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The Big Cheese
Samba Member
Joined: May 04, 2019
Posts: 72
Location: Annapolis, MD
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 Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 6:02 am Post subject: Cracked Seam -- Fluid Film, Wax, Sealer + Paint ?? |
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| I have several cracked seams that I plan on tackling this winter using the preferred method -- sand blast, treat, reseal, repaint, etc. However, I would like to protect my seams from the elements until I have the time to do it right. I've been reading all the forums and it seams that everyone has a different opinion on a quick preventive / solution for cracked seams. Should I put fluid film, wax, or panel sealer + paint on the cracked seams? If you recommend a method then please post the product you used. |
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dobryan 
Samba Member
Joined: March 24, 2006
Posts: 17326
Location: Brookeville, MD
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danfromsyr
Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15411
Location: Syracuse, NY
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| Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 6:38 am Post subject: Re: Cracked Seam -- Fluid Film, Wax, Sealer + Paint ?? |
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I agree, no wax no oils
maybe if you want to keep the rain and water out some clear sealing tape.
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MarkWard
Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005
Posts: 19111
Location: Retired South Florida
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| Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 6:48 am Post subject: Re: Cracked Seam -- Fluid Film, Wax, Sealer + Paint ?? |
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| Related question. If you media blast the seams, how the heck do you get all the media out of the seams when you are done? We have a media blaster cabinet and you have to wash with soap and water to remove the imbedded media just so it will take a coat of spray paint. |
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Steve M.
Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2013
Posts: 6933
Location: Fort Lauderdale, Fl.
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| Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:09 am Post subject: Re: Cracked Seam -- Fluid Film, Wax, Sealer + Paint ?? |
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What you might think about doing and this is open for feedback!
From what I have seen of the seams I have opened, the seam sealer does not get all the way down into the bottom of the seam so there is room for liquid to flow underneath the sealant.
At the top of the vertical seam use a small drill or pick to open the seam so you can stick a small syringe into the seam.
Get some OSPHO in a small syringe and slowly squirt/dribble it in so it flows under the seam seal.
If the OSPHO in the syringe is disappearing it is going somewhere! Check underneath at the bottom of the seam to see if it is in fact running all the way down the inside and out.
Seal up the opening at the top.
NOTE:WEAR SAFETY GLASSES AS YOU CAN GET "SQUIRTBACK' FROM THE SYRINGE.
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This free advice is worth exactly what you paid for it.
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Last edited by Steve M. on Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:26 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Steve M.
Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2013
Posts: 6933
Location: Fort Lauderdale, Fl.
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| Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:23 am Post subject: Re: Cracked Seam -- Fluid Film, Wax, Sealer + Paint ?? |
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| MarkWard wrote: |
| Related question. If you media blast the seams, how the heck do you get all the media out of the seams when you are done? We have a media blaster cabinet and you have to wash with soap and water to remove the imbedded media just so it will take a coat of spray paint. |
I spray Brake Cleaner spray into the seam starting at top and push towards bottom to flush it before I apply the OSPHO to it. Then seal it after using a nylon toothbrush to remove the OSPHO white powder if it creates the white powder.
_________________
This free advice is worth exactly what you paid for it.
There are seven days in a week. Someday is not one of them. |
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The Big Cheese
Samba Member
Joined: May 04, 2019
Posts: 72
Location: Annapolis, MD
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| Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:29 am Post subject: Re: Cracked Seam -- Fluid Film, Wax, Sealer + Paint ?? |
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| dobryan wrote: |
| If you are going to do them this winter I would not do anything now. Introducing any kind of wax/oil/whatever into the seam will only make it harder to have anything adhere later when you clean them out. Nothing really bad will happen between now and this winter... |
This might be a dumb question but wouldn't rain getting into the seams make the cracks worse and rust the seams? |
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dobryan
Samba Member
Joined: March 24, 2006
Posts: 17326
Location: Brookeville, MD
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| Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:54 am Post subject: Re: Cracked Seam -- Fluid Film, Wax, Sealer + Paint ?? |
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| The Big Cheese wrote: |
| dobryan wrote: |
| If you are going to do them this winter I would not do anything now. Introducing any kind of wax/oil/whatever into the seam will only make it harder to have anything adhere later when you clean them out. Nothing really bad will happen between now and this winter... |
This might be a dumb question but wouldn't rain getting into the seams make the cracks worse and rust the seams? |
In a perfect sense yes, but this is a 35 year old vehicle and a few more months is but a heartbeat to it.
