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remraf
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Joined: February 25, 2007
Posts: 291
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 Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2022 7:01 am Post subject: GoWesty NORRA 500 hybrid EV Vanagon |
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Noticed this today when I went to gowesty's site.
https://gowesty.com/pages/norra-500
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Now we're off to the shorter NORRA 500 (also in Baja) to test our latest engineering project: a ridiculously fun gasoline-hybrid contraption we've dubbed Evan GoWattsy. We'll be competing in the new Hybrid Class alongside our second race van we've entered once again in the RV Class.
Tell me more about Evan GoWattsy!
Evan (formerly known as the Lemons van) has seen quite a life. It started out as a 2WD flower delivery van turned track racer, then we converted it to a desert-racing Syncro, and now it is living its third incarnation as a hybrid E-Syncro. It features one of our 2700cc waterboxers out back, and a super-slick electric drive from Electric GT powering the front. Both systems can run independent of each other or simultaneously for a wickedly raucous all-wheel-drive experience. Dipping our toes into the gas/electric hybrid space is our first proof-of-concept step toward eventually offering a kit to electrify any 2WD Vanagon for added power, reliability, and on-demand all-wheel-drive. Interested? |
Interesting, wonder what they would do as a kit for 2WD's? Manufacture syncro uprights? One of the pics (low resolution) shows the battery behind front seats.
*admin delete if this is a duplicate, searched didn't find any mention
Last edited by remraf on Fri Sep 30, 2022 3:23 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Syncronoid
Samba Member
Joined: January 21, 2012
Posts: 1120
Location: Stanford, CA and Bend, OR
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| Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2022 7:26 am Post subject: Re: Gowesty NORRA 500 hybrid |
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They had some version of Evan at Syncrofest this year.
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'90 Syncro Westy w/GW2.5L |
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16CVs 
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2004
Posts: 4203
Location: Redwood City, California
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| Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2022 7:56 am Post subject: Re: Gowesty NORRA 500 hybrid |
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I drove this bus Van/Hybrid and It was very BETA with the lead guy in the passenger seat with a lap top.
Super torquey and power that is just NOW, the integration was amazing. From what I was told the idea is custom front subframe that will bolt into a 2WD and give it a bolt in 4WD conversion.
While driving it the ride along guy was telling me at some rocky and steep points to just go into it full power, I backed off the throttle. I think this will be a winner when it comes out. I don't know the price point but up against building a Syncro F/R box and everything else it'll be wash.
Stacy
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1987 Syncro Westfalia Triple knob (bastard)
1989 Syncro Tristar Triple knob "Swedish"
2013 Jetta Hybrid a true "Zwitter"
Samba member # 14980
Call anytime number 650 722 4914 .
Keep Your van running and upkept tastefully for the love of the hobby.
Don't let your van end up in an "abortions" thread. |
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shagginwagon83
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Joined: February 07, 2016
Posts: 4285
Location: SWVA
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| Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2022 8:06 am Post subject: Re: Gowesty NORRA 500 hybrid |
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Sounds awesome. Love the idea of custom front subframe
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"Jo Ann" - '83.5 Westfalia EJ22e w/Peloquin
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Last edited by shagginwagon83 on Fri Sep 30, 2022 6:29 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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snoop
Samba Member
Joined: June 22, 2007
Posts: 371
Location: SW Oregon
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| Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2022 1:41 pm Post subject: Re: Gowesty NORRA 500 hybrid |
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I'll be an early adopter.
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hdenter
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Joined: October 14, 2008
Posts: 2935
Location: San Luis Obispo, CA
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| Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2022 1:46 pm Post subject: Re: Gowesty NORRA 500 hybrid |
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I would go in a different direction for the engine. I would build a 1600cc engine with a decently high compression ratio. Then rig the front electric motor to some sort of a load sensor on the gas engine. When you are cruising at flat speed with high vacuum, gas only. When you need more power and MAP goes down, kick in the electric motor. Or vise versa, run electric full time and kick in gas motor when necessary to help the electric. If going full time electric, I'd go even smaller on the gas motor, 1200cc.
Hans
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'84 sunroof vanagon
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remraf
Samba Member
Joined: February 25, 2007
Posts: 291
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| Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2022 3:23 pm Post subject: Re: Gowesty NORRA 500 hybrid |
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| 16CVs wrote: |
I drove this bus Van/Hybrid and It was very BETA with the lead guy in the passenger seat with a lap top.
Super torquey and power that is just NOW, the integration was amazing. From what I was told the idea is custom front subframe that will bolt into a 2WD and give it a bolt in 4WD conversion.
While driving it the ride along guy was telling me at some rocky and steep points to just go into it full power, I backed off the throttle. I think this will be a winner when it comes out. I don't know the price point but up against building a Syncro F/R box and everything else it'll be wash.
Stacy |
Curious, how were the engine and electric motor integrated if at all? Was the electric drive just a manual toggle? Did they mention whether they plan to have them work in an integrated way?
I agree with hdenter, seems like the goal would be to lessen power output requirements for the ICE. Given that van is for NORRA it probably makes sense to leave the large one in though.
