I've owned this and 2 others were auto trans . To bad VW decided not to include the clutch tube in the auto trans pan and sub frame. I'm not even sure if the shifter rod would fit . I know there is a cover under the tunnel that looks like where the coupling would be. As if I'm about to even attempt changing it over.

It also appears the oil cooler seals are leaking a bit. I wiped all around it when I had the runners off and can see it slightly wet there again . I had a feeling they were yet just didn't want to deal with all the extra work moving to old harness and pulling the left tin off. Sort of wish I had now. The old should of could of.

[Mr.Duncan]

For what it's worth, my 1971 Automatic FI does the exact same thing vibration wise.

Only when stopped, in drive, with my foot on the brake.

All transmission pressures are adjusted per the Bentley spec.
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(Owner) www.vintagecarleds.com

Red 1971 Squareback Thread
Red 1966 Beetle Thread
---------------------------------------------------
1971 Green Super Beetle (sold)
1966 Ghia (sold)
1971 Blue Super Beetle (sold)
1966 Java Green Std Beetle (sold)
1971 Red Squareback (sold)
1966 Red Beetle

[blues90]

There has to be a solution to at least stop this. I can't imagine when new these cars did this. I never drove a new one. If I can move the glass then the felt channel has to be worn. I had a difficult time rolling up the drivers window and when near the top it would pop , I removed the regulator and found two teeth were almost gone so I had a spare L & R from the 72 and replaced it and lubed the bottom of the channel with silicone paste yet now the entire door vibrates and it's not loose and it does not rattle probably because the wiper lip is gone that's what it rattles against on the right side. I noticed on the left side when I had the glass out to replace the regulator that when those wipers get old and hard they actually wear into the glass. And on a 73 the doors have this enormous impact bar which makes removing the glass even more difficult. I didn't have to remove the glass yet I couldn't get the reg slide on the glass clean and lubed proper at some point some one used white lithium grease and it was impossible to clean it with the glass installed.

I have to do something, I can't take this rattle a second longer 50 % of my driving I'm sitting at a stop listening to this. Maybe I'll try to pinch the felt a bit like Phil did.

[Tram]

[blues90]

[blues90]

I bent the channel felt a bit can't rattle the glass now.

I took photo's of the mounts in the car compared to the newer ones .

Here is the right then the left and then the new ones . I jacking up the right side at the hanger and the top washer just came up from the rubber where it is sunk in in the photo.

[Mr.Duncan]

So where in the world did you get new rear mounts from?
_________________
(Owner) www.vintagecarleds.com

Red 1971 Squareback Thread
Red 1966 Beetle Thread
---------------------------------------------------
1971 Green Super Beetle (sold)
1966 Ghia (sold)
1971 Blue Super Beetle (sold)
1966 Java Green Std Beetle (sold)
1971 Red Squareback (sold)
1966 Red Beetle

[blues90]

[Bobnotch]

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[Bobnotch]

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[Tram]

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