_________________
Dave O
'87 Westy w/ 2010 Subaru EJ25 (Vanaru) and Peloquin TBD
"To travel hopefully is a better thing than to arrive." Robert Louis Stevenson
MD>Canada>AK>WA>OR>CA>AZ>UT>WY>SD
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=620646
Building a bus for travel in Europe (euroBus)
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=695371
The Western Syncro build
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=746794 |
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jlrftype7
Samba Member
Joined: July 24, 2018
Posts: 4794
Location: Chicago
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| Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:20 am Post subject: Re: Cracked Seam -- Fluid Film, Wax, Sealer + Paint ?? |
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| MarkWard wrote: |
| Related question. If you media blast the seams, how the heck do you get all the media out of the seams when you are done? We have a media blaster cabinet and you have to wash with soap and water to remove the imbedded media just so it will take a coat of spray paint. |
I used Soda Blasting on my worst seams. It's so fine in size compared to Regular Glass Beads or Sand that plain compressed air, followed by Den. Alcohol removed any remaining.
_________________
'68 Westy- my first VW and vehicle/Bus- long gone.- sold it to a traveling Swiss couple....
'67 Type 3 Fastback, my 2nd car- gone
'69 Semi-Auto Stick Shift Beetle-gone
2017 MINI Coopers, our current DDs
‘84 Tin Top - Hilga....Auto |
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The Big Cheese
Samba Member
Joined: May 04, 2019
Posts: 72
Location: Annapolis, MD
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| Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:21 am Post subject: Re: Cracked Seam -- Fluid Film, Wax, Sealer + Paint ?? |
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| dobryan wrote: |
| The Big Cheese wrote: |
| dobryan wrote: |
| If you are going to do them this winter I would not do anything now. Introducing any kind of wax/oil/whatever into the seam will only make it harder to have anything adhere later when you clean them out. Nothing really bad will happen between now and this winter... |
This might be a dumb question but wouldn't rain getting into the seams make the cracks worse and rust the seams? |
In a perfect sense yes, but this is a 35 year old vehicle and a few more months is but a heartbeat to it. |
Very true but I'm taking a trip for a couple weeks and will probably experience rain which this van has not seen in a very long time. Is there anything I could do to help prevent further damage? |
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dobryan
Samba Member
Joined: March 24, 2006
Posts: 17326
Location: Brookeville, MD
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| Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:25 am Post subject: Re: Cracked Seam -- Fluid Film, Wax, Sealer + Paint ?? |
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| The Big Cheese wrote: |
| dobryan wrote: |
| The Big Cheese wrote: |
| dobryan wrote: |
| If you are going to do them this winter I would not do anything now. Introducing any kind of wax/oil/whatever into the seam will only make it harder to have anything adhere later when you clean them out. Nothing really bad will happen between now and this winter... |
This might be a dumb question but wouldn't rain getting into the seams make the cracks worse and rust the seams? |
In a perfect sense yes, but this is a 35 year old vehicle and a few more months is but a heartbeat to it. |
Very true but I'm taking a trip for a couple weeks and will probably experience rain which this van has not seen in a very long time. Is there anything I could do to help prevent further damage? |
Rain will not hurt it. You'd not hesitate to wash it right? No real difference. Enjoy your trip and do not stress over this issue. 
_________________
Dave O
'87 Westy w/ 2010 Subaru EJ25 (Vanaru) and Peloquin TBD
"To travel hopefully is a better thing than to arrive." Robert Louis Stevenson
MD>Canada>AK>WA>OR>CA>AZ>UT>WY>SD
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=620646
Building a bus for travel in Europe (euroBus)
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=695371
The Western Syncro build
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=746794 |
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jlrftype7
Samba Member
Joined: July 24, 2018
Posts: 4794
Location: Chicago
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| Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:30 am Post subject: Re: Cracked Seam -- Fluid Film, Wax, Sealer + Paint ?? |
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| The Big Cheese wrote: |
| dobryan wrote: |
| The Big Cheese wrote: |
| dobryan wrote: |
| If you are going to do them this winter I would not do anything now. Introducing any kind of wax/oil/whatever into the seam will only make it harder to have anything adhere later when you clean them out. Nothing really bad will happen between now and this winter... |
This might be a dumb question but wouldn't rain getting into the seams make the cracks worse and rust the seams? |
In a perfect sense yes, but this is a 35 year old vehicle and a few more months is but a heartbeat to it. |
Very true but I'm taking a trip for a couple weeks and will probably experience rain which this van has not seen in a very long time. Is there anything I could do to help prevent further damage? |
Take a Foam Brush, 1" to 2" max size, dip the Brush into a small cup filled with Rust Converter, then apply the Converter to your Seams. If you get Converter on your Paint outside the seams, wipe it off right away with a soft rag that's wet with Mineral Spirits, Naptha, or Denatured Alcohol. Don't let the Converter dry on hot paint from the Sun.
Doing this would still allow you to dig out the old sealer later on and not have the adhesion issues of Wax or Oil when redoing the Seam Sealer.
_________________
'68 Westy- my first VW and vehicle/Bus- long gone.- sold it to a traveling Swiss couple....