Seems like gowesty's engine efforts are usually focused on California. Wonder if California's plans to offer rebates for ev conversions of older cars factors in? Doubt a hybrid would count and 2k ain't that big a handout  .
https://www.theautopian.com/california-may-soon-pa...lows-suit/ |
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Mateo83
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Joined: September 14, 2021
Posts: 645
Location: Lodi, CA
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| Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2022 3:31 pm Post subject: Re: Gowesty NORRA 500 hybrid |
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| remraf wrote: |
| 16CVs wrote: |
I drove this bus Van/Hybrid and It was very BETA with the lead guy in the passenger seat with a lap top.
Super torquey and power that is just NOW, the integration was amazing. From what I was told the idea is custom front subframe that will bolt into a 2WD and give it a bolt in 4WD conversion.
While driving it the ride along guy was telling me at some rocky and steep points to just go into it full power, I backed off the throttle. I think this will be a winner when it comes out. I don't know the price point but up against building a Syncro F/R box and everything else it'll be wash.
Stacy |
Curious, how were the engine and electric motor integrated if at all? Was the electric drive just a manual toggle? Did they mention whether they plan to have them work in an integrated way?
I agree with hdenter, seems like the goal would be to lessen power output requirements for the ICE. Given that van is for NORRA it probably makes sense to leave the large one in though.
Seems like gowesty's engine efforts are usually focused on California. Wonder if California's plans to offer rebates for ev conversions of older cars factors in? Doubt a hybrid would count and 2k ain't that big a handout .
https://www.theautopian.com/california-may-soon-pa...lows-suit/ |
I'd read the fine print on that bill if it passes. Plus $2k would barely cover a rear drive motor
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remraf
Samba Member
Joined: February 25, 2007
Posts: 291
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| Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2022 3:44 pm Post subject: Re: Gowesty NORRA 500 hybrid ev Vanagon |
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| Yeah, 2k is a joke. It's interesting they chose electricgt as a partner. They have nice products but are definitely on the pricier end. Would be nice if this idea was extended to using salvage model 3 motors/batteries etc. |
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WillRB
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Joined: October 23, 2020
Posts: 225
Location: Ohio
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| Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2022 3:51 pm Post subject: Re: Gowesty NORRA 500 hybrid ev Vanagon |
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Oh my…  |
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Mateo83
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Joined: September 14, 2021
Posts: 645
Location: Lodi, CA
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| Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2022 3:54 pm Post subject: Re: Gowesty NORRA 500 hybrid ev Vanagon |
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| remraf wrote: |
| Yeah, 2k is a joke. It's interesting they chose electricgt as a partner. They have nice products but are definitely on the pricier end. Would be nice if this idea was extended to using salvage model 3 motors/batteries etc. |
Usually, for rebates, it has to be new parts from certain manufacturers, which sucks.
I struggle with how a model 3 battery pack would fit under a van, I guess its a complete roller pan swap
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remraf
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Joined: February 25, 2007
Posts: 291
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| Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2022 3:58 pm Post subject: Re: Gowesty NORRA 500 hybrid ev Vanagon |
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| Mateo83 wrote: |
| remraf wrote: |
| Yeah, 2k is a joke. It's interesting they chose electricgt as a partner. They have nice products but are definitely on the pricier end. Would be nice if this idea was extended to using salvage model 3 motors/batteries etc. |
Usually, for rebates, it has to be new parts from certain manufacturers, which sucks.
I struggle with how a model 3 battery pack would fit under a van, I guess its a complete roller pan swap |
I didn't mean the whole model 3 pack. People are repackaging the modules into smaller packs etc.
It looks like gowesty is using this system from electricgt. Starts around 37k!!
https://electricgt.com/shop/gte-173-e-crate-system/
Electricgt looks like they actually repackage Tesla modules for their battery packs. |
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16CVs
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Joined: February 22, 2004
Posts: 4203
Location: Redwood City, California
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| Posted: Sun Oct 02, 2022 12:03 am Post subject: Re: Gowesty NORRA 500 hybrid ev Vanagon |
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I believe that it is integrated into their in house Injection system. I would bet that it could be adapted with an AT as well.
I tell ya, I had a big grin on my face after driving it. There were no knobs to pull, just point it and press the pedal. I would imagine that after a while you will not need the passenger to be sitting there with a lap top going.
I had driven that same van on the road pre C19 with their big motor and injection system and it was a gas. Leave it to the guys at GW to re invent the Syncro.
Stacy
_________________
1987 Syncro Westfalia Triple knob (bastard)
1989 Syncro Tristar Triple knob "Swedish"
2013 Jetta Hybrid a true "Zwitter"
Samba member # 14980
Call anytime number 650 722 4914 .
Keep Your van running and upkept tastefully for the love of the hobby.