'67 Type 3 Fastback, my 2nd car- gone
'69 Semi-Auto Stick Shift Beetle-gone
2017 MINI Coopers, our current DDs
‘84 Tin Top - Hilga....Auto
Last edited by jlrftype7 on Thu Sep 12, 2019 11:20 am; edited 1 time in total |
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dobryan
Samba Member
Joined: March 24, 2006
Posts: 17326
Location: Brookeville, MD
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The Big Cheese
Samba Member
Joined: May 04, 2019
Posts: 72
Location: Annapolis, MD
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| Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 12:33 pm Post subject: Re: Cracked Seam -- Fluid Film, Wax, Sealer + Paint ?? |
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| jlrftype7 wrote: |
| The Big Cheese wrote: |
| dobryan wrote: |
| The Big Cheese wrote: |
| dobryan wrote: |
| If you are going to do them this winter I would not do anything now. Introducing any kind of wax/oil/whatever into the seam will only make it harder to have anything adhere later when you clean them out. Nothing really bad will happen between now and this winter... |
This might be a dumb question but wouldn't rain getting into the seams make the cracks worse and rust the seams? |
In a perfect sense yes, but this is a 35 year old vehicle and a few more months is but a heartbeat to it. |
Very true but I'm taking a trip for a couple weeks and will probably experience rain which this van has not seen in a very long time. Is there anything I could do to help prevent further damage? |
Take a Foam Brush, 1" to 2" max size, dip the Brush into a small cup filled with Rust Converter, then apply the Converter to your Seams. If you get Converter on your Paint outside the seams, wipe it off right away with a soft rag that's wet with Mineral Spirits, Naptha, or Denatured Alcohol. Don't let the Converter dry on hot paint from the Sun.
Doing this would still allow you to dig out the old sealer later on and not have the adhesion issues of Wax or Oil when redoing the Seam Sealer. |
Thanks for the tip. Do you recommend a specific rust convertor? |
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jlrftype7
Samba Member
Joined: July 24, 2018
Posts: 4794
Location: Chicago
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| Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 12:46 pm Post subject: Re: Cracked Seam -- Fluid Film, Wax, Sealer + Paint ?? |
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| The Big Cheese wrote: |
| jlrftype7 wrote: |
| The Big Cheese wrote: |
| dobryan wrote: |
| The Big Cheese wrote: |
| dobryan wrote: |
| If you are going to do them this winter I would not do anything now. Introducing any kind of wax/oil/whatever into the seam will only make it harder to have anything adhere later when you clean them out. Nothing really bad will happen between now and this winter... |
This might be a dumb question but wouldn't rain getting into the seams make the cracks worse and rust the seams? |
In a perfect sense yes, but this is a 35 year old vehicle and a few more months is but a heartbeat to it. |
Very true but I'm taking a trip for a couple weeks and will probably experience rain which this van has not seen in a very long time. Is there anything I could do to help prevent further damage? |
Take a Foam Brush, 1" to 2" max size, dip the Brush into a small cup filled with Rust Converter, then apply the Converter to your Seams. If you get Converter on your Paint outside the seams, wipe it off right away with a soft rag that's wet with Mineral Spirits, Naptha, or Denatured Alcohol. Don't let the Converter dry on hot paint from the Sun.
Doing this would still allow you to dig out the old sealer later on and not have the adhesion issues of Wax or Oil when redoing the Seam Sealer. |
Thanks for the tip. Do you recommend a specific rust convertor? |
Not really, I tend to get Permatex from my local NAPA because they've got 16 oz bottles of it versus little 8 oz bottles at other places of some other brand.
_________________
'68 Westy- my first VW and vehicle/Bus- long gone.- sold it to a traveling Swiss couple....
'67 Type 3 Fastback, my 2nd car- gone
'69 Semi-Auto Stick Shift Beetle-gone
2017 MINI Coopers, our current DDs
‘84 Tin Top - Hilga....Auto |
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Vanagon Nut
Samba Member
Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10524
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 1:48 pm Post subject: Re: Cracked Seam -- Fluid Film, Wax, Sealer + Paint ?? |
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| dobryan wrote: |
| If you are going to do them this winter I would not do anything now. Introducing any kind of wax/oil/whatever into the seam will only make it harder to have anything adhere later when you clean them out. |
x2
Good intentions and general lack of skills allowed Fluid Film that was only applied to the panels to creep in and out past new 3M sealant and touch up paint; that FF s**t does what it claims! I am loath to think what I'll have to do, if I can, to do that job over so new sealant adheres. Especially at that "hip" part of the seam near a tack weld. That said, the sealant is not peeling off of anything and I'm quite sure that seam isn't rusting. 
Neil.
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1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
(VW Gas I4)
1988 Westy DIY 50º ABA
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dobryan
Samba Member
Joined: March 24, 2006
Posts: 17326
Location: Brookeville, MD
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