Don't let your van end up in an "abortions" thread. |
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Mateo83
Samba Member
Joined: September 14, 2021
Posts: 645
Location: Lodi, CA
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| Posted: Mon Oct 03, 2022 9:42 am Post subject: Re: Gowesty NORRA 500 hybrid ev Vanagon |
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| remraf wrote: |
| Mateo83 wrote: |
| remraf wrote: |
| Yeah, 2k is a joke. It's interesting they chose electricgt as a partner. They have nice products but are definitely on the pricier end. Would be nice if this idea was extended to using salvage model 3 motors/batteries etc. |
Usually, for rebates, it has to be new parts from certain manufacturers, which sucks.
I struggle with how a model 3 battery pack would fit under a van, I guess its a complete roller pan swap |
I didn't mean the whole model 3 pack. People are repackaging the modules into smaller packs etc.
It looks like gowesty is using this system from electricgt. Starts around 37k!!
https://electricgt.com/shop/gte-173-e-crate-system/
Electricgt looks like they actually repackage Tesla modules for their battery packs. |
Starting at $37,000?! Not including installation.
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remraf
Samba Member
Joined: February 25, 2007
Posts: 291
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| Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2022 5:06 pm Post subject: Re: Gowesty NORRA 500 hybrid ev Vanagon |
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| Mateo83 wrote: |
| remraf wrote: |
| Mateo83 wrote: |
| remraf wrote: |
| Yeah, 2k is a joke. It's interesting they chose electricgt as a partner. They have nice products but are definitely on the pricier end. Would be nice if this idea was extended to using salvage model 3 motors/batteries etc. |
Usually, for rebates, it has to be new parts from certain manufacturers, which sucks.
I struggle with how a model 3 battery pack would fit under a van, I guess its a complete roller pan swap |
I didn't mean the whole model 3 pack. People are repackaging the modules into smaller packs etc.
It looks like gowesty is using this system from electricgt. Starts around 37k!!
https://electricgt.com/shop/gte-173-e-crate-system/
Electricgt looks like they actually repackage Tesla modules for their battery packs. |
Starting at $37,000?! Not including installation. |
Electricgt claims their packaging, engineering etc. result in an easy clean install. Still seems like a lot of cheddar for that system. Wonder what GW's ultimate goal is, can't imagine anything close to that price plus subframe and suspension components to add drive axles etc. would be remotely affordable. |
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vanagonjr
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Joined: October 07, 2010
Posts: 3602
Location: Dartmouth, Mass.
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| Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2022 5:29 pm Post subject: Re: Gowesty NORRA 500 hybrid ev Vanagon |
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| remraf wrote: |
Electricgt claims their packaging, engineering etc. result in an easy clean install. Still seems like a lot of cheddar for that system. Wonder what GW's ultimate goal is, can't imagine anything close to that price plus subframe and suspension components to add drive axles etc. would be remotely affordable. |
They might be working together on this, perhaps. Or it could be just an easier way to prove the concept, vs spending a lot of their tech’s time to fabricate something similar - from EV west projects, it looks like 20K-25K in parts cones up pretty fast.
Just guessing here. It will be interesting to watch.
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Abscate
Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014
Posts: 23600
Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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| Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 1:13 am Post subject: Re: Gowesty NORRA 500 hybrid ev Vanagon |
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| remraf wrote: |
| Mateo83 wrote: |
| remraf wrote: |
| Mateo83 wrote: |
| remraf wrote: |
| Yeah, 2k is a joke. It's interesting they chose electricgt as a partner. They have nice products but are definitely on the pricier end. Would be nice if this idea was extended to using salvage model 3 motors/batteries etc. |
Usually, for rebates, it has to be new parts from certain manufacturers, which sucks.
I struggle with how a model 3 battery pack would fit under a van, I guess its a complete roller pan swap |
I didn't mean the whole model 3 pack. People are repackaging the modules into smaller packs etc.
It looks like gowesty is using this system from electricgt. Starts around 37k!!
https://electricgt.com/shop/gte-173-e-crate-system/
Electricgt looks like they actually repackage Tesla modules for their battery packs. |
Starting at $37,000?! Not including installation. |
Electricgt claims their packaging, engineering etc. result in an easy clean install. Still seems like a lot of cheddar for that system. Wonder what GW's ultimate goal is, can't imagine anything close to that price plus subframe and suspension components to add drive axles etc. would be remotely affordable. |
They tell you. They are exploring the market for an EV upgrade path for older cars. It’s not innovation to bolt in stuff and make an electric car, which has been done a century ago, it’s market research.
At 10k for power plant replacements it’s a total win. 20k, 30k? I’m not so sure.
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Nitramrebrab72
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Joined: November 10, 2018
Posts: 823
Location: France
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| Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 2:11 am Post subject: Re: GoWesty NORRA 500 hybrid EV Vanagon |
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I am looking at fitting 2 high torque but low powered e motors directly on syncro hubs for low speed 4wd 25mph max. All electric means high costs ,loads of battery weight then transforming the old v dub engine into a generator to be able to recharge the batteries when I get home at night lol  . |
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djkeev
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Joined: September 30, 2007
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Pchill2
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Location: Georgia
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| Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 5:34 am Post subject: Re: GoWesty NORRA 500 hybrid EV Vanagon |
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I'm curious to see some more pictures of this. With that size battery pack I would assume they are only using it when needed and not full time unless they have a generator on the engine.
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